Homemade 35mm Adapter

Ryan Henry · January 10th, 2004, 06:06 PM

You're a little unclear in your question. The 35mm lense projects an image on the ground glass. A 50mm lense would result in an image similar to that made in a film camera with a 50mm lense. The camera just records that image. The DV camera has nothing to do with the length.

Taylor Moore · January 10th, 2004, 06:23 PM

Thanx Ryan.
Got it. I guess it's time for me to start building.

J. Clayton Stansberry · January 10th, 2004, 08:24 PM

I just got the recommended pack of Maxwell CD-R's (blue pack) and I got the frosted CD, and let me tell you that it has yeilded better results than my attempts at sanding....it was awesome! I am not even using a fresnel and the image seems to be clear and the DOF is freaking incredible. I am using a Nikon 85mm lens and it is working fine, just a little more zoomed than a 50mm.

Will the fresnel improve the image or is it just for making the image larger on the GG so you don't have to zoom in as far with the camcorder? I imagine the latter...Anyway, on to Bob's suggestions to get rid of the noise. Maybe I can get some tests together tomorrow...we'll see...good luck and happy agusing!!!!

Jeremiah Rickert · January 10th, 2004, 09:48 PM

For people still searching for a good magnifying lens...my grandpa had a busted workshop light, one of those that has a magnifying glass with a circular bulb around it, and I was able to extract the lens and it works perfectly.

Seems like pretty decent glass too.

Jeremiah

Agus Casse · January 11th, 2004, 01:00 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by J. Clayton Stansberry :

...Will the fresnel improve the image or is it just for making the image larger on the GG so you don't have to zoom in as far with the camcorder?...

-->>>

Yeah Fresnel will not only magnify but will not distord the image, it magnify and correct it so you just put your dv camera and zoom until no vigneting with no trouble.

I have noticed that i can full zoom and get excellent image by using the SLR camera and DV camera configuration (you put the slr camera and the dv in the slr viewfinder.

Today we started a short film with be used to show up the agus35 comercial capabilities.. we are still waiting for for our roof pentaprims and electronic lens to continue the developing.

Also we want to give compability to XL1s owners.

Filip Kovcin · January 11th, 2004, 12:49 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Jeremiah Rickert : ...my grandpa had a busted workshop light, one of those that has a magnifying glass with a circular bulb around it -->>>

Jeremiah,

can you send to someone or make the link to proper page with the picture of that part from the workshop light, just to know what is it about. i didn't understood how it may look.

thanks,

filip

Isaiah Kraus · January 11th, 2004, 12:58 PM

I am in the process of building a project-box agus for my GL2, and came up with this idea for at least getting a preview of shots the right way up/around while you shoot them.

That said, it requires a computer connected to the camera via firewire, and special software. I have tested it with my Mac G5 1.8sp, the software "PixelShox Studio," and a Sony TRV18. Basically the computer-software horizontally and vertically flips the incoming f/w video stream (from the DVcam in CAMERA mode) and displays the results on the computer monitor. The recorded-to-tape footage still must be flipped in post, but now you can have a computer (laptop?) monitor to give you a visual approximation when you shoot/set up shots.

PixelShox is free Video-DJ (VJ) software, and is not available for PC. However there are other PC VJ programs that might (hopefully) be capable of doing the same thing if you are on a PC (check out vjcentral.com).

If anyone is interested, I can give details on how how to use PixelShox to accept the f/w stream, flip/invert it, and display the results full-screen. BTW, PixelShox can also just display the f/w video without flipping/inverting, allowing you to use a mac computer (laptop?) as a kind of field monitor for non-agus setups too.

Note: From what I understand, PixelShox relies heavily on OpenGL h/w acceleration. I'm not sure how usable it is on Mac laptops. I do not own a Mac laptop.

