Lapel microphone for Zoom H2?

Jeff Harper · July 28th, 2009, 06:50 AM

John, MKE2 when bought in a lapel from Sennsheiser is $389 at B&H.

Bought from Microphone Madness in their own mini-plug configuration it's $159. That's a lot of mike for relatively cheap.

Jeff Harper · July 28th, 2009, 11:03 AM

Jeff, by the way, your idea of putting a new plug on my better mic is a good one, except I sold the unit! I'm currently trying to buy it back!

Tsu Terao · July 28th, 2009, 02:18 PM

Not to sidetrack the original topic, but if sound quality is an issue, the H2 + any external mic is not very good - the sore point being the H2. A PCM-D50 + Giant Squid is much better.

Just my 2¢

Jeff Harper · July 28th, 2009, 04:53 PM

The Sony might be better, but I can't imagine the Squid would actually be superior to the Sennheiser. You're talkin a sub $100 mic vs a higher end mic.

We'll see, my mic is being put together now and should arrive in a few days.

But I must admit, I never considered the Sony recorder. Is it significantly superior to the H2? Tell me more Tus.

Tsu Terao · July 28th, 2009, 07:46 PM

I certainly didn't mean to imply that the Sen was inferior to the Squid - my intent was to offer my (amateur) opinion that the H2 + any lav would be inferior to the PCM-D50 + Squid.

As a former owner of the H2, I was OK with the built-in mics. It fulfills it's intended purpose for it's intended audience. However, if you expect more, you'll have to contend with the barely functional 3-position gain switch (which is realistically 2-positions), and more importantly, a less than stellar pre-amp when using external mics.

I sold the H2 in favor of the PCM-D50 and have not looked back. (OK, I hope to someday have a SD 702....)

Jeff Harper · July 28th, 2009, 09:00 PM

Thanks Tsu, I appreciate your input about the Sony.

Anthony Ching · July 28th, 2009, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsu Terao

I certainly didn't mean to imply that the Sen was inferior to the Squid - my intent was to offer my (amateur) opinion that the H2 + any lav would be inferior to the PCM-D50 + Squid.

As a former owner of the H2, I was OK with the built-in mics. It fulfills it's intended purpose for it's intended audience. However, if you expect more, you'll have to contend with the barely functional 3-position gain switch (which is realistically 2-positions), and more importantly, a less than stellar pre-amp when using external mics.

I sold the H2 in favor of the PCM-D50 and have not looked back. (OK, I hope to someday have a SD 702....)

Hi Tsu, once you get SD, you'll never go back. I'm lucky to get mine at a great price.
I believe the reason not to use Sony is this kind of situation is the size. It is too bulky compared with body pack transmitter, or Zoom H2, Olympus LS-10, or Edirol R09. I agreed it sound great. But I don't like it takes MS card only.

My 2 cents as well.

Jeff Harper · July 29th, 2009, 05:55 AM

Tsu: I checked out the specs on the Sony and as Anthony says it certainly larger, over 6" tall and it weighs 12ozs compared to Zooms 3ozs.

It certainly does seem to be better recorder then the Zoom, but not as practical for using in wedding situation. A 3/4 pound recorder in the groom's jacket would be a bit much!

Tsu Terao · July 31st, 2009, 07:37 PM

Yes, for your intended purpose, the H2 is a much better choice over the Sony, weight-wise and size-wise. One of the benefits of plastic over metal is weight; if the Fisher-Price build quality or the gain-control implementation don't bother you, then go with the H2.

I still believe that a $400 lav vs. the $30 Squid is questionable when used w/ the H2, due to the H2's pre-amps. You can put expensive Pirellis on a Kia, but in the end, it's just a Kia with expensive tires. More knowledgeable minds will correct me if I'm wrong.

FWIW, my daughter is marrying in a few months, and the groom will wear a PCM-D50 + Squid (because that's what I have) and I'm still pondering how he will carry the Sony. [Uh, is that a PCM-D50 in your pocket, or are you just glad to be married?]

Andy Wilkinson · August 2nd, 2009, 05:50 AM

Maybe the new smaller recorder that has been announced (will be out end Sep I think) will be much smaller and lighter than the 50 and save some of his potential embarrassment!!!! :-)

It is still the high quality metal construction (unlike my Zoom H2!) but certainly looks to be aimed at being a Zoom Killer from the YouTube video I watched (that someone linked to somewhere on DVinfo about a week ago - I'll post the link soon if I can find).

Edit: Here you go, it's the PCM-M10 - video in this thread, $400 US is the estimated price point:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/canon-eos...-recorder.html

Jeff Harper · August 2nd, 2009, 06:32 AM

I personally have no problem with the looks or construction of the Zoom, other than I wish it were about 25% or less slimmer.

It is well built and the plastic is not cheap, but sturdy.

What's to be embarrased about?

The audio quality of the Zoom is cleaner than my G2 wireless.

It is true the Sony's look nice, but they look like any gadget to the layman.

I have dropped the Zoom. It is so light that is just bounced gently and was fine.

