If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

H everybody.

I own a Sony vx2100 with a Rode Stereo Video Mic. I do this as a hobby, albeit a serious hobby. Occasionally I get paid for a shoot, mostly I shoot to learn. Sometimes I put the Rode on a boom pole.

The Rode is very sensitive to sounds from all directions.
I want to improve the quality of my audio and through the search function of this forum have been gathering info.
I can afford something like a NTG1 or 2 and a Beachtek adapter.

Would appreciate some recommendations. I can't afford a mic for indoors and a mic for outdoors.

Would a Rode VMP be a step up for me or is that for DSLR shooters?

Thanks for your help.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

what type of events or productions would you shoot the most with it? interviews? weddings? outdoors/indoors? etc.

This will help to make better suggestions.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Do you need XLR inputs on the mic? Thats the main question and if so, I would go with the very inexpensive AT875 - less than $200.
Instead of the Beachtek I prefer to use a seperate recorder - my choice is the Tascam DR-100 but you can use the Zoom - both have XLR inputs.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

In reference to the type of events I shoot here's an example...
Shot the hauling out of a WW II fighter plane from Lake Michigan. 4 Helicopters from local TV stations were flying over head and I'm trying to record some dialogue with a WW II Veteran. During playback the helicopter is as loud as the dialogue.

Doing anther interview and there is a bus running in the backround. Again, during playback the bus is as loud as the dialogue.

I had no control over any of these obstacles so I couldn't change the location of the interview, working alone, etc.

Last month I covered an event at work with about 150 people in a large room. It sounds as though all conversations are picked up equally regardless of where I point the camera.

High school basket ball game. Yikes!

In July I'm doing a family wedding. Ceremony outside, reception indoors. No sound boards anywhere.

Hope this gives you an idea.

My VX2100, which I love, has a mini plug for the mic connection. It's big brother, the PD170 has XLR.
The Rode SVM is a super cardioid.

If a mic with XLR is a must I would need to get a Beachtek adapter unit although I seem to remember someone stating that an adapter could be purchased to go direct from the XLR mic to the mini plug on the camera, but I don't know what I would be giving up if I did that.

So, understanding that there is no such thing as the perfect on-camera mic for all occasions, if you could only have 1 mic in my situation, what would it be? (can't spend $700 on a mic either)

Thanks for your comments.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

In reference to the type of events I shoot here's an example...
Shot the hauling out of a WW II fighter plane from Lake Michigan. 4 Helicopters from local TV stations were flying over head and I'm trying to record some dialogue with a WW II Veteran. During playback the helicopter is as loud as the dialogue.

Doing anther interview and there is a bus running in the backround. Again, during playback the bus is as loud as the dialogue.

I had no control over any of these obstacles so I couldn't change the location of the interview, working alone, etc.

Last month I covered an event at work with about 150 people in a large room. It sounds as though all conversations are picked up equally regardless of where I point the camera.

High school basket ball game. Yikes!

In July I'm doing a family wedding. Ceremony outside, reception indoors. No sound boards anywhere.

Hope this gives you an idea.

My VX2100, which I love, has a mini plug for the mic connection. It's big brother, the PD170 has XLR.
The Rode SVM is a super cardioid.

If a mic with XLR is a must I would need to get a Beachtek adapter unit although I seem to remember someone stating that an adapter could be purchased to go direct from the XLR mic to the mini plug on the camera, but I don't know what I would be giving up if I did that.

So, understanding that there is no such thing as the perfect on-camera mic for all occasions, if you could only have 1 mic in my situation, what would it be? (can't spend $700 on a mic either)

Thanks for your comments.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

The typical shotgun condensor mic can give you very good sound, but can be problematic in noisy/loud/uncontrolled environments because of their sensitivity. For noisy environments where you don't have much control over your sound environment look at picking up a dynamic mic like the Shure SM57/58 or the Electro-voice RE50, or the Shure SM11 dynamic lapel mic, AKG also makes some good ones. Keep in mind you have to get the dynamic mic as close to the interviewee's mouth as is comfortably possible.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

This is going to be a bit 'left-field', but have you considered a Zoom H4n and synchronising the audio in post?