-Isaiah

Bob Hart · January 12th, 2004, 08:42 AM

Have just finished a test on a close-coupled non-inverting Agus35 using the telescope eyepiece lens set I have been carrying on about. With 3/8" taken off my adaptor, closer coupling was possible. The vignetting and barrel distortion went away. ##### ADDENDUM--- AFTER DISMANTLEMENT AND RE-ASSEMBLY, THE BARREL DISTORTION HAS RETURNED AND NO AMOUNT OF RE-ADJUSTMENT HAS MADE IT GO AWAY AGAIN. IN SAFE TV FRAMING IT IS NOT A SEVERE ISSUE. I SHALL FILM SOME MORE TESTS AND ASK CHRIS IF HE WILL POST THOSE RESULTS. #####

The image frame is variable from around the area of the motion picture 35mm widescreen gate which is what the Mini35 does, to about 2/3rds of a 35mm still camera frame.

The test pattern at TV safe framing in adequate light is at the limit of the PD150. There is very slight softening in the corners which sharpens if the centre is softened by shifting camcorder focus.

This Australian plumber's version of the Agus has the case, lens mounts and bayonet mount to the PD150 sourced from PVC plumbers hardware (in two colours, grey and white).

It fits up direct to the PD150 onto the lens hood bayonet fitting. The telescope eyepiece goes into the 58mm filter thread on the PD150 and the lens tube slides on over it. For small lenses up to the 135mm Auto Tamron which I tested today, this would be adequate support in a non-energetic environment.

For larger lenses a base support would be wise as the cutout clearance for the CD groundglass in the PVC lens tube weakens it.

The CD spindle motor came from a deceased CD player.

The lens set came from a 2" 42mm telescope eyepiece which I had bought from a camera store to make up a second NV relay prototype. A 10x single element close-up lens will be way cheaper though it may soften the corners more than the eyepiece does. It also may not permit close coupling right up to the front of the camcorder case.

Bob Hart · January 13th, 2004, 07:56 PM

There are some .jpg joined before-and-after images of focus pulls with Agus35 to PD150 after the firm lens mounts were made from the PVC pipe caps.
The images have filenames which look like agusfs2.jpg or similar. Thanks to kennelmaster Chris for posting them.

The 35mm lenses were 1970s Tamron Adaptamatics of 28mm f2.8 and 135mm f2.8 and a Micro-Nikkor 55mm f2.8. The 55mm and 135mm give good fill of light into the corners. I haven't tried the long lenses yet as they need added support. The 28mm f2.8 has a distinct hotspot in the centre, about 4 f-stops worth. These were all relayed via the 1x +2x +4x Hoya close-up lens stack.

Jeremiah Rickert · January 13th, 2004, 11:25 PM

Someone posted that the blue 25 pack of maxell cd-r's came with the frosted CDs. What is the spindle called precisely?

I picked up a blue maxell spindle, and it was $25, and of course when I cracked it open, no frosted CDs. They were called CD-R Pro and they were the only blue spindles at Office Max and Staples.

So....what's the precise name of the CD-R's with the frosted CD?

Thanks!

Jeremiah

Agus Casse · January 14th, 2004, 12:05 AM

For all who are using a discman motor with 2AA baterries, i got some news...

IT WONT SPIN FAST ENOUGH... well, the worst part is that we noticed this after we shoot a whole day.

So, what i suggest is to replace it with a 9v battery, just be sure not to forget to shut it down once the shoot ends.

Chris Hurd · January 14th, 2004, 12:40 AM

Bob Hart's latest images are up! See directory at http://www.dvinfo.net/media/hart.

Bob Hart · January 14th, 2004, 03:56 AM

Agus.

If you have another disk and can easily mount it, put that one in and write some numbers and some big, small and tiny marks around the disk. Do some test recording and see if the numbers and marks are clear and move past fairly slowly or can't be seen except as blurry arcs. If they can be seen it means the disk rpm is close to camera frame rate or a multiple or fraction of it.

I find that flickering happens at several speeds as the disc revs up. The discman motor rpm might be close to the camera frame rate or a multiple of it.

