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Old October 23rd, 2005, 03:01 PM   #1
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Micro35 Urgent Help Needed

OK, so..... I'm shooting a feature length horror flick. I am in no position to do so, I sont have the money, nor the contacts to make one, but I have my mind set on it now. Above all, I have the dream, the ambition and the enthusiasm which I believe will get me there.

I've recently got sponsored by a local website and they have aggreed to finance half of my budget, currently at around 2000 (i know, its not much).

So, I am going to shoot it digitally (obviously). I really want to purchase the Micro35 Indie package which is detailed below.

micro35 Indie Bundle

Includes:

* micro35 Cinema Lens Adapter
* micro35 Achromatic lens
* 15mm Rod Support System
* Your choice of SLR lens mount
* micro35 Cinematographer's cap


I will be shooting it on 3 Sony PDX10's. First off, has anyone used the Micro35 with the PDX10???

Secondly, in that list, does it include a 35mm lens?

If not, can someone help me try and figure out what lens's I will need and at what cost. I need the real basics. Ive never worked with more than a screw on wide angle lense before!!!

Please reply, any help at all would be fantastic! Its really the second point I need help with - The lens question.

Thanks, DVInfo comes to my rescue again!

Jason Bradbury
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Old October 23rd, 2005, 03:14 PM   #2
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As far as I know, it does not include a 35mm SLR lens, you have to get that yourself, but the redrock forum would be the best place to go to ask:

www.redrockmicro.com
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Old October 24th, 2005, 08:37 PM   #3
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Firstly, you should be aware that the Micro35 takes about 12 weeks to ship, though their website says 4-6 weeks. Most feel the wait is worth it but you definitely should NOT schedule a shoot until you have the unit in your hands.

It does not include a 35mm lens.

You should paruse their discussion forums and see what people are saying. I'm not sure if enough people have actually received the unit for there to be true feedback on each camera, specifically yours -- but many cameras require shim kits for a proper fit. Chances are that the unit will work with your camera; just make sure you order everything you need to make it work all at once. It would suck to have to wait 12 weeks for the Micro35 and another 12 weeks for the little shim kit.

As far as lenses are concerned, if you are on a supertight budget I would start with a wide-angle zoom lens. It's versatile and will cover the spectrum unless you require an extreme zoom. Downsides are that there will be slightly more interpolation, a bit more barrel distortion, etc.

I know that you can find a decent Canon zoom on Ebay for around $200. If you want individual lenses I would just count on $200 per lens as a rule of thumb. What range you get really depends on your taste and what types of shots you're trying to achieve. I would do a 28mm, 50mm, 85mm, and 100mm.

Good luck!
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Old October 24th, 2005, 08:46 PM   #4
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Hey Jason,
This sounds like it's your first film, it that so?

If that is true I would stay away from the Micro35 as it will end up making you movie worse. It is much muhc more challanging for ANY film maker (not just first timers) to make a movie using 35mm primes. There are many challanges to deal with and very very few people do it right. In fact I've never seen anyone do it right with a Micro35.

It really comes down to story telling. Having a micro35 will not help you tell your story. period. It might seem like the holy grail, having all that depth of field but it kills so many student films because they don't know how to use it..depth of field that is. Go watch some student films (shot on FILM) and you'll see what I mean. The FILM nor the depth of field can save them if they do not tell a good story.

In my opinion, you should save you money for something you really NEED to make your movie.

My 2 c,
Eric James

p.s. for those haters out there: I have shot over 10 hours with a Micro35 and I've also shot on 16mm and super 16mm so I'd like to think I know what I'm talking about.
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Old October 24th, 2005, 09:52 PM   #5
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Eric,
I am glad to learn you have shoot 16/s16mm (and therefore you know the "real thing") AND also own a Micro35. Your opinion counts a lot here.

What I do not get is how did you find challenging shooting Micro35 having shoot film? From what exactly point stand? Could you elaborate, please?

Using an (equally?) challenging medium as film without the expense associated with shooting real film, should be a good training for aspiring "film makers" wouldn't it? I got the point of "not indicated for the first feature", but otherwise?

Back 10 or even five years, you got the chance to shoot either or. (film/video)
Now, you can shoot video (a much more challenging video) and get ready for film (if ever, but non the less) Your view counts. What specific challenges are you talking about in regards to using SLR primes? Any further details?
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Old October 24th, 2005, 10:00 PM   #6
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Hey Jason,

I got the Micro35. I don't have the Sony...so I can't speak for the Sony. But I have the DVX100A. I would agree with Ben...in which there is a wait for the adapter. But now that I got mine, it's well worth it.