I got one originally to work with a DSLR, but I'm using it more and more with my Sony PMW-EX1Rs.

I didn't intend to use the built-in mic pair, but they're good for voice. You can hide it near an interviewee, keep it low and just out of shot, put a wind jammer on it for outdoors, and use 24 bit audio for a wide dynamic range in difficult and changing audio situations. It will do interviews, VOs, atmos, wild track, groups (yes, in stereo) and even take a line feed from a desk with an attenuator. You can leave it recording on a lectern all day and an 8GB SD card lasts for ages. It will work with any camera you may wish to upgrade to, it will work with any microphone you may get in the future (it will phantom power it if necessary).

It will also work as a sort of BeachTek with its 3.5mm line output, and as a USB audio interface to your Mac/PC. It has its irksome irritations, but sync is not a problem any more. It's just a gosh-darn useful box to have around.

As I said - bit of an odd recommendation, but worth considering.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Since you already have a Rode Stereo Videomic why don't you consider adding to that with a wireless UHF lavalier microphone?

Then in noisy situations you could use the lav to isolate the voiceover you are trying to capture and where appropriate you could use the shotgun you have.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

I was going to make a similar suggestion, but also including a Zoom. A shoot a few months ago dictated adding some additional audio capability on very short notice. I had neither the time nor the funds to buy quality, and they weren't available locally in any event. I wound up going with a low end sennheiser wireless lav system ( As I recall it was about $175.) and a Zoom H-1 ( $99.)
I used various combinations for a couple of days of shooting; the lav and the wireless for talking head stuff, the zoom and the wireless for a couple of situations when I needed room ambience, and the lav/wireless and the receiver/zoom as a stand alone audio system that I synced in post.
Overall, the results I got really surprised and pleased me, especially since all in it was less than $300. I doubt they would stand up to daily heavy use, but they worked ( and continue to work) well for occasional use

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

I agree with Michael, the Shure 58 Cardioid dynamic ($120 @B&H) is a good choice. Personally, I have a Sennheiser MD46 Cardioid ($200@B&H), that does the same thing.
The nice thing about the dynamic mic is that it doesn't require phantom power and can be used with many different cameras. You can use XLR directly or through an XLR to 3.5mm adapter.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Thanks for all your suggestions.

I use an Olympus DS-40 digital recorder from time to time. When I sync it in post I expand the timeline and line up the peaks. Is there a better way? Sometimes it's not all that easy.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Nope, that's how you do it. But depending on what editor you use, you could try Plural Eyes, a plug-in that does that automatically for you.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Jay,
It sounds like it's no big deal if the audience sees the mic in your videos. So rather than using a boom, how about a handheld mic or a lapel mic (wired or wireless)? You would get the mic much closer to the talker(s) that way.

Ken

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

I'm also a hobbyist not a pro. I'd second the lavalier suggestion, especially since you already have a camera/boom mountable. The Rode lavalier or PinMic are good because you can buy both 1/8 and XLR connectors to use them with a most any device, ensuring that they grow as your system does.

But Lav mics really call out for wireless transmitters to keep the subject from walking away while corded, potentially pulling your camera off the tripod, ripping their clothes if the PinMic is attached, etc. I splurged on a Sennheiser G3 and don't regret it.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

If I could only purchase one mic & one mic only, I'd purchase the nicest lav I could get.

My rational behind this would be that often the best audio you're going to get is when the mic is close to what you want to record.

Good sound guys will tell you that you need two dozen mics for a half dozen scenarios. But if you can only have one mic, I would rather have a $50 lav clipped onto somebody, than a $1000 shotgun mic too far away from my subject to hear the audio.