Instead of putting more power to the motor you might get away with finding something between 1.5v and 3v by using a resistor and running the motor slightly slower.

Agus Casse · January 14th, 2004, 09:32 AM

good idea,

i will check the footage of yesterday, if it doesnt flicker, may be those words of "at 200mph i got no friends" will be true. Cause damn the disc is spining fast at 9v ....

Bob Hart · January 14th, 2004, 10:01 AM

Agus. Please re-read my post above. I dropped half a sentence out of the first paragraph when I cut and pasted it in so a piece was missing when you read it.

For all, I have just sent Chris a large .jpg file of tests done with the telescope eyepiece as a relay lens. These are also comparison frames of 4:3 and 16:9 through the same 35mm objective lens. The .jpg file is identified by the filename aguswscr.jpg

The good news is, you can use your Century Optics 16:9 anamorphic in front of the 55mm Micro Nikkon f2.8 and probably all the other 50mm or thereabouts SLR lenses. It also works on the Tamron 130mm f2.8 so will likely work on other lenses between 50mm and 130mm. On the 300mm it is decidedly furry but will hold focus on closer objects so may work on the longer lens if more attention is paid to back focus. I had not been too meticulous with it as I was changing lenses back and forth.

A side note - I would not recommend taking your Agus35 into a conflict zone unless you can make it look like something totally benign, like paint it canary yellow or pink or something, definitely not black. It may make somebody nervous and get you shot. A humble public passing by, became a bit agitated and made that comment to me this evening. It apparently looks like an old fashioned Elliot Ness tommy gun sawn off.

January 10th, 2004, 08:24 PM	#768
J. Clayton Stansberry Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Colorado Posts: 316	I just got the recommended pack of Maxwell CD-R's (blue pack) and I got the frosted CD, and let me tell you that it has yeilded better results than my attempts at sanding....it was awesome! I am not even using a fresnel and the image seems to be clear and the DOF is freaking incredible. I am using a Nikon 85mm lens and it is working fine, just a little more zoomed than a 50mm. Will the fresnel improve the image or is it just for making the image larger on the GG so you don't have to zoom in as far with the camcorder? I imagine the latter...Anyway, on to Bob's suggestions to get rid of the noise. Maybe I can get some tests together tomorrow...we'll see...good luck and happy agusing!!!! __________________ I understand everything about nothing.

January 10th, 2004, 09:48 PM	#769
Jeremiah Rickert Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Newberg, Oregon Posts: 494	Magnifying Lens For people still searching for a good magnifying lens...my grandpa had a busted workshop light, one of those that has a magnifying glass with a circular bulb around it, and I was able to extract the lens and it works perfectly. Seems like pretty decent glass too. Jeremiah

January 11th, 2004, 01:00 AM	#770
Agus Casse Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Guatemala Posts: 322	<<<-- Originally posted by J. Clayton Stansberry : ...Will the fresnel improve the image or is it just for making the image larger on the GG so you don't have to zoom in as far with the camcorder?... -->>> Yeah Fresnel will not only magnify but will not distord the image, it magnify and correct it so you just put your dv camera and zoom until no vigneting with no trouble. I have noticed that i can full zoom and get excellent image by using the SLR camera and DV camera configuration (you put the slr camera and the dv in the slr viewfinder. Today we started a short film with be used to show up the agus35 comercial capabilities.. we are still waiting for for our roof pentaprims and electronic lens to continue the developing. Also we want to give compability to XL1s owners. __________________ Agus35 - the ultimate tool for indie DV filmakers -

January 11th, 2004, 12:49 PM	#771
Filip Kovcin Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: warsaw, poland Posts: 440	Re: Magnifying Lens <<<-- Originally posted by Jeremiah Rickert : ...my grandpa had a busted workshop light, one of those that has a magnifying glass with a circular bulb around it -->>> Jeremiah, can you send to someone or make the link to proper page with the picture of that part from the workshop light, just to know what is it about. i didn't understood how it may look. thanks, filip

