Ok I'm about to buy a Lav. mic!!! at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

All Things Audio
Everything Audio, from acquisition to postproduction.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 29th, 2003, 01:58 PM   #1
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 194
Ok I'm about to buy a Lav. mic!!!

I have narrowed down my wireless mic choices for my GL2.
I need help on deciding between the:
SAMSON micro 32
or
Sennheiser Evolution 100

I will be shooting on the beach in windy San Diego. Are these mics good for my application. How about quality?

I've heard everyone talk about how the Evolution 100 is great, but it looks like it is lacking some basic functions. Correct me if I'm wrong but it isn't a Diversity system, no XLR, unbalanced lines and a omindirectional mic.
Do I need these features?

I will most likely use the MA-300 input device.

Can I even connect these devices to my camera via the MA-300?

Tell me what you guys think. Do you have experience with these items?


Thanks for your help,

Scott
Scott Gold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2003, 09:51 PM   #2
Wrangler
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Vallejo, California
Posts: 4,049
Re: Ok I'm about to buy a Lav. mic!!!

I've heard everyone talk about how the Evolution 100 is great, but it looks like it is lacking some basic functions. Correct me if I'm wrong but it isn't a Diversity system

-----------------
Doesn't seem to need diversity. The wall-powered receiver is diversity.
--------------

no XLR

--------------------
Comes with two output cables, XLR & mini-jack
---------------------

omindirectional mic.
--------------------
The Me-2 Sennheiser micorphone is and Omni and costs about $400 when purchased by itself.
---------------------
Do I need these features?

I will most likely use the MA-300 input device.

------------------------
Don't know what that is. An adapter?
-------------------------

Get a windscreen for the lavs. Trew Audio sells the little fuzzy balls in a choice of one of 4 colors for $50 for two.
__________________
Mike Rehmus
Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!
Mike Rehmus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2003, 10:27 PM   #3
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 194
Any other takers???

Does anyone own the micro 32?
Will the Omnidirectional mic be ok for outdoor windy filming?
Scott Gold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2003, 11:05 PM   #4
Wrangler
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Vallejo, California
Posts: 4,049
Omni has nothing to do with wind noise. It is caused by wind blowing past the microphone bits and pieces. You must use a fuzzy wind sock for the lav to avoid the problem. Omnis, Cardiods and super-Cardiods all have the same problem in the wind.
__________________
Mike Rehmus
Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!
Mike Rehmus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2003, 03:31 PM   #5
Trustee
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 1,327
True, but you can't P-pop an omni, nor have it turn in the wrong direction
on you. I would go with an omni for most gigs.
__________________
Jacques Mersereau
University of Michigan-Video Studio Manager
Jacques Mersereau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2003, 05:24 PM   #6
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 327
Scott, I use and LOVE the micro 32 see my post in the "Favorite Mics for interviews" thread:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=12435

Also, If sound quality is of the utmost concern, and you can deal with more difficulty in hiding the mic, I would recommend a Rycote Windjammer for lavs. It's big and poofy, but will sure cut down your wind noise considerably.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh6/con...=259851&is=REG
Scott Anderson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2003, 06:48 PM   #7
Wrangler
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Vallejo, California
Posts: 4,049
I by P-pop you mean capture plosives, omni's certainly can and will. Hard to do with a Beta58 (dynamic) but easy to do with condenser omni's.

I keep an old Shure SM11 lav around just for the speaker that can't stop talking in P-pop. That one, about the size of the end of your thumb is insensitive enought that the plosives are not much of a problem.
__________________
Mike Rehmus
Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!
Mike Rehmus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2003, 08:50 PM   #8
Trustee
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 1,327
I guess I would disagree here.

Sure, I guess you *can* p-pop any mic, but omni directional mics are
_much less_ prone to it than mics with cardioid or hyper cardioid patterns.

Even after setting the mic correctly for them,
"talent" seems to have a real fine ability to get a directional lav mic
turn around wrong . . . usually into their clothes.

