A Budget Marathon of an Indie Shoot Needs your Audio Advice - Page 2 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

All Things Audio
Everything Audio, from acquisition to postproduction.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old December 3rd, 2007, 01:33 AM   #16
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 127
Tom please stop right there.

Think about 3 months from now where y'all will be shooting everyday and really starting to get a handle on the equipment. I'm forever the optimist so I'm assuming the more you work on the shoot and get feedback from your editors the stronger you'll get in the field.

Assuming this is correct you'll soon be growing tired of the Sign Video and wish you had the 442.

The G2 is the lowest priced wireless system I'd recommend.
Anna Harmon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 01:43 AM   #17
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Fairfield, Dunedin, New Zealand
Posts: 3,634
Images: 18
Hi Tom.......

Please don't take my comments out of context, they were meant in a "loving and caring way" and were not intended as a dig at either yourself or your enteprise, just in case that's the way it came across.

1. The issues with wireless are immense. Depending on where on the planet you go, they either:

a) Do not give a shit as long as you're spending money, illegal is all the rage.

b) Don't tell, don't ask, but if it all goes tits up, it's you're fault - watch out!

c) This is definately a serious "No - No" and they will confiscate non - compliant gear at Customs, and even make you pay a fine, if they are so minded (this is to be avoided at all costs, if possible).

My crack about " foreign" was about the fact that "foreign" in States speak is Canada.

Hardly "foreign".

If you're going seriously "up country' - Nepal (bandit country), India ( just as bad for "pro" videographers"), South America (no experience but expect the worst), Africa: Hey, what do you expect!....................


You may see where I'm coming from.

As for recommending "passable" I will leave that to the "committee" who have infinately more experience in these matters than me, I hope they will chime in soon.


CS
Chris Soucy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 04:26 AM   #18
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Fairfield, Dunedin, New Zealand
Posts: 3,634
Images: 18
Hi Anna...............

Not sure what happened, but some posts in the thread just simply didn't appear on my system............till now. Yours was one.

The EU (European Union) has developed a pretty tight policy with radio gear for use within it's extended borders. You can (and will) be stopped at Customs if you are carrying any radio transmitting equipment, and will be grilled as to it's frequencies and legality for use in the EU (or that part thereof).

Some countries have a pretty laid back attitude, some don't, some are just plain evil, depending on the weather, time of day, shift pattern of Customs and just plain 'ol bad luck.

This is a "worst case" scenario. This all stems from the number of bods arriving from the States (in particular) with gear that operates on totally illegal frequencies in the UK and other EU countries, and the relevant governments attempts to stamp it out.

That this has anything to do with the totally illegal trade in "radar gun" detectors (banned practically everywhere in the EU) is neither here nor there (but, sadly, true!).

The point of my post was this: As "foreign" wasn't detailed, and I have quite a bit of experience of said "foreign", to warn about a blithe "it'll be all right on the night" attitude to taking radio gear across country borders.

It could be even worse. They didn't spend all that money on luggage scanners just to keep out terrorists you know - ooooh no, they're catching a shed load of bods they didn't catch before, for all sorts of stuff, .........cos they can see everything in your luggage!

Now, as to your comment about the 422/ ENG 44 - what can I say? If you can shed any more light on this expedition than I can already see, please do.

But from where I'm sitting (40 rows back, behind a pillar and an extremely large lady with a big floral hat) the 422 is so "overkill" as to be almost laughable. However, I shall bow to your infinite better wisdom and demure from further comment. Just trying to help.


CS
Chris Soucy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 05:31 AM   #19
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Bristol U.K.
Posts: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anna Harmon View Post

And I must comment on this scenario. It's productions like this that really mess things up. People who have the money to have an on going project for however many days, have a post team and a production team, can fly a crew all over the place and make weekly drop offs to headquarters chincing out on production. This is a classic example.

And yes, I have to give you some shit for this because it's f'ed up.