I am buying a second recorder and since the new Sony is so small it will get a serious look from me. But I have absolutely no problem with the quality of the Zoom. For it's weight, features, and quality it is a great value.

I haven't received the Sennheiser mic yet but it should arrive by Monday. Should've been here by now.

Jeff Harper · August 5th, 2009, 12:24 AM

Well, Tsu, I got my microphone today. I hooked it up to the Zoom and the sound was...well, it wasn't. Nothing. No sound. Apparently it is either incompatable or the mic jack on the zoom is broken.

I plugged it into my G2 and got a readout that it is working, but I need to listen/record on my camera to test it's quality. I'm sure it's fine, but I need a recorder I can use a mic with!

I need a second recorder anyway, so I'm looking at the Olympus LS-10. It seems to be the right price and good quality. I can still use the Zoom on the podium at churches, and I'll use the new recorder for the groom.

I don't want to wait for the new Sony, and I sure don't want to spend $400 anyway.

One thing I can say about the mic is the quality of the build is superb...heavy duty metal L shaped plug, very nice.

I have to admit, after playing with the Zoom for about an hour trying to figure out why the external mic wouldn't work, the buttons on the side are cheapo, pretty crappy. So in retrospect you guys are right, it is somewhat cheaply built in that respect.

I do like the retro look of it, and still think it's great for standing where it is close to a speaker. The built-in mic is not super sensitive but after testing it extensively this evening I do still like the quality of the sound...you just have to have the mic within a foot or so of the speaker. My best results were with the AGC turned on. Without it the sound levels were too low. I also admit that everytime I turn the darn thing on I have to go into the menu and reset things...that is a pain. I'm going to start a Olympus LS-10 vs Edirol R-09HR thread and see what people say.

Rick Reineke · August 5th, 2009, 09:45 AM

As I recall.... the H2's ext. mic plug-in power must be activated via the software menu.
All of my mics that have a 3.5mm plug, (ie; Tram, B6, AT, MK, MKE) work in the H2 without issue.
.......... Aside from the H2's inherent cheapo pre-amps.

Jeff Harper · August 5th, 2009, 10:16 AM

Thanks a lot Rick! Plug in power must be activated in the menu as you say.

Unfortunately, TSU, you may be right. Sensitivity is poor using external mic with this unit.

Rick, are the cheap pre-amps the reason for the low mic sensitivity?

As an aside, for some reason my recording level buttons have decided to stop operating.

Who was the dummy who said they like the way this unit was built? Oh, I forgot, that was me.

Rick Reineke · August 5th, 2009, 01:29 PM

The record level adj, is disabled when in the AGC-1 & AGC-2 mode.
That could add noise. I find the compressors annoying too. I mostly use none or Limit-3 if headroom is going to be questionable.
I have not had a problem with mic gain, unless trying recording something of low SPL.
That said, I primarily use the H2's line-in as back-up recorder for the camera hops.

July 28th, 2009, 04:53 PM	#19
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	The Sony might be better, but I can't imagine the Squid would actually be superior to the Sennheiser. You're talkin a sub $100 mic vs a higher end mic. We'll see, my mic is being put together now and should arrive in a few days. But I must admit, I never considered the Sony recorder. Is it significantly superior to the H2? Tell me more Tus. Last edited by Jeff Harper; July 28th, 2009 at 06:51 PM.

August 2nd, 2009, 05:50 AM	#25
Andy Wilkinson Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Cambridge UK Posts: 2,853	Sony PCM-M10 Digital Audio Recorder Maybe the new smaller recorder that has been announced (will be out end Sep I think) will be much smaller and lighter than the 50 and save some of his potential embarrassment!!!! :-) It is still the high quality metal construction (unlike my Zoom H2!) but certainly looks to be aimed at being a Zoom Killer from the YouTube video I watched (that someone linked to somewhere on DVinfo about a week ago - I'll post the link soon if I can find). Edit: Here you go, it's the PCM-M10 - video in this thread, $400 US is the estimated price point: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/canon-eos...-recorder.html __________________ Andy K Wilkinson - https://www.shootingimage.co.uk Cambridge (UK) Corporate Video Production Last edited by Andy Wilkinson; August 2nd, 2009 at 06:09 AM. Reason: Adding video link

July 28th, 2009, 06:50 AM	#16
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	John, MKE2 when bought in a lapel from Sennsheiser is $389 at B&H. Bought from Microphone Madness in their own mini-plug configuration it's $159. That's a lot of mike for relatively cheap.

July 28th, 2009, 11:03 AM	#17
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Jeff, by the way, your idea of putting a new plug on my better mic is a good one, except I sold the unit! I'm currently trying to buy it back!

July 28th, 2009, 02:18 PM	#18
Tsu Terao Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Monterey Bay area, CA Posts: 82	Not to sidetrack the original topic, but if sound quality is an issue, the H2 + any external mic is not very good - the sore point being the H2. A PCM-D50 + Giant Squid is much better. Just my 2¢

July 28th, 2009, 07:46 PM	#20
Tsu Terao Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Monterey Bay area, CA Posts: 82	I certainly didn't mean to imply that the Sen was inferior to the Squid - my intent was to offer my (amateur) opinion that the H2 + any lav would be inferior to the PCM-D50 + Squid. As a former owner of the H2, I was OK with the built-in mics. It fulfills it's intended purpose for it's intended audience. However, if you expect more, you'll have to contend with the barely functional 3-position gain switch (which is realistically 2-positions), and more importantly, a less than stellar pre-amp when using external mics. I sold the H2 in favor of the PCM-D50 and have not looked back. (OK, I hope to someday have a SD 702....)