I'd highly suggest searching the good work horse mics & picking up used (but not abused) ones. If you can get 2 lavs (Tran TR50), 1 haldheld (EV RE50b or Shure SM58) & one shotgun mic (MKH416, Rode NTG-3), you'll be covered for 90% of what you need to record. (Just a couple of my recommendations)

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

an SM58 is a PA grade mic at best. the RE50 is a MUCH better choice and you can hear both of them here at EV RE50 Mic and Sennheiser G3 Plug On Wireless Transmitter Review and BTW if you really want a SM58 I have a super clean used one you can have for $40.

you can get clean sound using a shotgun in these events provided its _placed_ and _aimed_ correctly. you need to get it close to the source, and aimed at the sound source - their mouth. that generally requires a boom op. you are up against physics here, not magic gear design. yes there are mics with very high isolation that pick up mostly whats directly in front of them like the sanken CS3 ( amazing mic ) but its around $1800 last time I looked. a rode shotgun would probably fit your budget better.

while you can get clean sound with a hand held mic, it does require people to handle it, and more importantly, have it close enough to their mouth that their voice is louder then the noise around it. this again requires proper positioning for best results. if its down at their waist, its not going to be any better then what you are getting now.


no mic is a sound telescope. that doesn't exist. you need to learn more about mics and placement first. then consider what will work best. you could most cheaply just get an extension for the mic you have and let them hold it if it doesn't have a lot of handling noise. I can also say that condensor mics can handle loud sound, certainly within the levels you are experiencing.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Give me a Sanken CS3e. It's a great shotgun. It has a reasonable flat off axis response so it works indoors. For wide shots where it can't hide, I'll use it for ADR.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Hey, Jon, he said he did want to spend $ 700 for a mic, isn't Sanken much more than that ?

Anyway, when I had my VX 2000, I used the very simple Beachtech DXA-4 (has no battery power) and paired it with a battery powered Sennheiser Me 66 with a K6 power unit. I still have that after 10 years. That was kind of the combo everyone was recommending then. We are still shooting it on the FX1 I own today. I even shoot it with a simple XLR to miniplug cord. You just don't want to run a long unbalanced miniplug line, so the XLR adaper is what to use for long runs where mic is away from camera.

Not to long after i got the ME66, it fell out of disfavor with the sound boys. One of the things about shot gun mics is they are not best for inside, as they will pick up echo, etc. The Sennheirser is a bit more sensitive there. I made a foam cover for it, that seems to rectify some of that. Frankly, despite what others say, I think it still does a better recording job thanthe AT or NTG-2, but there is a lot of subjectivity involved, in my mind, as post sound can be resolve a lot of issue..

I also have a the Rode NTG-2, and the Rode NTG-3. The NTG-2 does well in room despite shotgun nature. The NTG-3 is way above both the Sennheiser and the NTG-2, but then it costs in that $700 range you don't want to go.

As to Lapel mics. I doubt you would, in the explanation of your shooting habits, really take the time to set up with lapel mics. Its a step up in arranging your shooting plan, and actually requires you to set your subject down, get the mic mounted right, adjust to right channel if radio. Your shooting style seem a bit more run and gun to me. If I find myself in a sitdoown situation, and while I have some AT 899's I bought for a song on EBay that are great, I find myself mosltly using boom micstand to get the shot gun as close to my subject as possible

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Everybody would groan and shake their heads if someone popped up and said "I want to make part of my living painting signs - so if I can only buy ONE paint brush, what kind should it be?

No serious sign painter limits themself to a SINGLE paint brush. Small ones are stupid for large signs. Big ones are stupid for little signs. Super delicate paint brushes might be really smart if you're painting numbers on watch faces - but are laughably INSANE if you're trying to paint a house.

Get the idea?

Every type, variation, polar pattern, technology and design in the wide, WIDE world of microphones has a purpose.

And every mic manufacture has the same goal - to offer a product that people will willingly buy at a price where the manufacturer can make a sustainable PROFIT over and above their costs of production.

