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Old May 30th, 2014, 09:01 PM   #16
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Kimery View Post
Avid didn't go subscription-only like Adobe did. Avid offers a pure subscription model, a traditional perpetual license model and a 'hybrid model'. With the hybrid model you pay full price for the program once, then pay $299 a year for upgrades. If you stop paying the $299 you keep your current version of Avid 'as is' but you don't access to any more upgrades. If you later decide you want a new version of Avid then you have to pay full price again (no upgrade discounts). Basically they've gotten rid of the upgrade discount and replaced it with a $299 annual fee.

There's a couple other wrinkles but that's it in a nut shell.
That's how Adobe started also and then they pulled the rug out from under their customers.
I would not be surprised if Avid ends up doing the same thing!
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Old June 2nd, 2014, 08:04 AM   #17
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

From a business standpoint, it's probably a more lucrative model.
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Old June 3rd, 2014, 01:13 PM   #18
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Hi Kell,

Quote:
Liking Premiere so far - except I don't see a way in this version to save a custom transition but can copy/paste for now if need be.
We know about this one. In the upcoming version of Premiere Pro CC, you'll be able to save custom dissolves. The plan is to give more transitions this treatment going forward.

Quote:
The keyboard shortcuts are buggy - not crazy about that - hopefully they fixed that. Any changes you make results in a 'custom' keyboard setting spread - but sometimes it saves them and sometimes they dump out.
Yes, if you make a change you get a custom keyboard, as with FCP 7, and earlier. I'm sorry that you find that some of the shortcuts are not saved when you return to them. I have not experienced that. If you like, file a bug here: http://adobe.ly/BugReport Thanks.

The only complaint I have is that you can't "double tap" keys like you can in FCP 7, and earlier. For example, you cannot call up the Roll tool by tapping R + R.

Quote:
I'm starting to edit with the trim window though - it's a different way of editing for me but it's kind of cool. I'm starting to move around and get used to some of the shortcuts in the trim window and the timeline. Some of these methods may be more efficient than my previous way of editing.
Premiere does have some nice features to it, I'm warming up to it.
Yes, trim edit is pretty awesome in Premiere Pro CS6, and later. I'm glad you like it. I used the Trim Edit window in FCP, but I find Trim Edit to be much more functional and easier to use. Shortcuts will really help you in this regard.

Quote:
I read part of the Adobe thread the other day - still plan to read more.
It's a shame that I didn't find out about Terry Wall's problem sooner. I could've had an agent contact him to solve that issue. If anyone else ever gets into this kind of trouble using Creative Cloud applications, please contact Adobe support ASAP here: Contact Customer Care You can even tweet to @AdobeCare and I will get your message.

Quote:
Love this though:
The guy that made this spoof is actually a Creative Cloud member.

Quote:
Ugg. "Rental." Really? I hadn't heard that.
I prefer the term "subscription" because you get not only all of our applications, but a bunch of services like storage, Typekit and Behance which I feel are relevant for our community.

Quote:
This is a good opening for someone to come along and fill the gap with a program that is not 'rental' and pick up a place in the industry.
You can still purchase Premiere Pro CS6, which is not part of our subscription program. I'm not sure how editors that want to use other NLEs will do without Creative Cloud applications. When I was a FCP guy, I still had to have access to After Effects, Illustrator, Photoshop, and Encore. I owned Production Premium even though I had Final Cut Studio, as well. Integration with all these apps was very cumbersome, even with helper apps like Automatic Duck.

I didn't use Premiere Pro because I wasn't familiar with it, but now I am. It has many similar FCP style features and others above and beyond FCP, so I feel more comfortable with it. The integration between these applications is matchless, unlike my previous workflow with FCP.

If I didn't work at Adobe, I would be in the same boat as you in making decisions about which NLE to choose, but I still think I'd consider Premiere Pro and Creative Cloud for its features and integration.

Quote:
Tim and Robert, have you edited on Avid as well?
I was professionally trained as an Avid editor. If you're coming from FCP, I don't think you'll like it. The jump from FCP to Premiere is so much more easy.

Quote:
I'm enjoying parts of working with it - but I found a nifty tutorial which had some timeline trimming keyboard techniques, most of which appear able to be done only in CS6.
The timeline trimming is insanely good. I'm particularly fond of Ripple Trim to Playhead (some call "Tops" and "Tails") which came in at CS6. Selecting a clip/next clip under the playhead in CC is also very helpful. I like all the presets you can make for the timeline, like patching, track height, etc.

Quote:
Love that still export feature - beats having to export via QT Conversion. Drove me nuts.
In Premiere Pro CC, it's even better. You have the option of automatically importing it back into the project, as well.

Quote:
Do PP later versions offer smart bins or keywording? Just curious.
There is a search function, but no smart bin/keyword capability. We do know about that request.

Quote:
BTW I'm enjoying your videos Kevin, thank you.
Those were made for CS5. 4 years ago! Well, I hope they helped you.

Quote:
VENT- won't go to markers without highlighting the clip! Grrr.
In Premiere Pro CC you can choose to go to "All Markers."

Hope this answers a few questions for you.

Thanks,
Kevin
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Old June 3rd, 2014, 02:55 PM   #19
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Unfortunately, when it is good for business, it a bad for the end-user.

In the first year alone, I saved, well not spent, over $ 1 K on the rental and each month I do not move over to the rental model saves me $ 86. That allows me to spend my money elsewhere AND I can use my projects all the time without having to pay extra for it. A major benefit of using a perpetual license.

Sure, I miss out the latest supported camera formats, but since I don't have such a camera, that is nothing to miss. I miss all the new features in the CC version, or should I say, that are not features, that are bugs ...
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Old June 3rd, 2014, 04:01 PM   #20
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Hi Harm,

Sorry that CC won't work out for you. Nice to hear from you, though. Do appreciate your continued help in the community. Keep rockin'!