Another thing I would agree with Ben is "They don't come with lenses."

There is a list to choose from Cineman lens mount such as the PL and OCT19 to the SLR lens. In the likelyhood you still have some of your still film camera...check which lens you have. You can save money by getting a mount that would that the lens.

I personally have Nikon and very happy with the quality. And depending on how tight your budget really is...you can opt for cheaper lens that would fit on the nikon mount...ie Tamron, Sigma, Tokina, and Phoenix. I have a Sigma so I can say I like that lens. I don't have any of the either, so I can't say on quality. You can always RENT the SLR lens too.

Now that I have it...I know it's going to take more time prepping for the shoot and during the shoot. So as Eric says, if this is your first feature...depending on your crew...and experience...I wouldn't shoot it with the Micro.

First I thought I can light and do camera...which I can, but it would take forever...something will suffer. I would definitely have a crew member to focus just on operating the camera with the Micro.

As far as seeing people do it right with the Micro35...I would say I have seem people get great results. Jason you can check the micro forum for clips.

I would just finally say...since you want it to look like film. You should prep it like it was film and Light it like it's film. Meaning give it alot of thought and meticulously plan.

Good luck. Hope to see you over at redrock forum. Of course...you can just order it now because of the delay. By the time you shoot your Next project...you'll have it. :)
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Old October 24th, 2005, 11:37 PM   #7
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Hey Dan,
I suppose my post may have seemed anti-film and anti-35mm adapter. I didn't mean it to be that way at all. I think both of these are very very important tools, but if there is not a good story they will only make it worse in the case of a beginner.

Referring to one of your other questions: to me at least, shooting with primes is a much much more involved process (not always a bad thing)than shooting with a stock video zoom. This film sounds like a one man + crew, run and gun, low budget film. In my mind adding any complexity to the technical aspect of making a low budget film will only get in the way.

First and foremost the reason for my post is that the added value he will get(if any) from shooting with a micro35 is not worth half of his budget. The money could be spent somewhere else to improve the film on a much greater level (good DP, or lights, or audio).

My 2 c,
Eric James

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Diaconu
Eric,
I am glad to learn you have shoot 16/s16mm (and therefore you know the "real thing") AND also own a Micro35. Your opinion counts a lot here.

What I do not get is how did you find challenging shooting Micro35 having shoot film? From what exactly point stand? Could you elaborate, please?

Using an (equally?) challenging medium as film without the expense associated with shooting real film, should be a good training for aspiring "film makers" wouldn't it? I got the point of "not indicated for the first feature", but otherwise?

Back 10 or even five years, you got the chance to shoot either or. (film/video)
Now, you can shoot video (a much more challenging video) and get ready for film (if ever, but non the less) Your view counts. What specific challenges are you talking about in regards to using SLR primes? Any further details?
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Old October 25th, 2005, 12:47 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric James
if there is not a good story they(adapters) will only make it worse in the case of a beginner.
even if the story is the best ever written, the result would be the same ... (under the circumstances)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric James
The money could be spent somewhere else to improve the film on a much greater level (good DP, or lights, or audio).
would <that> improve the story?

the story telling tools (all technical means) and the story telling craft (directing, acting)should be seen and considered separately from the story (I think). Just having fun here... no-nothn' intended (;-)<

On a serious tone, Jason
First pick your "weapon" (camera, Micro35, whatever)
Second, train yourself to use them and become proficient at doing it!
Third: WHEN YOU ARE READY, go to war! (start shooting)
Give yourself at least a week or two BEFORE it matters!
Think this way: new solder at war with a new weapon in his hands. Chances of survival? (or victory)
That is, if you want to win. If is just practice and it does not matter anyway.... whatever works just fine.

None of these contraptions come with lenses. You must choose lenses and brand (Canon, Nikon, etc) fit them in the budget and learn FAST how to use them, (so you can use them when it matters)

In all honesty here is a fair advice (if I may):
Get the Micro (since you’ve got the itch for it) play with it long enough to learn to use it (if you are fascinated by the new “toy”) …….or … (in case you want this movie more than the “toy”) focus on story, story telling (acting , directing, plan the shoots and the editing, do a story board if need be) and you might be better off in keeping someone in front of the TV to watch your effort. You know better what YOU want.

Eric, we both said the same thing in the end.
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Old October 25th, 2005, 12:27 PM   #9
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Hey Dan,
Very good points! Hopefully our playfull dicussion has helped Jason somewhat.

Thanks,
Eric James
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