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Old April 27th, 2011, 08:54 AM   #16
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

an SM58 is a PA grade mic at best. the RE50 is a MUCH better choice and you can hear both of them here at EV RE50 Mic and Sennheiser G3 Plug On Wireless Transmitter Review and BTW if you really want a SM58 I have a super clean used one you can have for $40.

you can get clean sound using a shotgun in these events provided its _placed_ and _aimed_ correctly. you need to get it close to the source, and aimed at the sound source - their mouth. that generally requires a boom op. you are up against physics here, not magic gear design. yes there are mics with very high isolation that pick up mostly whats directly in front of them like the sanken CS3 ( amazing mic ) but its around $1800 last time I looked. a rode shotgun would probably fit your budget better.

while you can get clean sound with a hand held mic, it does require people to handle it, and more importantly, have it close enough to their mouth that their voice is louder then the noise around it. this again requires proper positioning for best results. if its down at their waist, its not going to be any better then what you are getting now.


no mic is a sound telescope. that doesn't exist. you need to learn more about mics and placement first. then consider what will work best. you could most cheaply just get an extension for the mic you have and let them hold it if it doesn't have a lot of handling noise. I can also say that condensor mics can handle loud sound, certainly within the levels you are experiencing.
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Old April 27th, 2011, 05:04 PM   #17
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Give me a Sanken CS3e. It's a great shotgun. It has a reasonable flat off axis response so it works indoors. For wide shots where it can't hide, I'll use it for ADR.
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Old April 27th, 2011, 05:33 PM   #18
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Hey, Jon, he said he did want to spend $ 700 for a mic, isn't Sanken much more than that ?

Anyway, when I had my VX 2000, I used the very simple Beachtech DXA-4 (has no battery power) and paired it with a battery powered Sennheiser Me 66 with a K6 power unit. I still have that after 10 years. That was kind of the combo everyone was recommending then. We are still shooting it on the FX1 I own today. I even shoot it with a simple XLR to miniplug cord. You just don't want to run a long unbalanced miniplug line, so the XLR adaper is what to use for long runs where mic is away from camera.

Not to long after i got the ME66, it fell out of disfavor with the sound boys. One of the things about shot gun mics is they are not best for inside, as they will pick up echo, etc. The Sennheirser is a bit more sensitive there. I made a foam cover for it, that seems to rectify some of that. Frankly, despite what others say, I think it still does a better recording job thanthe AT or NTG-2, but there is a lot of subjectivity involved, in my mind, as post sound can be resolve a lot of issue..

I also have a the Rode NTG-2, and the Rode NTG-3. The NTG-2 does well in room despite shotgun nature. The NTG-3 is way above both the Sennheiser and the NTG-2, but then it costs in that $700 range you don't want to go.

As to Lapel mics. I doubt you would, in the explanation of your shooting habits, really take the time to set up with lapel mics. Its a step up in arranging your shooting plan, and actually requires you to set your subject down, get the mic mounted right, adjust to right channel if radio. Your shooting style seem a bit more run and gun to me. If I find myself in a sitdoown situation, and while I have some AT 899's I bought for a song on EBay that are great, I find myself mosltly using boom micstand to get the shot gun as close to my subject as possible
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Old April 27th, 2011, 06:46 PM   #19
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Everybody would groan and shake their heads if someone popped up and said "I want to make part of my living painting signs - so if I can only buy ONE paint brush, what kind should it be?

No serious sign painter limits themself to a SINGLE paint brush. Small ones are stupid for large signs. Big ones are stupid for little signs. Super delicate paint brushes might be really smart if you're painting numbers on watch faces - but are laughably INSANE if you're trying to paint a house.

Get the idea?

Every type, variation, polar pattern, technology and design in the wide, WIDE world of microphones has a purpose.

And every mic manufacture has the same goal - to offer a product that people will willingly buy at a price where the manufacturer can make a sustainable PROFIT over and above their costs of production.

Some manufacturers concentrate on filling the need of "I want OK but at a great price" and others offer "I've constructed the finest tool possible, but it's going to cost you" merchandise.

And sometimes it's actually what I call a "clutch puller" deal. That is, the only thing that does a particular job really well is a tool specifically designed to do that job!. You CAN pull a clutch with a hammer and a pry bar and some wrenches and bunch of other tools, but it will be frustrating and you're likely to make a mess in the process. That's when you learn that having the right tool on hand makes EVERYTHING go a WHOLE LOT faster and easier.