Some manufacturers concentrate on filling the need of "I want OK but at a great price" and others offer "I've constructed the finest tool possible, but it's going to cost you" merchandise.

And sometimes it's actually what I call a "clutch puller" deal. That is, the only thing that does a particular job really well is a tool specifically designed to do that job!. You CAN pull a clutch with a hammer and a pry bar and some wrenches and bunch of other tools, but it will be frustrating and you're likely to make a mess in the process. That's when you learn that having the right tool on hand makes EVERYTHING go a WHOLE LOT faster and easier.

Welcome to microphones.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Chris, your right. The Sanken CS-3e is about twice the $700 mark but for me it is worth every penny. I just did an interview of a doctor in the lobby of the Stanford University Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences building. At first I was very worried because it was such a live space. Echoed incredibly. It was a sit down interview so I used a lav and boomed my CS-3e pointing down about 20" above and just in front of the subject. Was using a Senn ME2 for the lav so not a great mic. We'll be using the sound from the Sanken for sure. Granted, not every shotgun will work in a situation like this (in fact I don't know that any other one would have worked). but the sound quality coupled with the versatility of the Sanken never stops to amaze me.

If I could only have one mic and I were serious about sound, I would have to go with the CS-3e.

-Garrett

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Let's stop messing around here and get to THE mic for everything AND it's within your budget.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Invest in a book (or instructor) about mic types, usage and placement. Even the most expensive mic will not sound good if used incorrectly.
Other points to be aware of:
The EV RE50/635 and equivalent dynamic omni directional mics are primarily H/H reporters mics and would be useless in a camera mount situation.... as would any cam mount mic, unless you're very, very close to the subject. (if one is expecting B'cast quality spoken voice) Ambient, (aka, 'nat' sound) is another story.
I have to agree with Zack except for the 58'. The 'cardioid' dynamics are better left for live performance or podium/lectern usage.
"Good sound guys will tell you that you need two dozen mics"
- As an alleged 'good' pro-sound person, I can usually get by on five mics in a typical ENG/EFP gig: 1-cam mic, (nat sound/ambient) 2- boom mics. (indoor & outdoor, run & gun + interviews); 2-wireless/hardwired lavs. (Interviews / walk & talk) .

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

The reality is that there is no "one" mic. You need a shotgun for outdoors, a hyper for indoors, a hand held for interviews and a wireless when the boom is in the shot, or you don't have a boom at all. It's like asking, "What is the one ingredient you would get if you could only purchase one ingredient to make Thanksgiving dinner?". The question is flawed because there is no one mic.

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

The answer is: 'turkey'

QUOTE"What is the one ingredient you would get if you could only purchase one ingredient to make Thanksgiving dinner?".

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

Meanwhile the vegetarian guests go hungry. There's no stuffing, no pepper or salt, desert, veggies or wine. Sure you'll survive another day, but the guests (clients) will say, "That was the worst Thanksgiving dinner I've ever had."

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

What a deal! It's like a Fisher SpaceXpander, and truly wireless (no power, no output, no antenna). Talk about energy efficient, this is hard to beat! And at this price point, I could even afford three for a Decca tree. (But I'll bet it can't pound nails like a 635A.)

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

"Let's stop messing around here and get to THE mic for everything AND it's within your budget."

Chad, is this mike compatible with Windows 7 64 bit? Could it also be used in conjunction with my PreSonus FireStudio (XLR inputs)

The downside is that there isn't any facility to attach it to my Gitzo boom pole and no wind jammer available..

Re: If you could could only purchase 1 mic
 

The lav can get good sound outdoors, indoors, interviews, and when a boom would be in the shot. It's convenience, logistics, and aesthetics that pull people towards shotguns and handhelds, much more than sound quality.

For $700 I'd get the Sony wireless lav kit that costs $450 and replace the included lav mic with a Rode or higher end Sony for $250.