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Old December 27th, 2011, 04:26 AM   #1
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PPCS5.5+Audio mixer puzzle...

Hi,
Coming from an Avid background, but currently working on PPCS5.5 for this one particular graphics intensive project.
I'm finding it extremely difficult to mix my audio the way I want it, and would appreciate your input please.
Since PPro does not (why? oh why?) support an external audio control surface to control the audio mixer panel, I have to do it with my mouse.

Question 1: I couldn't find any 'gang tracks' option, to link all tracks that require the same automation. Do I really have to do it one track at the time?

Question 2: If Ppro really doesn't have a gang tracks function, is there any way to just copy the track keyframes from one track to the others?
(I tried doing that a various number of ways, but it seems Ppro won't let me copy them from one track to another. Please note that I'm talking about TRACK keyframes, generated by the audio mixer for volume ajustement, and not CLIP keyframes, which can be copied and pasted from the effects panel)

Question 3: If copying/pasting keyframes isn't an option, how can I make my job easier (ie: not adjusting my various audio tracks one by one)?

Question 4: Can Audition help here, knowing that I obviously need to monitor my video whilst mixing the audio tracks?


Thanx for any input!
M.C.
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Old December 27th, 2011, 10:40 AM   #2
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Re: PPCS5.5+Audio mixer puzzle...

One solution is to put the tracks you want to gang on a submix track.

Sequence > add track.

Select submix track option, change 0 to 1 in number of tracks window. This will create a new mixer channel called Submix 1 and a new audio track on the timeline.
In audio mixer, select submix instead of master from dropdown box near the bottom of each track that you want to add to the sub track. .
Put your effects and corrections on the sub track. You can create "sends" like on an audio board to send a portion of the signal to the sub track. If the effects/send is not open click on the expand triangle near the top left of channel 1, each channel will show a dropdown box where you can assign the signal to the desired output. When a send is created a new volume knob appears that lets you select how much of the signal you want to send -- it's just like a Mackie board, pretty much. Read more about it here: http://help.adobe.com/en_US/Premiere...ef7-7f23a.html

Last edited by Battle Vaughan; December 27th, 2011 at 10:52 AM. Reason: addendum
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Old December 28th, 2011, 03:00 AM   #3
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Re: PPCS5.5+Audio mixer puzzle...

Hi Battle Vaughan, and thanx for that workaround.

Unfortunately, it's not gonna work for me, as this method generates keyframes only on the submix track, and not on each audio track (which I require for later individual fine tuning).
Kind of silly that we can't gang tracks to automate them together.
Even sillier that we can't copy a set of keyframes from one track to another...

I will submit a feature request to the Adobe Team for this, and control surface support (Behringer make a small cheap one that would work wonders with Ppro)

In the meantime, is there any other solution you can think of to solve my problem?
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Old December 28th, 2011, 02:49 PM   #4
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Re: PPCS5.5+Audio mixer puzzle...

If you export to Audition, you can hold CTL+SHIFT, select any setting in the solo, mute, record, input or output functions for any track to apply them to all tracks at once, if that's any help....also, here's information on copying and pasting keyframes from one track to other tracks: http://help.adobe.com/en_US/premiere...ef7-7e55a.html

"Copy and paste keyframes in a Timeline panel
When you paste keyframes into a Timeline panel, the earliest keyframe appears at the current time and the other keyframes follow in relative order. The keyframes remain selected after pasting, so you can fine-tune their location.

You can paste keyframes only to a clip or track that displays the same property as the copied keyframes. Also, Premiere Pro can paste keyframes at the current-time indicator on only one clip or track at a time. Because the current-time indicator can span multiple video and audio tracks, Premiere Pro uses criteria in the following order to determine where to paste the keyframes:

If the current-time indicator is positioned within a selected clip, keyframes are pasted in that clip.

If audio keyframes are cut or copied, Premiere Pro pastes in the first track where it finds a corresponding effect property, looking first at a sequence’s audio tracks, then its submix tracks, and then the master track.