Personally, I can't remember getting a p-pop when using an
omni lav during any of the interviews I've shot.
That's probably over 50 interviews. I usually use a windscreen
indoors.

Your mileage may vary.
__________________
Jacques Mersereau
University of Michigan-Video Studio Manager
Jacques Mersereau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2003, 11:04 PM   #9
Wrangler
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Vallejo, California
Posts: 4,049
Of course you won't get a pop with a properly postioned lav. It takes a direct breath hit to get the pop. But an omni hit with breath will pop every time. Not everyone properly positions microphones.

And lavs are used in other situations other than on the speakers chest. I've laid them in the street to pick up shoe sounds, on poles for really small boom spaces and dangling from a rod as a makeshift DJ microphone.
__________________
Mike Rehmus
Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!
Mike Rehmus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2003, 04:57 AM   #10
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 2,053
For lavs, I'd avoid unidirectional mics.

A unidirectional lav has to be pointed right at the sound source. If the source gets off-axis or outside of the pickup lobe, the tonal character of the sound source will shift. If the uni lav is placed too high on the talent's shirt then all he needs to do is turn his head to incur an undesirable tonal shift.

Should the lav slip or twist, the pickup lobe will also shift, most likely in the wrong direction. It's OK if the situation will allow you to stop the shoot and correct the position of the mic on the talent. If not, then you'll have a lot of audio problems to deal with later.

Unidirectionals are, in fact, more sensitive to wind noise. After using Shure WL185's to isolate talent from environment, I finally switched over to a pair of Countryman B3's. Small, and the frequency response can be tailored to specific situations. Best yet, they're easily concealed in clothing, a technique that sometimes proves useful in windy conditions.

The Shure's were too hard to conceal and too limited in placement because of their directional characteristics. They sound OK but were tough to deal with in the field. What the Countryman lacks in directional characteristics, it makes up for in proximity advantages. It's even small enough to allow me to hide it in the bill of a baseball cap during a recent interview.

As for breath pops, omni mics can be turned so that the pickup faces away from the talent's mouth. Some can even hidden in the hairline!

Dean Sensui
Base Two Productions
Dean Sensui is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2003, 10:34 PM   #11
Tourist
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Clearwater, Florida
Posts: 2
Ok I'm about to buy a Lav. mic!!!

As a sub-contracting wedding videographer, I have been using the Samson Micro-32 wireless lavalier / camera receiver system for about a year. It beats my old Azden- Pro (VHF) system that I started out using years ago, by a l-o-n-g mile!

But after "checking out" the Sennheiser Evolution 100 system at a local music store, I'm now saving up to BUY this (UHF) unit at B&H Photo/Video (NYC). You get the lavalier transmitter, the camera-mount receiver & a transmitter unit that plugs into your regular XLR mike. A complete package that can't be beat for $499.95.

Go to B&H Photo's website, type (in search window) Sennheiser Evolution 100 series. When the page comes up, it's going to shock the hell out of you, when you see the price listed as $1,184.95. Be sure to click onto "Email me a better price" & they will send you the price of $499.95!

Holding the (metal case) Sennheiser unit in my hand, I compare it to a Cadillac Escalade, opposed to my (Samson) Chevrolet Cavalier! Save up your money & buy the BEST! "Good Luck" - Bob Pallante
Robert P. Pallante is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2003, 11:13 PM   #12
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 75
Hey! I just bought a Chevy Cavalier! (No kidding.)

About the Evolution 100: as I posted in another recent thread, all you have to do is add the item to your cart to see the discounted price. I dunno why they have that silly e-mail box (to build up an e-mail list, I suppose).

Bob, or anybody who might know, how would you suggest I connect two Lav receivers to my GL2? Will the MA-300 allow me to do this?
__________________
"Oy... Aim it downhill."
Andres Lucero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 10th, 2003, 09:51 PM   #13
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
Posts: 936
I hate to be a pill, but the me-2 mic that's quoted as being $400 all by itself isn't correct. The evolution 100 system comes with the me-2 rather then the mKe-2 which is totally different. K?

Also for the money I'd be tempted to get the 500 series or perhaps a used Lectro... just some ideas in the same price range.

