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Old December 23rd, 2003, 05:54 PM   #16
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I am sorry !
So i cannot explain myself correctly because this is not my original language ,so this mean a big difference when i write these line.
I must excuse myself ,I am not if in anger that lets it suppose my remarks !

Now I would like you to know that ,I bought the mini35 today.
a used.
I will receive it in the next days !
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Old December 23rd, 2003, 06:32 PM   #17
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Best of luck with the Mini35, have fun and make pretty pictures!
Charles Papert
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Old December 24th, 2003, 10:01 AM   #18
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Congrats on the purchase. We all look forward to seeing your results.

Excuse Don, Charles, and I...we all seem to have been particularly bitten by the holiday spirit this year.

I cannot speak for Don and Charles, but my comments were certainly not specifically directed at you and I doubt Charles and Don's were. The frustration we feel is towards a video industry that has used all the devilish tricks of marketing to convince people that digital filmmaking is cheap and easy, requiring no more tools then what they include in the box. And it's true, for family trips, birthday parties, (semi)private motel videos, etc. If you want to achieve a "Hollywood" image then a much larger commitment to your craft is required, in all respects. This is not to say that the "Hollywood" image is the end all, be all, but for many, it's their goal.

A lot of this would fall into what I consider to be social conditioning. Don't necessarily strive to copy, while steeped in 100 year tradition, what is empirically a formula for making money. Seek out your own vision and create pieces that are meaningful to yourself.

This argument can easily be expanded into film blow-ups as well. At this point in time, anyone who is preparing to shoot a MiniDV movie should wipe the socially conditioned words film blow-up from their minds, it is simply not something you need to worry about. Shooting for Sundance your first time out is unrealistic. For the late 2004 - 2005 festival seasons most of the festivals that your movie will be appropriate for will be doing some form of digital or analog projection, with only a sparing few actually screening on film. By 2006 there will be a significant proliferation of digital projection systems in theatres to allow for some to start distributing theatrically. Don't worry about a blow-up. Worry about making a good movie. If all the pieces fall into place, someone else is going to pay for the blow-up and dupes for a major theatrical run. Let them worry about film blow-ups. You are a digital filmmaker, and while we all owe what we have to celluloid, you are no longer bound to the chemical world. You have transceded and are ready to take your place among the membership - await the revolution, brother, await the revolution!!!!!

One final note. Daniel, your use of our language is much appreciated and apologies are in order if we seem to mock your ability. I'm sure any one of us would have 10 times more difficulty in trying to communicate socially in your language, let alone technically. We Americans get a little uppity sometimes and we often forget that while most of the world does speak English, it's because they've bothered to learn it as a second language to appease the social and cultural norm. It's good to be the super-power ;)

Signing off for now on this Neo-Pagan Solstice semi-christian holiday eve. May the spirits of evil become confused on the way to your house :D

Posts before Feb 2004 were on behalf of ZGC, afterwards they're all mine!
Mizell Wilson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 24th, 2003, 04:25 PM   #19
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Really well put, Mizell. And seconded.

Likewise, my thoughts were (as I hinted but probably should have stressed more clearly) were not addressed directly to Daniel, and I too appreciate the language struggle. It can be hard to determine the tone and intention of a post even when it is in the mother tongue. I'm not a fan of emoticons, myself, finding that it's too easy for someone to make a dig and then slap a smiley on it so it won't be considered a flame.

Anyway, happy holidays to all and here's to making great movies in 2004!
Charles Papert
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Old December 28th, 2003, 05:48 PM   #20
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cheers to charles, don and mizell

as someone who's been planning his first feature on 16mm, and only recently become interested in dv, mini35, home pc nle's et al, i couldn't agree more with what you guy's have said. cheers and happy new year.


ps hey mizell, met you in calgary at sait. sold any of those new 400's (set up with a dvx100) to any rental houses in my neck of the woods yet.
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Old December 29th, 2003, 10:55 PM   #21
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The MiniDV People are Coming From a Different World

Film students start with wanting to make films...the process, the industry is what they want to learn. In this world, budgets can be in the millions and low budget is $100k.

MiniDV people start with the camera...usually a consumer camera. As they expand, they think in terms of equipment. In this world budgets, including equipment, are at most a few thousand dollars, and $10k is a lot of money.

But some come to the same place...script, casting, storyboard, breakdown, schedule, budget, production, post, and distribution. Even if it is little films for their own use.

Where the DVX100 and SDX900 made the 24p effect something videographers could use, the Mini35 seems to do this with focus. I have a lot of questions about it (I will post over the next few weeks); the Mini35 seems to make the image look even more like film. And allow the film (video?) maker greater ability to focus the audience's attention.

I would like to see a feature like that built into the camera!


The Singleton books, while very informative, deal with a budget that few will reach. There are other books on making movies for $10k or $50k or $250k that may be closer to the amateur film maker's reality.
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Old January 1st, 2004, 02:26 PM   #22
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Hey All,

Joe - great to meet you at SAIT, thank you for coming out. No one in Canada has pulled the trigger yet, but hopefully will in the next month or two.

David - Very good points. The fact is many "film students" are often sold the wrong idea as well. Many programs teach them just what they want to hear, that they'll be able to leave school as a director or DP, which is simply not true except for the lucky few.

The working "film industry" is simply not taught in most American schools. Your first job out of college, for "the industry" is going to be as PA, a grip of some sort, or if your lucky, a 2nd 2nd Director or 2nd AC...if you are lucky enough to score a paying position at all. The simply fact remains that it's quite simple to break into the "working" film industry...if you can afford to work for free for 6 - 12 months. (Charles chime in if you have more "hands on" reflections).

I think the general gist of the conversation is that most "independent filmmakers" today, or those at the level of this board, simply do not take into consideration the overall time, effort, and most importantly, money it takes to make a serious career of filmmaking.

You are absolutely right that Singleton's books are representative of budgets and schedules that most will not achieve. I mentioned them for two reasons. First, they are simply the texts used in my grad school producing class, so I am most familiar with their techniques. Second, while they do not reflect what most of the readers will be undertaking, it does offer a point of perspective for complaining that a $9,000 camera adapter is a lot of money for making a reality it's the tip of the iceberg.

In the end everyone should realize that we stand here with open arms, ready to embrace our bretheren (and sisteren ;) ) into this wonderful world that we inhabit but, as in all societies and cultures, there are rules and ettiqutte to be followed and a mind set that must be comprehended and adhered to. Filmmaking is an artform and a craft, and to be serious in either, you need to be serious about the proper tools.

Enjoy the rest of your weekends. It's back to the full time grind as of Monday.

Happy New Year to all, and to all...may the spirits of evil become entangled terrible on the way to your house.

Posts before Feb 2004 were on behalf of ZGC, afterwards they're all mine!
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