And yes, I've passed on projects like this before because they offered a ridiculously low rate, and yes I'd do it again. But you know what, there have been many times I've been called in because the last sound person they used was an idiot and they should've hired someone who knew what the hell they were doing.

Got to agree with Anna. Your project is not something I see as good for the world of TV.
Cheapens it to be honest and without meaning to be negative to you, I do feel that you deserve to make a right mess of it. Not because you are a bad person, just because you are seriously undervaluing the art of technical TV.

I also would not want to touch this project with a barge pole.

Nothing personal though.

Oh and I would get a cheap mixer if I was you. The SD442 is beyond your budget and needs. Again second hand ebay.

Anna really has a good point and because of that I will refrain from wishing you good luck on this as you are undermining quality standards by attempting this.

Regards none the less.
Jimmy Tuffrey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 09:00 AM   #20
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Baltimore, MD USA
Posts: 2,323
Unfortunately, they use radio spectrum differently than we do in the US. In the worst of cases, if your gear doesn't get stolen, it will be confiscated by the authorities. In this case, confiscated means you won't get it back.

Unfortunately, because you are in violation of laws you did not know existed, you will not be given the choice of regular or decaf, or cold or unbearably hot when they serve you the coffee enema to punish you for your crime.

Please do your family a favor and make out a will before you leave.

For other anecdotal information, some of which may be less more optimistic, ask the question on rec.arts.motion.picture.sound

Regards,

Ty Ford
Ty Ford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 11:18 AM   #21
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 5,742
Been trying to remember the proper name for the blanket customs registration you should obtain before leaving and I'm having a senior moment ... it's "Carte something." It registers your gear and carries a bond that you'll be taking it out of the country at the end of your shoot so you don't have to pay import duties each time you cross a border.
__________________
Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!
Steve House is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 11:28 AM   #22
Major Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve House View Post
Been trying to remember the proper name for the blanket customs registration you should obtain before leaving
ATA Carnets -- http://www.merchandisepassport.org

This is only good for certain countries (none in Africa or South America from what I recall)...

Wayne
__________________
Mics: KMR 82 i, NTG-1, MKH418S, MKH8040, SR77, QTC1, QTC40, SR30
Recorder: Zaxcom Deva 5.8 & MIX-12. Wireless: TRX900 stereo, Lectro 411
Wayne Brissette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 01:29 PM   #23
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Espoo Finland
Posts: 380
In some countries you mentioned (Nepal, India), shooting professional video means journalist visas (takes months to get), liason officer from the government to oversee your shooting, and post sensorship of all footage. Yes, you have to pay all the expences.

That does not mean it can not be done if you can get your gear over the border. Better appear touristy and as innocent home video enthusiasts if the police start to question you, anywhere.

Do not present yourselves as a video crew at the customs, travel separatelly, some are video shooters, some others collect bird sounds, just happen to be on the same flight...
Petri Kaipiainen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 01:40 PM   #24
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 127
Chris as far as other mixers I'd say the PSC Alpha mix. Haven't used it myself but know a few sound guys who have it and offer it in their package. I'm assuming it's 'cause it's cheaper and they needed a 4 channel package right quick. The downside to that mixer is that it takes NP-1 batteries so you could easily go through 2 of those in one day. The Wendt has a 4 channel model that takes 6 AA batteries, I don't like their meters. I'm not gonna talk about the tech specs and all that.

Chris and Wayne thanks for the info on the customs thing. Honestly if I were to take a gig in Africa or anywhere else I'm getting the production company to rent out the gear. Chances are I'm gonna need more than I have in my kit anyway and/or everything's fully insured.

Only thing that sucks about renting gear is that there's always something missing or something - no matter how small - that's not working right.

And the production company takes care of all the visas, customs annoyances and all that.

P.S. I love the thought of getting a carnet for Ringling Brothers tigers. Did you see that?
Anna Harmon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 02:22 PM   #25
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 5,742
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anna Harmon View Post
...
P.S. I love the thought of getting a carnet for Ringling Brothers tigers. Did you see that?

