Cheapest and Best way to record sound without using your cam's audio ports at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

All Things Audio
Everything Audio, from acquisition to postproduction.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old October 28th, 2004, 06:02 PM   #1
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Holland, Europe
Posts: 214
Cheapest and Best way to record sound without using your cam's audio ports

HI,

We all know the audio ports of the camcorders suck. They record noise and they don't give you volume control. I was looking into a cheaper solution for inside movies (house, car, church, school, sportgym etc)

- behringer mixer with 2 mono inputs and 2 stereo outputs with FX knob control (voor adding limiter so that the sound always stays under a certain volume point); with PHANTOM POWER for 99 euros (connect a 80$ condensor mic to it).
- belt and some a screwdriver. Drilll a hole in your mixer, attach a belt to it so that you can take it with you.
- 10 meter long audio cable (20 euros) (XLR cable if you going to record with a condensor mic; condensor really adds the best quality to your movies) OR 10 meter cable for your dynamic mic (quality is inferior compared to condensor recording)
- 80 dollar condensor mic>> mxl 990 condensor is cheap and sounds profesional. I read good reviews of this baby in future music magazine . http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=live/search/detail/base_pid/273166/
I got mine for 79 and it rocks.
- minidisk or harddrive audio recorder (which are being sold like lollypops). YOu have harddisk mp3/wav recorders for 100 euros.1 gig gives you about 100 min of wav audio/stereo.

COSTS: 99 (mixer) + condensor mic (99) + cables (20) + batteries (20 euros) + minidisk or harddrive recorder (99) + headphone (99) = 440 euros

pros: condensor quality recordings, hands-on control of volume and you can add a effect unit to it, you can connect 4 mics to your mixer, use balanced audio instead of unbalanced, with the 10 metres cable you can set up you mic on longer distances, no motor noises recorded, cheap, great quality of audio and infinite audio recordings thanks to sd memory cards or recording straight into your labtob.

cons: someone can step on the cables, you need a audiobuddy or a good mic heavy stand to place your condensor mic, use pop filters to prevent close recordings of ' P's and 'B's and spitting etc, it isn't a 1-to-1 solution. You need multiuple to get the best out of it, minidisk recorder isn't relaly so popular, so instead go for a harddrive recorder with SD memory or your labtob.

other ways to go:
infrared audio media (is on the expensive side at this moment); just plug the mics under your T-shirt . YOu don't need cables and you can use multiple small-sized mics all over the place, thus being able to create amazing stereo images.
Jose di Cani is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 28th, 2004, 08:04 PM   #2
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Brookline, MA
Posts: 1,447
So where do you get a recorder for $100?
Emre Safak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 29th, 2004, 12:30 AM   #3
Trustee
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,922
There are many ways of improving audio without looking like the Red Greens nephew. This approach just goes against my grain.

I may have approached this differently a few years ago but time seems to have an effect on a persons outlook. I prefer proven accessories that have been built for the situation.

I'd save and buy either the Beachtek DXA-8 and use my existing camera for audio input. With proper care it's posible to bet excellent audio. There's absolutely no hassle syncing on board sound after the fact.

The DXA-8 can also be used with mini recorders. The Sound Devices MM1 and MP1 are another example of rock solid quality. A Rolls or Marenius mixer is another relatively inexpensive but quality route. The Samson Mix Pad 4 or Rolls MX 54 is about as low as I'd go. I'd also buy some adhesive velcro patches and come up with a professional looking rig.

The bottom line is that all camcorder audio does suck.
If you have a versitile interface (mixer or adapter) almost any combination is made easier. I just strongly believe this is the wrong place to cut corners.

I get very good audio from a consumer camera (TRV20) and a DXA-8.

I get DAT quality audio from my VX2000 as modified by Greg Winter. Now that's a hard situation to not look like Red greens nephew.