If none of the above conditions produces a target video or audio track that matches both the effects property and the scope (clip or track) of the cut or copied keyframes, the Paste command is unavailable. For example, if you copy audio track keyframes but the targeted audio track displays clip keyframes, the keyframes can’t be pasted."
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Old December 29th, 2011, 05:29 AM   #5
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Re: PPCS5.5+Audio mixer puzzle...

Hi Battle,
and thanks for sticking with me... :-)
Have you personnaly had any success trying to copy/paste keyframes on a different track? I for the life of me cannot get it work...
Here's what I've found out so far:


_________________You said:

"Copy and paste keyframes in a Timeline panel
When you paste keyframes into a Timeline panel, the earliest keyframe appears at the current time and the other keyframes follow in relative order. The keyframes remain selected after pasting, so you can fine-tune their location."
________________________

In my experience, one can only copy/paste keyframes IF doing so on the SAME TRACK. For instance, I can use my pen tool to select a bunch of keyframes on, say, AudioTrack001, Edit>Copy them, then move my CTI to a different location on the timeline, and paste the keyframes. This only works if copying and pasting on the same track...


________________You said:

"You can paste keyframes only to a clip or track that displays the same property as the copied keyframes. Also, Premiere Pro can paste keyframes at the current-time indicator on only one clip or track at a time. Because the current-time indicator can span multiple video and audio tracks, Premiere Pro uses criteria in the following order to determine where to paste the keyframes:

If the current-time indicator is positioned within a selected clip, keyframes are pasted in that clip.

If audio keyframes are cut or copied, Premiere Pro pastes in the first track where it finds a corresponding effect property, looking first at a sequence’s audio tracks, then its submix tracks, and then the master track.

If none of the above conditions produces a target video or audio track that matches both the effects property and the scope (clip or track) of the cut or copied keyframes, the Paste command is unavailable. For example, if you copy audio track keyframes but the targeted audio track displays clip keyframes, the keyframes can’t be pasted."
______________________


That doesn't solve my problem: I made sure times and times again that my target track was identical to my origin track, created new tracks, new projects, etc... To no avail...

Will you try something for me please:
Create a new project, insert 2 mono audio tracks and some random media on them.
Then open your audio mixer panel, set your In/Out in your timeline (otherwise, the audio mixer tool won't record), then start automating your Audio001 in your audio mixer tool (I use the 'touch' method).
This will generate some keyframes on your audio track. (Make sure your Audio track in the timeline is correctly set up to display 'track keyframes') to see them.
Grab your Pen tool, Lasso around the keyframes to select them, copy them, and try and paste them on AudioTrack002.
If you manage to do that and explain to me how, you'll be my hero :-) !

Thanx
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Old December 29th, 2011, 12:31 PM   #6
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Re: PPCS5.5+Audio mixer puzzle...

Hi, the parts within the quote marks are a quote from the Adobe help file, they're not my statements, so I expect they are accurate. I'll get back to you on your request when I get a moment....

(later) Made a quick stab at this, and like you, not finding how to copy track keyframes crated by audio mixer. However, in effects panel, keyframes there are easily copied from one effects panel to another. Be sure you are showing clip keyframes for this (right click in audio track header, select show clip keyframes ) see attached jpeg.

I could copy keyframes from the mixer on a given track and paste them elsewhere on the same track (which doesn't sound useful) but like you, can't seem to make them copy to another track, although with identical specs and identical track setup --e.g., both showing track keyframes, both showing volume. The instructions in the help file aren't real clear on this point, maybe I'm missing something.

Bottom line is, I think, the easy way for you to do what you want is to apply your keyframes in the effects panel, per clip, and copy them to your other clips one at a time. That's the best I can do, I hope someone else will weigh in, I'd like to hear some more information....
Attached Thumbnails
PPCS5.5+Audio mixer puzzle...-capture.jpg  

Last edited by Battle Vaughan; December 29th, 2011 at 04:32 PM. Reason: addendum
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