January 11th, 2004, 12:58 PM	#772
Isaiah Kraus New Boot Join Date: May 2003 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 7	Addressing the Image Horz/Vert Flip Problem I am in the process of building a project-box agus for my GL2, and came up with this idea for at least getting a preview of shots the right way up/around while you shoot them. That said, it requires a computer connected to the camera via firewire, and special software. I have tested it with my Mac G5 1.8sp, the software "PixelShox Studio," and a Sony TRV18. Basically the computer-software horizontally and vertically flips the incoming f/w video stream (from the DVcam in CAMERA mode) and displays the results on the computer monitor. The recorded-to-tape footage still must be flipped in post, but now you can have a computer (laptop?) monitor to give you a visual approximation when you shoot/set up shots. PixelShox is free Video-DJ (VJ) software, and is not available for PC. However there are other PC VJ programs that might (hopefully) be capable of doing the same thing if you are on a PC (check out vjcentral.com). If anyone is interested, I can give details on how how to use PixelShox to accept the f/w stream, flip/invert it, and display the results full-screen. BTW, PixelShox can also just display the f/w video without flipping/inverting, allowing you to use a mac computer (laptop?) as a kind of field monitor for non-agus setups too. Note: From what I understand, PixelShox relies heavily on OpenGL h/w acceleration. I'm not sure how usable it is on Mac laptops. I do not own a Mac laptop. -Isaiah

January 10th, 2004, 06:06 PM	#766
Ryan Henry New Boot Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Marquette, Michigan, US Posts: 14	You're a little unclear in your question. The 35mm lense projects an image on the ground glass. A 50mm lense would result in an image similar to that made in a film camera with a 50mm lense. The camera just records that image. The DV camera has nothing to do with the length.

January 10th, 2004, 06:23 PM	#767
Taylor Moore Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 94	Thanx Ryan. Got it. I guess it's time for me to start building.

January 12th, 2004, 08:42 AM	#773
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	Have just finished a test on a close-coupled non-inverting Agus35 using the telescope eyepiece lens set I have been carrying on about. With 3/8" taken off my adaptor, closer coupling was possible. The vignetting and barrel distortion went away. ##### ADDENDUM--- AFTER DISMANTLEMENT AND RE-ASSEMBLY, THE BARREL DISTORTION HAS RETURNED AND NO AMOUNT OF RE-ADJUSTMENT HAS MADE IT GO AWAY AGAIN. IN SAFE TV FRAMING IT IS NOT A SEVERE ISSUE. I SHALL FILM SOME MORE TESTS AND ASK CHRIS IF HE WILL POST THOSE RESULTS. ##### The image frame is variable from around the area of the motion picture 35mm widescreen gate which is what the Mini35 does, to about 2/3rds of a 35mm still camera frame. The test pattern at TV safe framing in adequate light is at the limit of the PD150. There is very slight softening in the corners which sharpens if the centre is softened by shifting camcorder focus. This Australian plumber's version of the Agus has the case, lens mounts and bayonet mount to the PD150 sourced from PVC plumbers hardware (in two colours, grey and white). It fits up direct to the PD150 onto the lens hood bayonet fitting. The telescope eyepiece goes into the 58mm filter thread on the PD150 and the lens tube slides on over it. For small lenses up to the 135mm Auto Tamron which I tested today, this would be adequate support in a non-energetic environment. For larger lenses a base support would be wise as the cutout clearance for the CD groundglass in the PVC lens tube weakens it. The CD spindle motor came from a deceased CD player. The lens set came from a 2" 42mm telescope eyepiece which I had bought from a camera store to make up a second NV relay prototype. A 10x single element close-up lens will be way cheaper though it may soften the corners more than the eyepiece does. It also may not permit close coupling right up to the front of the camcorder case.