July 28th, 2009, 09:00 PM	#21
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Thanks Tsu, I appreciate your input about the Sony.

July 29th, 2009, 05:55 AM	#23
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Tsu: I checked out the specs on the Sony and as Anthony says it certainly larger, over 6" tall and it weighs 12ozs compared to Zooms 3ozs. It certainly does seem to be better recorder then the Zoom, but not as practical for using in wedding situation. A 3/4 pound recorder in the groom's jacket would be a bit much!

July 31st, 2009, 07:37 PM	#24
Tsu Terao Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Monterey Bay area, CA Posts: 82	Yes, for your intended purpose, the H2 is a much better choice over the Sony, weight-wise and size-wise. One of the benefits of plastic over metal is weight; if the Fisher-Price build quality or the gain-control implementation don't bother you, then go with the H2. I still believe that a $400 lav vs. the $30 Squid is questionable when used w/ the H2, due to the H2's pre-amps. You can put expensive Pirellis on a Kia, but in the end, it's just a Kia with expensive tires. More knowledgeable minds will correct me if I'm wrong. FWIW, my daughter is marrying in a few months, and the groom will wear a PCM-D50 + Squid (because that's what I have) and I'm still pondering how he will carry the Sony. [Uh, is that a PCM-D50 in your pocket, or are you just glad to be married?]

August 2nd, 2009, 06:32 AM	#26
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	I personally have no problem with the looks or construction of the Zoom, other than I wish it were about 25% or less slimmer. It is well built and the plastic is not cheap, but sturdy. What's to be embarrased about? The audio quality of the Zoom is cleaner than my G2 wireless. It is true the Sony's look nice, but they look like any gadget to the layman. I have dropped the Zoom. It is so light that is just bounced gently and was fine. I am buying a second recorder and since the new Sony is so small it will get a serious look from me. But I have absolutely no problem with the quality of the Zoom. For it's weight, features, and quality it is a great value. I haven't received the Sennheiser mic yet but it should arrive by Monday. Should've been here by now.

August 5th, 2009, 12:24 AM	#27
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Well, Tsu, I got my microphone today. I hooked it up to the Zoom and the sound was...well, it wasn't. Nothing. No sound. Apparently it is either incompatable or the mic jack on the zoom is broken. I plugged it into my G2 and got a readout that it is working, but I need to listen/record on my camera to test it's quality. I'm sure it's fine, but I need a recorder I can use a mic with! I need a second recorder anyway, so I'm looking at the Olympus LS-10. It seems to be the right price and good quality. I can still use the Zoom on the podium at churches, and I'll use the new recorder for the groom. I don't want to wait for the new Sony, and I sure don't want to spend $400 anyway. One thing I can say about the mic is the quality of the build is superb...heavy duty metal L shaped plug, very nice. I have to admit, after playing with the Zoom for about an hour trying to figure out why the external mic wouldn't work, the buttons on the side are cheapo, pretty crappy. So in retrospect you guys are right, it is somewhat cheaply built in that respect. I do like the retro look of it, and still think it's great for standing where it is close to a speaker. The built-in mic is not super sensitive but after testing it extensively this evening I do still like the quality of the sound...you just have to have the mic within a foot or so of the speaker. My best results were with the AGC turned on. Without it the sound levels were too low. I also admit that everytime I turn the darn thing on I have to go into the menu and reset things...that is a pain. I'm going to start a Olympus LS-10 vs Edirol R-09HR thread and see what people say.

August 5th, 2009, 09:45 AM	#28
Rick Reineke Inner Circle Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: New York Posts: 2,038	As I recall.... the H2's ext. mic plug-in power must be activated via the software menu. All of my mics that have a 3.5mm plug, (ie; Tram, B6, AT, MK, MKE) work in the H2 without issue. .......... Aside from the H2's inherent cheapo pre-amps.

August 5th, 2009, 10:16 AM	#29
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Thanks a lot Rick! Plug in power must be activated in the menu as you say. Unfortunately, TSU, you may be right. Sensitivity is poor using external mic with this unit. Rick, are the cheap pre-amps the reason for the low mic sensitivity? As an aside, for some reason my recording level buttons have decided to stop operating. Who was the dummy who said they like the way this unit was built? Oh, I forgot, that was me.

August 5th, 2009, 01:29 PM	#30
Rick Reineke Inner Circle Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: New York Posts: 2,038	The record level adj, is disabled when in the AGC-1 & AGC-2 mode. That could add noise. I find the compressors annoying too. I mostly use none or Limit-3 if headroom is going to be questionable. I have not had a problem with mic gain, unless trying recording something of low SPL. That said, I primarily use the H2's line-in as back-up recorder for the camera hops.