I flashed on a baggage claim area filled with hundreds of large pet carriers, each holding a member of the New York Philharmonic!
!
__________________
Good news, Cousins! This week's chocolate ration is 15 grams!
Steve House is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 02:23 PM   #26
Major Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anna Harmon View Post
The Wendt has a 4 channel model that takes 6 AA batteries, I don't like their meters. I'm not gonna talk about the tech specs and all that.
....
Chris and Wayne thanks for the info on the customs thing. Honestly if I were to take a gig in Africa or anywhere else I'm getting the production company to rent out the gear.
I use to own the Wendt X2 and X4. I hated the X2's LED meters. No matter what setting you were in, the LEDs were too bright. Depending on what meters you had on the X4, that could make a difference (they offer VU and PPM meters). I had the VU meters and never had issues with them.

I am actually in the negotiation stages with a producer that I've worked with before who wants me to go to Kenya for a documentary... thus the ONLY reason I know anything about carnets! We want to stick to the same equipment we use here in the US, so I'm trying to determine if I go cheap here in the US and don't use the Deva 5.8, or take the Deva to Kenya... I have similar concerns with another producer who wants me to go on a documentary in the Andes (that production scares me more than the Kenya production).

Wayne
__________________
Mics: KMR 82 i, NTG-1, MKH418S, MKH8040, SR77, QTC1, QTC40, SR30
Recorder: Zaxcom Deva 5.8 & MIX-12. Wireless: TRX900 stereo, Lectro 411
Wayne Brissette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 03:16 PM   #27
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 127
If you're working with that many channels then sure bring the Deva. But are you really? On a Doc?
Anna Harmon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 03:50 PM   #28
Major Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anna Harmon View Post
If you're working with that many channels then sure bring the Deva. But are you really? On a Doc?
I use it all the time regardless of situation. It came in quite handy on a National Geographic doc, so yes I am seriously considering it.

Wayne
__________________
Mics: KMR 82 i, NTG-1, MKH418S, MKH8040, SR77, QTC1, QTC40, SR30
Recorder: Zaxcom Deva 5.8 & MIX-12. Wireless: TRX900 stereo, Lectro 411
Wayne Brissette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 06:50 PM   #29
Trustee
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1,158
actually coming in at the end... you're not even considering backup gear ! if you really have the inexperienced doing this, they will bust it sooner or later... even pro's do, just far less often. where will you get a spare ? fedex ? (nope) you also need backup gear. FWIW, there is a reason they make 5 and 6 channel mixers - its for reality shows where everyone has a lav wireless on. barring that, the mixbus connector to combine 2 mixers, but thats a lot of weight. either way, you have pretty much set up yourself up for a disaster by not having all the details worked out. you just can't show up in another country and shoot at a pro level and not know anything, its NOT the US. I can't say enough that the most important thing is to hire at least one local for every location. that alone can fix so many problems. your best bet may be to rent locally wireless mics from a local co. then you solved a big chunk of your problems... or do the reasearch for every country you plan to travel to and maybe you get lucky there is a wireless unit that will be ok everywhere, but I truely doubt that will happen.

if you have the cash to send people around the world for 3 months, maybe you should scale back the amount of travel time, and instead take the same cash and use if to properly produce the project with decent people including a production manager/ co-ordinator who knows who to manage international work because its clear you really haven't thought this out. I've walked away from trainwreck gigs like this....

Steve Oakley
Steve Oakley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2007, 09:40 PM   #30
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne Brissette View Post
I use it all the time regardless of situation. It came in quite handy on a National Geographic doc, so yes I am seriously considering it.

Wayne
I hear you on that, though if I had a Deva I'd only pull it out when the occasion called for it. It's such an expensive unit. But if the production co will pay you for using it then hells yeah.

The most I've used is 6 independent channels and with that I rented a PD6 just 'cause. I know it doesn't compare by a long shot.
Anna Harmon is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:59 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network