January 13th, 2004, 07:56 PM	#774
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	There are some .jpg joined before-and-after images of focus pulls with Agus35 to PD150 after the firm lens mounts were made from the PVC pipe caps. The images have filenames which look like agusfs2.jpg or similar. Thanks to kennelmaster Chris for posting them. The 35mm lenses were 1970s Tamron Adaptamatics of 28mm f2.8 and 135mm f2.8 and a Micro-Nikkor 55mm f2.8. The 55mm and 135mm give good fill of light into the corners. I haven't tried the long lenses yet as they need added support. The 28mm f2.8 has a distinct hotspot in the centre, about 4 f-stops worth. These were all relayed via the 1x +2x +4x Hoya close-up lens stack.

January 13th, 2004, 11:25 PM	#775
Jeremiah Rickert Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Newberg, Oregon Posts: 494	Maxell CD-R??? Someone posted that the blue 25 pack of maxell cd-r's came with the frosted CDs. What is the spindle called precisely? I picked up a blue maxell spindle, and it was $25, and of course when I cracked it open, no frosted CDs. They were called CD-R Pro and they were the only blue spindles at Office Max and Staples. So....what's the precise name of the CD-R's with the frosted CD? Thanks! Jeremiah

January 14th, 2004, 12:05 AM	#776
Agus Casse Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Guatemala Posts: 322	For all who are using a discman motor with 2AA baterries, i got some news... IT WONT SPIN FAST ENOUGH... well, the worst part is that we noticed this after we shoot a whole day. So, what i suggest is to replace it with a 9v battery, just be sure not to forget to shut it down once the shoot ends. __________________ Agus35 - the ultimate tool for indie DV filmakers -

January 14th, 2004, 12:40 AM	#777
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	Bob Hart's latest images are up! See directory at http://www.dvinfo.net/media/hart. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

January 14th, 2004, 03:56 AM	#778
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	Agus. If you have another disk and can easily mount it, put that one in and write some numbers and some big, small and tiny marks around the disk. Do some test recording and see if the numbers and marks are clear and move past fairly slowly or can't be seen except as blurry arcs. If they can be seen it means the disk rpm is close to camera frame rate or a multiple or fraction of it. I find that flickering happens at several speeds as the disc revs up. The discman motor rpm might be close to the camera frame rate or a multiple of it. Instead of putting more power to the motor you might get away with finding something between 1.5v and 3v by using a resistor and running the motor slightly slower.

January 14th, 2004, 09:32 AM	#779
Agus Casse Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Guatemala Posts: 322	good idea, i will check the footage of yesterday, if it doesnt flicker, may be those words of "at 200mph i got no friends" will be true. Cause damn the disc is spining fast at 9v .... __________________ Agus35 - the ultimate tool for indie DV filmakers -

January 14th, 2004, 10:01 AM	#780
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	Agus. Please re-read my post above. I dropped half a sentence out of the first paragraph when I cut and pasted it in so a piece was missing when you read it. For all, I have just sent Chris a large .jpg file of tests done with the telescope eyepiece as a relay lens. These are also comparison frames of 4:3 and 16:9 through the same 35mm objective lens. The .jpg file is identified by the filename aguswscr.jpg The good news is, you can use your Century Optics 16:9 anamorphic in front of the 55mm Micro Nikkon f2.8 and probably all the other 50mm or thereabouts SLR lenses. It also works on the Tamron 130mm f2.8 so will likely work on other lenses between 50mm and 130mm. On the 300mm it is decidedly furry but will hold focus on closer objects so may work on the longer lens if more attention is paid to back focus. I had not been too meticulous with it as I was changing lenses back and forth. A side note - I would not recommend taking your Agus35 into a conflict zone unless you can make it look like something totally benign, like paint it canary yellow or pink or something, definitely not black. It may make somebody nervous and get you shot. A humble public passing by, became a bit agitated and made that comment to me this evening. It apparently looks like an old fashioned Elliot Ness tommy gun sawn off.