New Music Video Shot with 35mm Adapter - Page 3 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Alternative Imaging Methods

Alternative Imaging Methods
DV Info Net is the birthplace of all 35mm adapters.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 28th, 2006, 01:20 AM   #31
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brunei
Posts: 140
Hi Nic,

I think I have seen your mini35 before. I think its the one where you have a roller bearing connected to a pulley system to a motor that turns the GG. I have a picture of it. I am just wondering if you wouldn't mind to share how you go about building it. Specifically the parts needed to build it. Can you direct me to where I can get these parts. Money is not an object at this point as I am still trying hard to build one I like in terms of picture quality. I have to say, your adaptor has been the best I have seen so far. I know some of the parts are custom made, you have any schematic on this? Thanks.

Alex
Alex Chong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2006, 01:58 PM   #32
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: upton uk
Posts: 104
Hi Alex,

Thanks for the interest mate. As I mentioned before in this post, i can't explain the inner workings of my adapter, however I will say that i have scrapped the bearing design now. It does have potential, but needs a lot more investment then i can afford to perfect it.

I think as far as aesthetics go, i'd like to think that my work looks nice predominantly becuase of the work and effort i have put into it, rather then the design of my adapter. I do constantly strive for the best quality image, as we all do, but i think its important to eastablish a balance between studying filmaking, and constructing the equipment you can't afford to buy, but need to achieve the results you want.

I would certainly say that the majority of my time is spent studying cinematography and the other various skills needed to be a low budget filmaker theese days, rather than working on my adapter.

I dont think the adapter is the key, but just another tool (albeit an important one). The riddle for example, or the 3lflex video was shot with a cheap 10 macro off ebay, and without a condenser, justa spinning gg. Also, everything i shot before that, like the lynden david hall video for example, i didn't use an adapter at all, and i don't think it looked too bad.

I am not trying to negate the importance of my adapter to my work, they really do help tremendously with creating a high budget look, but i am always very concious of how obsessed I can allow myself to be with one element of fimmaking, becuase it will allways be to the detrement of the other countless aspects i have to learn to progress.

I am absolutely certain there are numerous adapters on the market which could and have been used to the same effect as mine, so im not sure i would worry too much about it. The work i completed prior to this last one was made with an adapter which i believe wasn't anywhere near as good as numerous current commercial products. The adapter was vignetting, blurring towards the edges and the chroma separation was pretty awfull.

Sorry I cant be of any more help, but i would reccomend, if you are concearned about your adapter, and the quality of the images it is producing, getting hold of Wayne Kinney, and buying one of his new SGPRO's. I have a feeling the next batch he is going to make will wipe the floor with numerous other products on the market in tearms of image quality, and sharpness etc..... Just a Hunch!

Thanks for the question,

Nick
Nicholas Bartleet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 28th, 2006, 03:16 PM   #33
Major Player
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 219
Hi Nick,

Always love the video work that you've done.

Question, will you be trading in your FX1 for the new Cannon hdv camcorder coming out?

I hope you'll keep posting new videos when you have new ones done.
John Kang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2006, 06:28 AM   #34
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: upton uk
Posts: 104
Hi John,

Thanks mate, i'm really glad you like the work i have done.

I do like the look of the xh g1, but untill an sdi lossless capture system comes out at an affordable price, i will stick with the fx1. That is of course unless the red or silicon cams start shipping, and i come accross a bit of money.

I really want to get into an uncompressed workflow, or at least a ciniform or dvcpro hd workflow, but i wont switch cams untill that is possible for me to do within budget.

I have a G5 with a Kona LH capture card, which i bought for greenscreen work, so i could capture dvcpro-hd. I was considering buying a touchscreen lcd, and a small generator for capturing on location, but i think it would slow things down, so i think ill have to just wait.

I just wish the wafian was $5k... then i'd buy one, along with everyone else in the world.


Nick
Nicholas Bartleet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2006, 07:29 AM   #35
Trustee
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Hollywood, CA
Posts: 1,675
Images: 1
Yes...sadly...every time I think about the uncompressed capability of the CCDs and optics on the FX1...it sickens me to see those beasts leashed and tethered so tightly...
__________________
BenWinter.com
Ben Winter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2006, 09:42 PM   #36
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brunei
Posts: 140
Hi Nic,

One questionregarding the spinning GG. What RPM is best suited to spinning a GG without the grain showwing up? I know the higher the better, but whats the minimum you would go for with a shutter speed of 1/200.

