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Old February 2nd, 2007, 10:47 AM   #1
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Want to record Stereo

I have been videotaping a lot of my daughter's cheer competitions, and usually I tap off the line outputs of the audio board for the music (I use Senn wireless 100 unit to xmit to my videocam), and mix with my on-cameral mic in post. However, this only gives me mono music, and I would much prefer stereo. I have a second Senn 100, and could xmit the other stereo channel to my camera using that, but then I lose the ambient for mixing. Any suggestions (and, at the very least, any suggestions for taking my mono music track and making it "sound" like stereo). Thanks much.
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 11:03 AM   #2
 
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There's a few "stereoizer" VST plugins floating around. Look on Voxengo or MDA.
Ozone will also do the trick...which is to put a small bit of phase error on one channel...does wonders for opening up mono to simulate stereo.
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 04:13 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Ravens
There's a few "stereoizer" VST plugins floating around. Look on Voxengo or MDA.
Ozone will also do the trick...which is to put a small bit of phase error on one channel...does wonders for opening up mono to simulate stereo.

Bill, thanks very much. I tried the Voxengo plug in in Premiere Pro, and it worked beautifully. What is MDA? I tried googling it, but came up with nothing. Thanks again!
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 06:20 PM   #4
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The way I do this is to get a copy of the original music and lay that in.
Easy enough to sync it up by matching waveforms, unless the camera has AGC turned on, then it can a bit more tricky having to do it by ear.
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 06:41 PM   #5
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Hi Ken

No need for a plug-in with Prem Pro. Have background audio on Track 1. Capture Senn Mic as separate track ( Eg. Scenalyser ). Note if this is a left or right channel ( depending on CH3 or CH 4 i/p to your camera ). Import to Audio track 2 on timeline. Use the fill left / fill right commands from effects, to fill the 'other' channel with the same mono track. Not stereo, but does fill left and right channels equally and in sync with the background. Mix tracks 1 and 2 as appropriate to your production.

Hope this helps, as an easier alternative.

Steve
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 08:06 PM   #6
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Most video cameras record in stereo.

Why not record the performance with the on camera mic, which gives you a lot of ambient room sounds as well as audience reaction?

Get a line feed to a stand alone audio recorder and record the program .

Get a copy of any music (in stereo) on CD.

Sync them all in you NLE, and choose which audio tracks are the most appropriate at the appropriate times.

I do this all the time with similar live performances, and it works quite well.
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 09:15 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Burke
Hi Ken

No need for a plug-in with Prem Pro. Have background audio on Track 1. Capture Senn Mic as separate track ( Eg. Scenalyser ). Note if this is a left or right channel ( depending on CH3 or CH 4 i/p to your camera ). Import to Audio track 2 on timeline. Use the fill left / fill right commands from effects, to fill the 'other' channel with the same mono track. Not stereo, but does fill left and right channels equally and in sync with the background. Mix tracks 1 and 2 as appropriate to your production.

Hope this helps, as an easier alternative.

Steve
Steve I think what you describe is pretty much what I do. I tap the audio board with my wireless Senn (and send to ch 1 on my cam), and record ambient with an on camera shotgun (and send to ch 2 on cam). In post, I then copy the audio track, left fill on one, and right fill on the other, then mix. Is this what you describe? Anyway, I just didn't like the "flat" sound I was getting from the mono (both channel outputs are identical with the method I describe above), so I wanted to introduce a stereo sound to give a bit more spatial aspect to the audio.
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 09:17 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Waldemar Winkler
Most video cameras record in stereo.

Why not record the performance with the on camera mic, which gives you a lot of ambient room sounds as well as audience reaction?

Get a line feed to a stand alone audio recorder and record the program .

Get a copy of any music (in stereo) on CD.

Sync them all in you NLE, and choose which audio tracks are the most appropriate at the appropriate times.

I do this all the time with similar live performances, and it works quite well.
I was thinking of doing as you describe, but I don't have a separate audio recorder. I am pondering purchasing a Tascam HD-P2 for the audio recording. Any thoughts on it?
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 09:37 PM   #9
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Last week, I used my new Tascam P2 to record a series of comedy shows for an upcoming television special. It worked flawlessly. I mixed an audience stereo pair with the comics Shure Beta 58 and the results were fantastic. This was a three camera shoot, so I locked the Tascam to the time code box and all worked very well. That Tascam is one sweet recorder.
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 09:54 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waldemar Winkler
Get a copy of any music (in stereo) on CD.
There's no way you'll be able to get everyone's music, especially for cheer performances, although if you're only filming just your daughter, you may be able to talk to her coach.

Does the P2 do drop frame recording?
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Old February 2nd, 2007, 10:02 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Kit Hannah
Does the P2 do drop frame recording?
Yes, it has multiple frame rate settings including 29.97 DF and 29.97 ND.
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Old February 3rd, 2007, 05:12 AM   #12
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I'm gonna have to get one now...I'm all about that..
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Old February 3rd, 2007, 08:40 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken McGrath
Steve I think what you describe is pretty much what I do. I tap the audio board with my wireless Senn (and send to ch 1 on my cam), and record ambient with an on camera shotgun (and send to ch 2 on cam). In post, I then copy the audio track, left fill on one, and right fill on the other, then mix. Is this what you describe? Anyway, I just didn't like the "flat" sound I was getting from the mono (both channel outputs are identical with the method I describe above), so I wanted to introduce a stereo sound to give a bit more spatial aspect to the audio.
Hi Ken

From your earlier post you described using a separate plugin - the method I described uses the in built func of PPro. From what you describe, you are recording 2 mono channels and trying to get a stero mix..... ??? What I normally do is have the front shotgun record on stereo ( into CH1 & CH2 ), and then I have 2 further separate mono channels on the camera. The senn100 sends a mono feed to CH3 and I use this in post to fill left/right and then mix the 2 tracks together. Of course if you do have that 2nd Senn, you could space them out in the room, and send 1 to CH3, 1 to CH4 and then mix the stereo pair with the stereo shotgun, in post.

PS Adobe Audition gives you the flexibility to play around with the spartial settings, if you have that program.

Steve
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Old February 3rd, 2007, 09:19 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Burke
...What I normally do is have the front shotgun record on stereo ( into CH1 & CH2 ), and then I have 2 further separate mono channels on the camera. The senn100 sends a mono feed to CH3 and I use this in post to fill left/right and then mix the 2 tracks together. Of course if you do have that 2nd Senn, you could space them out in the room, and send 1 to CH3, 1 to CH4 and then mix the stereo pair with the stereo shotgun, in post...
Don't you have to drop down to 12-bit audio to record 4 tracks on the tape? For dialog it's not such a big deal but for music doesn't this seriously compromise the quality?
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Old February 3rd, 2007, 10:39 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken McGrath
I was thinking of doing as you describe, but I don't have a separate audio recorder. I am pondering purchasing a Tascam HD-P2 for the audio recording. Any thoughts on it?
Anything that records audio digitally should work. I don't know the Tascam, though I should probably look into it. I cuurently use an iRiver mp3 recorder.
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