Granted, I may have felt differently 40 years ago.
__________________
Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ".......holy smokin rubber lips...what a ride!"
Bryan Beasleigh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 29th, 2004, 10:24 AM   #4
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Holland, Europe
Posts: 214
http://www.vermontfolklifecenter.org/res_audioequip.htm

this link gives you a good view of what mediums you can use to record your sound without using the onboard mic. from 100 to 1000 euros if you want. A minidisk allready sells for 60$ at some cheaper shops.
Jose di Cani is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 29th, 2004, 10:32 AM   #5
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Holland, Europe
Posts: 214
thanks for the info. I will be looking for that beachtech thing for more info. I been making music with the pc for over 9 years now, having seen every audio/midi software. The best way is to record onto labtob (cubase sx , sonar3 or pro tools) with the use of a compressor unit like those made by FOCUSrite or even the all-acalimed RNC (real nice compressor). PLug the xlr mic into such a device and you have the best quality. IN movie situations it would be more practical to use infrared solutions , but who gonna pay them? So use quality cables. That is a solid solution. Why? You can edit yoru audio instantly in your pc real-time and see teh actual waveform being created. PLug vst-pluins to your channels and you have the best of the best. Evrything is recoreded onto digital sources (pc). It is the way to go. Evrybody has a pc so you can send it to someone through the net. Easy back-up and you can delete evrything instantlly and record 100000 tracks. DAT is loosing popularity in the last years. Pc audio is taking over.

YOu don't have money? well...I don't know then.
Jose di Cani is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 29th, 2004, 10:34 AM   #6
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Brookline, MA
Posts: 1,447
Laptops are nice until they run out of battery in the field.
Emre Safak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2nd, 2004, 01:30 PM   #7
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Holland, Europe
Posts: 214
far field recordings like deserts and mountains, USE a minidisk....it is digital and you can easily take 4 empty minidisks with you. It is light and most of them have a digital out. So extra quality when you export it to your pc.
Jose di Cani is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2nd, 2004, 01:56 PM   #8
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Holland, Europe
Posts: 214
A dat recorder is a expensive choise, but a quality one. The best thing you can do is buy a quality cam with onboard PREAMP. that will solve all of you problems. YOu dopn't need a mixer then. YOu only need a xlr cable from your exterior mic to your cam;s mic input. OF course, add a small battery runned mixer (behringer) , put it in your bag and you have better results. YOu can add 2, 4, mics in it and ouput the audio instantly to pc or minidisk or dat if you are in a field doing recordings.
Jose di Cani is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2nd, 2004, 01:57 PM   #9
Trustee
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Brookline, MA
Posts: 1,447
I am not versed on Minidisc. From reading here, I thought that Minidiscs had DRM that prevented them from transferring recordings digitally to (but not from) the computer. I also read that they transfer in real-time.
Emre Safak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2nd, 2004, 02:17 PM   #10
Major Player
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Holland, Europe
Posts: 214
I own a pc soundcard with digital input (maudio audiophile). MIndisik dig output to input soundcard...voila. Quality transfers. The maudio has great encoders so why not? Just push play and record in cubase sx or soundforge.
Jose di Cani is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2nd, 2004, 02:20 PM   #11
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Quito - Ecuador
Posts: 28
If you already own a laptop, you can buy an inexpensive audio interface and you will be in a whole different ball park. You will have the hability to record in multitrack and have access to a world of post-production tools and plugins.

If by cheap you mean below 500 dollars, you can get a digidesign Mbox, (for around $400) and you will receive protools with that. XLR inputs, phantom power, and Non linear editing like the pro's.

You can sync up with your images in protools, and add foley and other effects, clean up the audio, adjust volumes, compress, eq, limit....etc etc.

You can also add more tracks with soundtrack and music. It is a trully new world. Mbox is not the cheapest option, but the cheapest you can go with protools. There are some other interfaces in the 200-300 range, that come with multitrack software.

When you're done with your film, you can try recording your next platinum record with that..

:)
Sebastian Jacome is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > All Things Audio

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:20 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network