Thanks.
Alex Chong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2006, 04:42 AM   #37
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: upton uk
Posts: 104
Hi Alex,

I have absolutely no idea i'm afraid. My motor has a speed regulator on it, and i just crank it up as high as i need to. There is no answer to that question, becuase it will depend on various variables, such as how well cut your disk is, what finish you have, i.e the grain size, and more importantly the evenness of the diffusion. Really, that is the sort of question you will have to answer with some trial and error, based on your design, and components.

Thanks, Nick
Nicholas Bartleet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2006, 04:49 AM   #38
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Breda, Netherlands
Posts: 141
Looks great man, also the other films on your site.. I also like the 3-men-is-a-crew idea.. Do you always work with such a small crew or do i overlook something?
__________________
www.wanah.nl
Djee Smit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2006, 05:02 AM   #39
Major Player
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ventura, California, USA
Posts: 751
Don't take this the wrong way but I can't swallow that "I can't say" line about the workings of your adapter. You're not protecting Wayne's intellectual property, as he is making his development work completely publically available to anyone who wants to purchase it. Yet the bits of your adapter you built, you also won't divulge. And allegedly you feel you have nothing to hide since you say it's not your adapter, but rather your effort, that give you your look. Again, don't take this the wrong way but it seems as though you're worried disclosing information about your adapter would then give anybody else the ability to create footage like yours.

The most impressive people are those who show everything and say "here's what I used to make my masterpiece," because it's not about having a secret tool or withholding some advantageous knowledge from others. They don't need to keep anything secret because their skill is how they created their results.

I live near one of the top surfboard shapers on the planet and unlike many fairly talented people who aspire to be like him, he is very humble and very open. He says it's all just sanding foam. You can ask about tools or products or about various contours and curvatures, and he'll tell you. He's so confident in his abilities that he'll share everything he's learned yet still rest comfortably knowing that nothing more than his experience and talent are enough to create competitive results.

Again, don't take that the wrong way, just look at it as an outsider would, which is "he says he built it using a few parts from Wayne, yet he claims he can't talk about it at all."

The only reason I bring this up is, you've learned a tremendous amount from this forum and the spirit of the forum is to share information.
Bill Porter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2006, 06:12 AM   #40
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: upton uk
Posts: 104
Hi Djee,

Yep, i always work with a small crew, becuase i like to make sure there arn't too many people knocking around without anything to do. I would like to find one or two more skilled people to work with, however it is always difficult on such a tight budget.

Hi Bill,

I can appreciate you are very frustrated, but let me just clear up a few simple points.

As you stated in your assult, wayne is offering to sell his development work to anyone who wants to buy it. I have neither the inclination or the right to sell his hard work to you and certainly not to disclose work which he has not yet implemented into his designs for free on this forum.

I am not afraid that someone else will steal my magic adapter, and start shooting incredible work, becuase that would only benifit me.
There are allready numerous commercial adapters on the market, which are being used by professionals to better effect then me. Putting waynes adapter aside, just visit the redrock website, and download some of the astonishing work on there.

http://www.redrockmicro.com/samples.html

So no, I am well aware that my adapter is not magic, and that I, along with many of the people on the above link, and people all over the world and on this forum for that matter are using commercial and home built adapters from the psteknic to the letus35 to the redrockmicro, to great effect, but that is only becuase of the skills they have aquired from learning about the art of film making, and sugguesting that this may not be the case is ridiculous, and insulting to those people who dedicate every moment of their lives to the art.

There have been times where i have considered a commercial version of my adapter and have therefore wanted to keep things quiet. I have in the past, when the design was entirely mine, posted photographs, as mentioned previously in this thread and descriptions of the inner workings of my adapter so that it may help anyone who wishes to know how it works. A design, which i am now convinced was inferiour to almost all the adapters on the market at that time.

Really, what do you wish me to discuss with you... what information do you need. The device is a spinning plastic disk, with a condenser lens and an achromat. I cant tell you what lenses i am using, becuase these are components which are likely to be used in the upcoming SGPRO's, but I hardly think this warrents becoming so hostile.

When you say:

"because it's not about having a secret tool or withholding some advantageous knowledge from others. They don't need to keep anything secret because their skill is how they created their results."

You are absolutely right, and I find it hard to believe that people do think i have a secret tool, but they really do, people like you. I feel very sad for people who have this point of view, becuase it can only ever hold them back. Its the the glass is half empty view. Why not look at what you have instead of attacking me for not providing you with information which I am not in a position to provide. You have now 10+ commercial adapters, all of differing prices and qualities. You have enough information on this forum, (provided by people without any invested interest) to build the best adapter in the world, but yet you still moan at me. Why dont you email redrockmicro and moan at them for not telling you where they buy their achromats from.

