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Old April 6th, 2011, 07:04 AM   #16
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Re: head phones or monitors for editing

Genlec, are indeed some of the best available, and also some of the most expensive. I though the Tannoy speakers were very good, but produced a bit too much bloom at the bass end. I opted for the Yamaha because they were very flat sounding. Now I can shift the tone where I want it.

The only trouble is that I may set things up perfect at my end, but I have no idea what someone else may be listening through at their end.
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Old April 6th, 2011, 07:22 AM   #17
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Re: head phones or monitors for editing

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Originally Posted by Jon Fairhurst View Post
Years ago I did a digital transfer from an old reel-to-reel using headphones and didn't have any idea there was a phase reversal. Years later, I played the CD on good monitors and became very embarrassed.
Jon, mine might be a learned response. I'm not sure exactly how to describe it, and of course my description might be biased by the theory that I know. Listening to a mono track on cans, I think I hear the entire track coming from just one place... single point source, dead center. Listening to a mono track on cans, with phase reversed, the source almost seems to be bigger... as if it's everywhere at once. If I hadn't learned to associate that sensation with phase reversal, I might possibly think it sounded better, because it sounds "less monaural" if that makes any sense. At the same time, it somehow creates a hollow feeling inside my head. (My friends might attribute that to something else...)

I wonder whether the phase-reversed sound from speakers varies, depending on the distance between speakers. Just offhand, I'd think that if the speakers were extremely close, there would be little or no bass farther back in the room: all the air movement would be back and forth between the two woofer cones, with no net pressure change at a significant distance away. OTOH if the speakers were relatively far apart, compared to the listening distance, some of that air movement might indeed be perceived by the listener as an "out of phase" sound, rather than merely a lack of bass. (Perhaps it would be a velocity wave, rather than a pressure wave.) I don't feel quite energetic enough to start moving speakers this morning, though...
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Old April 9th, 2011, 06:56 PM   #18
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Re: head phones or monitors for editing

Does anyone have experience with the AKG K240 cans?
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Old April 10th, 2011, 08:55 AM   #19
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Re: head phones or monitors for editing

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Originally Posted by Greg Miller View Post
...OTOH if the speakers were relatively far apart, compared to the listening distance, some of that air movement might indeed be perceived by the listener as an "out of phase" sound, rather than merely a lack of bass. (Perhaps it would be a velocity wave, rather than a pressure wave.) I don't feel quite energetic enough to start moving speakers this morning, though...
It's incredibly obvious on my HT system when the left and right main stereo channels are fed an out-of-phase signal. Beyond a diminished bass, instead of a soundstage being created between and behind the speakers with instruments and voices well located in space, the sound becomes very diffuse, seeming to come from outer sides of the speaker area, as if the sound source is in two places at once, simultaneously arrayed along both the left and right sides of the room instead of in the front. Every once in a while a broadcast program or especially often a commercial with phase reversal on its track either makes it through network QC or somewhere in the broadcast chain a cable is mis-wired or some 'engineer' is asleep at the switch and things suddenly go out-of-phase in the room ... damned disconcerting.

Classic ADS L1230 tower monitors spaced about 10 feet apart at two vertices of an equilateral triangle with the listening position.
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Old April 10th, 2011, 09:51 AM   #20
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Re: head phones or monitors for editing

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Originally Posted by Warren Kawamoto View Post
Whenever I went to NAB, I noticed that just about every editing suite had Genelec monitors. Are these the standard in the industry?
LOL

No - more likely probably because Genelec is generous with loans.
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Old April 10th, 2011, 09:56 AM   #21
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Re: head phones or monitors for editing

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Originally Posted by Vincent Oliver View Post
Genlec, are indeed some of the best available, and also some of the most expensive.
I would disagree with both those comments.

They are certainly not either IMHO.

I would tend to put ATC in the best and most expensive column.

But I would certainly use Neumann / K+H, PMC, Harbeth or Geithein over Genelec.

Actually the new Neumann KH 120 monitors were certainly receiving good comments at ProLight+Sound when I was there. About a third cheaper than the K+H O110 that they replace, but more efficient and go lower as well. In fact I am now considering swapping my O110 for the new KH 120.

Genelec seem to be like "Marmite" - you either love them or hate them. But they do seem to be popular in places.
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Old April 11th, 2011, 10:18 AM   #22
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Re: head phones or monitors for editing

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Originally Posted by Jay Knobbe View Post
Does anyone have experience with the AKG K240 cans?
Yes, I have a few sets of the K240m from my studio days, on that particular model, one need lots of power to drive them. (they are 600ohm) Decent semi-open cans for the studio, I would NOT rely solely on them for mixing though.
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