Welcome to microphones.
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Old April 27th, 2011, 06:55 PM   #20
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Chris, your right. The Sanken CS-3e is about twice the $700 mark but for me it is worth every penny. I just did an interview of a doctor in the lobby of the Stanford University Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences building. At first I was very worried because it was such a live space. Echoed incredibly. It was a sit down interview so I used a lav and boomed my CS-3e pointing down about 20" above and just in front of the subject. Was using a Senn ME2 for the lav so not a great mic. We'll be using the sound from the Sanken for sure. Granted, not every shotgun will work in a situation like this (in fact I don't know that any other one would have worked). but the sound quality coupled with the versatility of the Sanken never stops to amaze me.

If I could only have one mic and I were serious about sound, I would have to go with the CS-3e.

-Garrett
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Old April 27th, 2011, 07:26 PM   #21
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Let's stop messing around here and get to THE mic for everything AND it's within your budget.

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Old April 27th, 2011, 08:01 PM   #22
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Invest in a book (or instructor) about mic types, usage and placement. Even the most expensive mic will not sound good if used incorrectly.
Other points to be aware of:
The EV RE50/635 and equivalent dynamic omni directional mics are primarily H/H reporters mics and would be useless in a camera mount situation.... as would any cam mount mic, unless you're very, very close to the subject. (if one is expecting B'cast quality spoken voice) Ambient, (aka, 'nat' sound) is another story.
I have to agree with Zack except for the 58'. The 'cardioid' dynamics are better left for live performance or podium/lectern usage.
"Good sound guys will tell you that you need two dozen mics"
- As an alleged 'good' pro-sound person, I can usually get by on five mics in a typical ENG/EFP gig: 1-cam mic, (nat sound/ambient) 2- boom mics. (indoor & outdoor, run & gun + interviews); 2-wireless/hardwired lavs. (Interviews / walk & talk) .
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Old April 27th, 2011, 08:11 PM   #23
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

The reality is that there is no "one" mic. You need a shotgun for outdoors, a hyper for indoors, a hand held for interviews and a wireless when the boom is in the shot, or you don't have a boom at all. It's like asking, "What is the one ingredient you would get if you could only purchase one ingredient to make Thanksgiving dinner?". The question is flawed because there is no one mic.
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Old April 27th, 2011, 09:10 PM   #24
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

The answer is: 'turkey'

QUOTE"What is the one ingredient you would get if you could only purchase one ingredient to make Thanksgiving dinner?".
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Old April 27th, 2011, 09:16 PM   #25
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Meanwhile the vegetarian guests go hungry. There's no stuffing, no pepper or salt, desert, veggies or wine. Sure you'll survive another day, but the guests (clients) will say, "That was the worst Thanksgiving dinner I've ever had."
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Old April 27th, 2011, 11:41 PM   #26
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad Johnson View Post
Let's stop messing around here and get to THE mic for everything AND it's within your budget.

Mic Review: Superstar Microphone "Amazing Voice Magnifier" on Vimeo
What a deal! It's like a Fisher SpaceXpander, and truly wireless (no power, no output, no antenna). Talk about energy efficient, this is hard to beat! And at this price point, I could even afford three for a Decca tree. (But I'll bet it can't pound nails like a 635A.)
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Old April 28th, 2011, 01:43 AM   #27
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

"Let's stop messing around here and get to THE mic for everything AND it's within your budget."

Chad, is this mike compatible with Windows 7 64 bit? Could it also be used in conjunction with my PreSonus FireStudio (XLR inputs)

The downside is that there isn't any facility to attach it to my Gitzo boom pole and no wind jammer available..
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Last edited by Vincent Oliver; April 28th, 2011 at 05:15 AM.
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Old April 28th, 2011, 02:21 AM   #28
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Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad Johnson View Post
You need a shotgun for outdoors, a hyper for indoors, a hand held for interviews and a wireless when the boom is in the shot, or you don't have a boom at all.
The lav can get good sound outdoors, indoors, interviews, and when a boom would be in the shot. It's convenience, logistics, and aesthetics that pull people towards shotguns and handhelds, much more than sound quality.

For $700 I'd get the Sony wireless lav kit that costs $450 and replace the included lav mic with a Rode or higher end Sony for $250.
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