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Old August 17th, 2012, 11:04 AM   #1
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3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Hi folks,

I know this has been the topic of previous conversations on here. This came today courtesy of a contact on CML - the CHD1812, an HDMI to SDI converter with 3D support including a frame synchroniser from German company Lynx-Technic:

LYNX Technik AG: C HD 1812

For those of us with Panasonic Z10000's this gadget opens up the possibility of hanging external video recorders (such as 2 x Atomos Samurai or in my case 2 x Hyperdeck Shuttle's) off the Z10k HDMI 1.4a output and recording full-frame 8-bit 4:2:2 left/right 3D from the camera.

The CHD 1812 also has an optical output and you can go up to 10km from the convertor to any other equipment. Also has cables to power the unit from P-Tap or XLR. Fab.

Don't know how I missed this, I checked out Lynx Technic stuff ages ago and didn't spot that this was 3D capable, just assumed it was HDMI 1.3a to SDI.

It's 720 in the UK. I haven't played with one yet but it looks like a rather interesting and useful piece of kit.

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Neil
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Old August 18th, 2012, 04:26 AM   #2
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Such a unit would have been great, if the would have added TWO hdmi inputs, allowing people from two cameras to mux the stream and record it. And if you come from Wallys like the Z10K - why is it necessary to sync that again?

I think one could use the Blackmagic Design: UltraStudio 3D for that purpose too. And could capture the footage with that unit, but you have to use thunderbolt.

I am not quite sure if the Z10K deliveres 1080 24p via hdmi - at my HDTV it shows only 1080 60i.
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Old August 21st, 2012, 12:07 PM   #3
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil Richards View Post
For those of us with Panasonic Z10000's this gadget opens up the possibility of hanging external video recorders (such as 2 x Atomos Samurai or in my case 2 x Hyperdeck Shuttle's) off the Z10k HDMI 1.4a output and recording full-frame 8-bit 4:2:2 left/right 3D from the camera.
I would love confirmation that the SDI outputs #1 and #2 can be used as left and right from a 3D HDMI source. I've been going through the documentation and cannot find specific reference to this usage.
Does anyone have one to test?
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Old August 21st, 2012, 03:59 PM   #4
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Agreed, it is a bit vague - I have had a moment of doubt and fear since I was told about it.

There is also a widget from Doremi, the H2S-30, that is also supposed to do HDMI 1.4a to HD-SDI conversion but again I've been all through the manual and I can't find this mentioned anywhere. And it's almost twice the price...

I don't have either one to try yet, I'll do some calls tomorrow and see if I can find out or if I can get one on a trial.
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Old August 22nd, 2012, 08:32 AM   #5
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

OK, so I've been in touch with Lynx-Technik in Germany directly.

The CHD-1812 converts HDMI1.4a input into side-by-side or top-bottom and outputs it to a *single* HD-SDI port. They have a firmware update coming which will handle frame-packed but it will send this down a single 3G HD-SDI output.

There are two outputs but they provide identical video streams, not split left-right. They said doing a L/R split would be a nice feature but their current hardware couldn't support it. As I did with Aja I left them with the thought that producing an adapter that does do this would be jolly good news and make a whole bunch of stereo film makers pretty happy.

I haven't found out anything more yet about the Doremi D2S-30.

Tim, have you ever spoken to Matrox about producing something like this?
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 09:44 AM   #6
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

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Originally Posted by Wolfgang Schmid View Post
I think one could use the Blackmagic Design: UltraStudio 3D for that purpose too.
I can't get Ultrastudio 3D to capture the Z10K HDMI signal, no matter what I do. As you say, the Z10K is 24P embedded in 60i (PsF). While the Blackmagic control panel allows for this, the result is that the signal from the camera blinks on and off in the capture utility monitor window.

The Sony HXR-NX3D1, which sends actual 24P, works perfectly with the Ultrastudio, by the way.

Has anyone managed to get external capture working with the Z10K??
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 04:29 PM   #7
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Only as side-by-side into a single Hyperdeck Shuttle - image quality improves but you lose the full L/R resolution.