Kevin
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Old June 4th, 2014, 07:23 AM   #21
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Take another look at FCPX. It's no joke.
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Old June 4th, 2014, 12:54 PM   #22
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kell Smith View Post
Tim and Robert, have you edited on Avid as well? If so, what do you see as the advantages/disadvantages of each?
Haven't touched an Avid in over twenty years so can't comment on the current state of their software. (geez I'm old!) I have heard the latest versions are very nice though. Had a rep try to convince me to switch and I seemed to have an answer for all the "Avid does this…can Premiere?" questions. They are both very capable. The choice should be made based on the area you are in and what the other editors you may send projects back and forth to are using. Phoenix seems to be mostly Premiere users who switched from FCP7.

And to Mark…several of us in my circle tried FCPX and the only real issue was the inability to move a project from computer to computer. Since I have several producers and production houses who like to do rough cuts then send to me for finishing and graphics, it just didn't work. The software is fast and does everything needed albeit in a very strange interface for an old-school editor like me. Have they updated to allow moving projects?
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Old June 5th, 2014, 04:38 AM   #23
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Lightworks will also become an option for Mac users on 11th June and may be worth trying out. It has a wide range of payment methods, so you're no tied into the cloud.

You have the choice of the FCP keyboard arrangement, although, as with most NLE's, if you try to use the program precisely the same as your old software making the move will be frustrating.
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Old August 7th, 2014, 12:48 PM   #24
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Thank you all for your thoughts on the issue. I've gotten sidelined lately and am just coming back to the board.
I'm getting more comfortable in Premiere, it's a nice program once you get past the awkwardness of learning something new. Some of the things drive me batty and have maybe been corrected in later versions - and maybe not, but most things seem pretty workable.
I"ve been away from that for about a month as well - so it's going to be a re-familiarzing with it when I get back in.
I think I could be pretty comfortable on Premiere - but the next stop is Avid so that may or may not change everything. Last time I tried to learn Avid, it was a nightmare - but perhaps because I expected a really small learning curve. I abandoned it in favor of just being able to get something done in PRemiere. This time I'll go in expecting a higher learning curve.
The fact that Avid edits AVCHD without transcoding is a huge, huge plus though. Saving drive space is a great thing. Man, when I transcoded those files to AIC for an earlier project they were HUGE. It would be better not to have to deal with that.
Thx everyone have a great day.
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Old August 7th, 2014, 01:22 PM   #25
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

"The fact that Avid edits AVCHD without transcoding is a huge, huge plus though. "

I have to assume you mean versus FCP right? PPro handles AVCHD (and just about everything else) natively.
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Old August 7th, 2014, 01:31 PM   #26
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harm Millaard View Post
Unfortunately, when it is good for business, it a bad for the end-user.
When it's bad for business, it's undeniably bad for the customer...owners of discontinued, unsupported products from businesses that no longer exist or just abandon the market for more profitable niches aren't big winners either... I guess satisfying everyone is impossible.
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Old August 8th, 2014, 02:00 PM   #27
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Kolb View Post
"The fact that Avid edits AVCHD without transcoding is a huge, huge plus though. "

I have to assume you mean versus FCP right? PPro handles AVCHD (and just about everything else) natively.
FCPX handles everything PPro will handle natively.....
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Old August 8th, 2014, 02:14 PM   #28
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Kolb View Post
When it's bad for business, it's undeniably bad for the customer...owners of discontinued, unsupported products from businesses that no longer exist or just abandon the market for more profitable niches aren't big winners either... I guess satisfying everyone is impossible.
I think his point is that one of Adobe's motivations (I didn't say the only one, but undeniably one
of them), is to make more money off its users. By changing to a subscription base, they do
this. I don't begrudge them this, if you create an awesome bunch of software, you SHOULD
profit off it! Unfortunately, I am one of their 'less valued' clients. I switched over to CS6 from FCP7.
I do not upgrade every cycle, (FCP 2>FCP 4.5>FCP 7) instead updating when there are enough new
features to entice me to upgrade. So for me (and others like me), upgrading to CC would cost
me more money, but give Adobe more money. Adobe made the decision to no longer offer me
a choice for when I feel their software is worth paying them the money to upgrade.
I made a business choice, that it would therefore be in MY best interest to switch NLE's.
FCP X is a total new way of editing and learning it was a little struggle. But it costs less
than 6 months subscription to CC and Motion cost 1 month as does Compressor. And
all their upgrades are free. Like Harm, I am banking money every month, instead of spending
it on CC. That is good for my business. I'm going to look out for my bottom line,
just as Adobe is looking out for their's.
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Old August 8th, 2014, 02:37 PM   #29
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabe Strong View Post
FCPX handles everything PPro will handle natively.....
I was under the impression that MXF files still needed additional plugins...

At any rate, I thought the OP was referring to switching from FCP7...
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Old August 8th, 2014, 06:10 PM   #30
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Re: FCP switcher -how do you like Premiere? Some frustrations.

Tim,

MXF.....is that C300 files? I can't remember which is which anymore. I remember
last year working as a DIT on a TV show pilot. It was shot with C300's and the laptop
production sent me to use.....had no programs on it. I downloaded Canon's free utility, and that
let me spot check the video of the files I copied over......but you couldn't listen to the audio.
I tried CS6 and thought it would do the trick, but surprisingly I couldn't view the files.
Finally, I tried FCP X and it worked. Not sure why, I thought maybe I hadn't updated
CS6 to its newest state but after the show, totally forgot to check. Anyways maybe
I should have said 'FCP X will handle pretty much everything CC will natively' as there
may be an exception. FCP 7 on the other hand, means you have to transcode many
formats to ProRes.
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