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Old March 7th, 2007, 10:15 AM   #1
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More on (poor) encoding

OKay folks, just so you know, I have searched and reviewed all relevant threads I could find on this topic. It seems each thread ended up evolving away from my concerns.

I'm working with SD in PP2 (on a PC) and I'm simply looking for the best way to get the highest quality video onto the discs I'll deliver to the client. So far I've been exporting AVI from the timeline and then laying that into Encore and burning a MPEG2. This seems OK, but not great. I enjoy the menu managment and other acspects od Encore so I'd like to keeep using that if possible.

Many have suggetsed a 3rd party encoder like Cineform or Procoder. I've also heard of people using Sorenson Squeeze. I assume in using these products I'd still have to initially eport an AVI from the PP2 timeline (?). PP2 media encoder has a Sorenson codec but it looks so bad I wonder why they included it with Premier.

I'm looking for input on the best workflow to simply get from my timeline to DVD (with menus) with good quality. Any info is appreciated. I apologize for getting abck to a topic that has been covered in many threads here but none of those threads ended up getting me to an answer to my real question: What the best way to get fron the PP2 timeline to DVD?

It sounds like I'll need to buy another encoding program. I'm fine with that, I just want to nkow which is the best for what I'm trying to do.

(BTW: Are exporting movie (AVI) and the adober media encoder (crap) the only way to get media out of Premier?)

Any info is appreciated.

-Don B.


"When the going gets wierd, the wierd turn pro"
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Old March 7th, 2007, 12:30 PM   #2
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Procoder and Cinema Craft Encoder will encode directly from the Premiere Timeline. Sorenson Squeeze is a seperate program, but you can use a frame server, http://www.debugmode.com/frameserver/, which will allow you to export your timeline to a seperate encoder without having to render out of Premiere, and it's free.

I usually use the Adobe Media Encoder to encode my mpeg-2 for Encore. 7500 mbs CBR, Quality 5. I think the results are good. I have Sorenson Squeeze for web export, but I haven't really tested it for mpeg-2. I read in a review that Cinema Craft Encoder has the best output of all the DVD encoders, but it's quite expensive. Maybe I'll do some more testing.
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Old March 7th, 2007, 12:41 PM   #3
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Thanks Kevin. Hey, we're almost neighbors (I'm in Ithaca).

I'll look into the frame server you mentioned.

When you use Adobe Media Ecoder to make your M2s, doesn't Encore end up re-encoding the file?


-Don
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Old March 7th, 2007, 01:27 PM   #4
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Neighbors indeed. I don't know about you, but I'm ready for a nice, warm, 30 degree day.
Quote:
When you use Adobe Media Ecoder to make your M2s, doesn't Encore end up re-encoding the file?
No, I just drop it in the timeline in Encore.

Your post peaked my interest, so I just ran a few quick tests. I used some progressive footage from a DVX100a. I encoded with Premiere and Sorenson squeeze. Sorenson did produce a better image. Sharper and with better colors. But Sorenson doesn't have an option for 23.976 DVD, only 29.97. Not a huge deal. More tests to follow.
-Kevin
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Old March 7th, 2007, 11:34 PM   #5
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good info kevin thanks
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Old March 12th, 2007, 04:19 PM   #6
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DON / KEVIN

Cinemacraft performs best with encoding speed at a given quality.

TMPGenc as standalone gives excellent results / more affordable / slow.

Herman.
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Old March 13th, 2007, 08:27 PM   #7
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suprisingly dissapointing

I've beeen with premiere since 4.0 about 10 years ago. Each new version which has been released since DVD took over has promised "High Quality DVD authoring".

I've wasted so many discs trying different settings (from both here and the Cineform group), but have not yet seen DVD quality that looks professional.

I'm very surprised that for the investment required premiere pro can't do this well.

I guess I'm hesitant to upgrade yet again (ppro2) when it seems like this is still the case.
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Old March 13th, 2007, 08:30 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herman Van Deventer View Post
DON / KEVIN

Cinemacraft performs best with encoding speed at a given quality.

TMPGenc as standalone gives excellent results / more affordable / slow.

Herman.
Herman, which product from TMPGenc are you using? And how do you export your material from adobe before using it?
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Old March 14th, 2007, 07:23 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Rudd View Post
I've beeen with premiere since 4.0 about 10 years ago. Each new version which has been released since DVD took over has promised "High Quality DVD authoring".

I've wasted so many discs trying different settings (from both here and the Cineform group), but have not yet seen DVD quality that looks professional.

I'm very surprised that for the investment required premiere pro can't do this well.

I guess I'm hesitant to upgrade yet again (ppro2) when it seems like this is still the case.
Have to agree that pp2 should be able to handle an output to DVD at a good .... no very good quality.

The time I have spent on forums/experimenting to output from the pp2 time line to the most ubiquitous format ... dvd!! Then working through 'Virtual Dub' (great piece of software why can't Adobe buy it!! for pp2) then to the incredibly slow TMPG...

Hate to think I purchased the wrong bit of code.

Really Adobe must have waxed ears.
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Old March 14th, 2007, 08:06 AM   #10
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consensus on quality

Im curious:
If slow speed is not a factor (I'll let the final project encode overnight if i have to), then what are the best options for getting a great DVD encoded:

I've heard so far:

Virtual Dub
Cinemacraft
Tempgenc (although I'm not sure which product)

are their others?

Let's see if we can form some kind of consensus on:
1. the best quality external software
2. the best way to get footage from premiere into that software
3. the best settings.
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Old March 14th, 2007, 08:45 AM   #11
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Folks, unless you want three extra steps, and two post avi's with unsupported freeware, you're best bet is get on the horn (so to speak) and tell the Adobe engineers that we need better scaling and encoding features. (I'd even pay more if tmpeg and a lacoz3 filter were embedded into the code).

Vote with your dollar's and not just your holler's.
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Old March 14th, 2007, 08:46 AM   #12
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BTW, Here's the link:

http://www.adobe.com/cfusion/mmform/...?name=wishform
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Old March 14th, 2007, 08:52 AM   #13
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ok peter..

Ok, I did it. it only took about a minute.
Hopefully they'll release the new version later today. :)

Seriously though, I really did make the request (it was really easy), and if all of us do, it might help speed things along.

but, while we wait, I think we have to rely on a third party.
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Old March 14th, 2007, 01:33 PM   #14
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Yup. I was thinking long term. This has been an issue for some time, and unless we make a fuss about fixing core issue, we'll get pointless features like "Automatic background music while you wait for your render."
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Old March 15th, 2007, 04:15 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Ferling View Post

Posted request to Adobe but was not sure if it was a feature request or bug!!

Personally I feel it is more a bug.
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