I'm just wondering if there's a widget you could feed to 60i into first to clean this up a bit before it goes into the Ultrastudio3D.
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Old December 4th, 2012, 08:23 AM   #8
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

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Originally Posted by Neil Richards View Post
O...wondering if there's a widget you could feed to 60i into...

As fas as I can tell, 1080 24 Psf in 60i is not a mandatory HDMI 1.4a 3D frame-packed format (although my Samsung, Panasonic and LG 3DTVs can ALL display it). Strange.

I'll bug the Z10K with Ultrastudio @ Blackmagic and see what happens.
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Old December 4th, 2012, 01:35 PM   #9
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Ah - we just got the Panny Z10K working with the Ultrastudio 3D. Not sure what changed (maybe removing the HD-SDI source), but, this is what we did:

Blackmagic Control Panel:
- HDMI IN
- Enable PsF
- Default Video Standard: HD 1080i 60

Media Express Prefs
- Project Video Format: HD 1080i 59.94 3D
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Old December 4th, 2012, 02:04 PM   #10
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

That's cool David. I thought it must be possible to do that, it's the only interface out there that looks like it would and I was a bit concerned when you said it didn't work.

So we can finally record frame-packed 3D 422 from a Z10k provided we have an Ultrastudio 3D. And a thunderbolt-equipped Macbook to plug it into... hey, Santa!?
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Old December 5th, 2012, 11:02 PM   #11
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

This weekend, I'll try to get some shots comparing the in-camera recording to Ultrastudio capture and share them.
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Old December 6th, 2012, 04:51 PM   #12
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Quote:
Originally Posted by David M. Cole View Post
Ah - we just got the Panny Z10K working with the Ultrastudio 3D. Not sure what changed (maybe removing the HD-SDI source), but, this is what we did:

Blackmagic Control Panel:
- HDMI IN
- Enable PsF
- Default Video Standard: HD 1080i 60

Media Express Prefs
- Project Video Format: HD 1080i 59.94 3D
That sounds logical to me - the hdmi output from the Z10K delivers 1080 60i as side by side only, and I think that is what you capture here.

Fine, if it works. The other question is: is it really of interest to capture sbs-half? I would like to have the full resolution...
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Old December 7th, 2012, 09:16 AM   #13
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

No - the Z10K is producing a 24P FRAME-PACKED stream (full res per eye, not side-side), embedded in a 60i transport (aka PsF).
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Old December 7th, 2012, 03:26 PM   #14
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

Yes, if you connect the Z10k HDMI to a 1.4a 3D TV it outputs full res frame-packed 3D. If it's to a non-3D device e.g. HDMI 1.3 it defaults to side-by-side. This can be useful, I used it to connect to a Teradek Cube to get live sbs 3D monitoring with the Z10k on a glidecam.

Good to hear the Ultrastudio3D does the right thing :)
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Old December 8th, 2012, 04:09 AM   #15
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Re: 3D HDMI 1.4a to twin SDI converter

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Originally Posted by David M. Cole View Post
No - the Z10K is producing a 24P FRAME-PACKED stream (full res per eye, not side-side), embedded in a 60i transport (aka PsF).
There seems to exist a lot of confusion about that, other people had the opinion that it is a sbs half output.


But what is right? With my Panasonic TX-P50VT20EA, what is a 3D HDTV with 1.4a HDMI connections, I see a 3D picuture with 60i when I connect the Z10K with hdmi.

And I also see that that the HDTV switches to 3D automatically, what it does not with sbs half.

So I tend to agree that it is a frame packed stream very likely. Also the manual of the Z10K talkes about the output in full high definition with a 3D compatible HDTV (page 86 in the German version).

But the best test is here your experience. If I understand that wright, you say that you can capture 1080 24p using the hdmi connection and Ultrastudio 3D? Because in your posting I read something about 60i only?? So is it possible to capture 1080 24p in 3D or only as 1080 60i?
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