Also if you want UHF and diversity and true xlr output you might want to take a look at the AT 101 which also sells right around the $500 mark.

Just a couple thoughts for you to consider.
Matt Gettemeier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 10th, 2003, 11:56 PM   #14
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 229
Matt,
I am not sure what you are going to use the wireless system with, But let me point out the three diff between the 100 and the 500 systems.


500 is Balanced - 100 is not

500 has 16 Frequency presets - 100 has 4 (both have 1280 Freq. to choose from)

500 has headphone output - 100 does not

If you are not going to use it with a true balanced input and you will not have to change freq often I would stay with the 100 series.

I you are looking to upgrade to a better mic (the ME-2 is really not great) then look at the MKE-2 or the TRAM TR-50 with the Sennheiser connection.

The least expensive Lectro is the 100 series which is a 100mw system (greater range) and is a lot lighter then the Sennheiser systems. If size and weight is not an issue I would stick to the Sennheiser. The Lectro is not a balanced system and sells for $1200 - $1400 and you most likely don't need a 100mw system either (30mw is plenty).
Marty Wein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 11th, 2003, 12:53 PM   #15
Wrangler
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Vallejo, California
Posts: 4,049
Marty,

A clarification and more questions

"500 is Balanced - 100 is not"

Here is the statement from Sennheiser's web site:
-----------
Yes, the EM 100's jack socket is balanced. The positive signal phase is at the tip, the negative phase at the ring, and the sleeve is ground.
--------------------
I received both a mini-jack and an XLR output cable with my Evolution 100 system.

'500 has 16 Frequency presets - 100 has 4 (both have 1280 Freq. to choose from)"

The only reason I can see for even having the presets is that one can ignore making certain both the transmitter and receiver are on the same frequency (because you did that beforehand) and simply and quickly change to one of the presets. It that why the capability exists?

I've never used the 4 I have available as I've never run into interference that would cause me to want to change channels. NYC users might find they have to switch, but out here in the boondocks, not so.

"500 has headphone output - 100 does not"

I'm not certain how important that is. I always monitor the audio by taking the signal from the camera, not an intermediate point in the signal chain. But there are instances where it would be handy. I suppose it is necessary to have the SoundCheck feature work, eh? Or maybe if one wanted to use an unwired boom pole and have the sound person monitor sound before it is hard-wired to the camera? I think I've talked myself into wanting that feature even though it's not necessary for my work.

You are right about the microphone model number and cost, Matt. Not a pill at all. Just correcting my false information which is appreciated.

I: you are looking to upgrade to a better mic (the ME-2 is really not great) then look at the MKE-2 or the TRAM TR-50 with the Sennheiser connection."

The ME-2 works very well for general voice use. Other models and brands, which can cost as much as the entire 100 system (if you got it on sale), will improve the sound if you need it. But I think many of us, especially me, will find the ME-2 to be entirely adequate in the environments we shoot in.

What I wish ithe body-pack transmitter had is the ability to directly accept an XLR input. They've wasted the 3-pin input socket by including an ability to accept feed from an electret microphone or a guitar output.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NOTE: You must use their cable or make up a special cable for the guitar!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That sucks up 2 of the three connections so one would have to use an XLR adapter of some sort to 'well-connect" an XLR microphone to the input of the body-pack transmitter.

The features I miss in the 100 that the 500 has are the ability to supply Phantom Power from the plug-on transmitter, the ability to read the transmitter's battery condition at the receiver, and the Soundcheck mode that allows functional voice level checks without transferring to the output.

The nice bit is that one can mix and match 100, 300, and 500 bits and pieces. So if one requires that the plug-on transmitter deliver Phantom power, the 500 series plug-on will work with the 100 series receivers. Unfortunately, the battery condition will not be displayed by the receiver.

Someday I hope someone who has access to the gear will post a comparison of wireless systems, all tested in the same conditions and will also list a knowledgable comparison of system features and technology.
__________________
Mike Rehmus
Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!
Mike Rehmus is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:37 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network