When i made my first adapters, there was only one or two people making adapters, and not one commercial version other then the psteknic, and my design was totally different. I was considering marketing it, but in the mean time provided an outline of how the design worked for other people to develop themselves. At this stage, i would have been over the moon if redrock had their product on the market, becuase it would have saved me a lot of time, and a hell of a lot of money.

When wayne kinney first contacted me, when he was considering making a commercial adapter, I was reluctant to provide him with all of my research, becuase I was still considering making a commercial version, however, i gradually shared with him my findings, research and parts suppliers, and we ended up sharing information regularly since, obviously under the assumption that i was not going to come on this forum, and blab about it to you.

I get countless emails from people, 90% of which are asking how i made such an incredible adapter which produces images which are so much better then any other adapter, yet I know this not to be the case.... it's very frustrating.

I have stated on so many occasions, that people shouldn't worry about the adapter so much. I have seen people spend the last 2 years dedicated to building the perfect adapter, people who have not once strayed beyond their back garden with it to do 'test shots', and I think to myself if they had spent that time and dedication reading about cinematography, they could be making some awsome stuff, with an adapter of half the quality.

Up untill recently my adapter was a bag of shyte, but i had no choice other than to try and push it and get the best from it. Hell the adapter i used for the riddle was so loud, i had to ADR the entire project, but that is how it goes, and as i mentioned before, if you want to know what lenses i was using prior to this last project, i was using a Macro off ebay 72mm, and a PCX from surpless shed.... forget the fl.

If you want an honest bit of advice about building an adapter ill give it to you. The key is in the achromat, and you will probably have to get something custom made or spend a lot of money.... A cheap achromat from surpless shed or anchor optics is unlikely to ever yield decent results, becuase the design is specifically for lazers and scientific experiments, not usually for optics, and this purpose. But that is probably not what you want to hear.... you want me to say go here and buy one of these for $20 right?

The achromat in my adapter cost hundreds of pounds, but wayne will be implementing something very similar into his adapters very shortly.

Thanks for the long and tiresome assult, I hope this answers your questions.

Nick
Nicholas Bartleet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2006, 12:24 PM   #41
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 320
Hi Nick,

I'm quite impressed by your work. I went through your website the other day and ended up downloading every video you had there. You've managed to achieve a great look throughout all your work! The lighting, DOF from your adapter, colour correction, editing, and even the 3d animation. Just a couple of questions I'd like to ask.

Firstly, you've done a really great job with the colour grading in all the videos on your website. Can I ask what plugins or tools you use for that, and if it's done during the compositing stage or editing?

Also, you speak highly of an upcoming version of Wayne's SG Pro adapter. I was actually thinking of buying an SG Pro sometime soon. But after reading what you wrote about a superior future model, I'm wondering if I should just keep waiting until that's ready to go? If you're reading this Wayne, is there anything you can add about this next model you'll releasing? Time frame etc?

Glenn
Glenn Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2006, 12:35 PM   #42
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Brighton, East Sussex, UK
Posts: 938
Glenn,

The new model of the SGpro will mainly add support for more camcorders, like the JVC HD100, which does not currently work with the SGpro.
__________________
Thanks,
Wayne.
Wayne Kinney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2006, 02:36 PM   #43
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 276
Images: 2
Nick,

Again... yet again. Beautiful work! Muy Combustion love. I wanted to throw out there, have you tried Synthetic Aperature for After Effects yet? I'm actually liking some of its grading capabilities more than whats available in Combustion.

If you have a chance, and have any available - can you post some photos of your lighting and stage setups? I'd like to see how you threw lighting on that scene in the waiting room (see exactly how much light you filled with) and also how you dropped lights in the operating room.
Jeremy Hughes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2006, 03:05 PM   #44
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 320
Wayne,

Cheers, yeah I didn't think it could really be improved on much at all, judging by the image quality of the latest clips I've downloaded from your website. I'll get in contact with you sometime soon as I have a few minor questions to ask aswell.
Glenn Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 4th, 2006, 12:12 AM   #45
Major Player
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ventura, California, USA
Posts: 751
Nick,

Wow, I touched a nerve there (you took it as an assault) even though I was careful to say "Don't take this the wrong way."

I'm not frustrated and I don't think you have any particular secret. I just pointed out that you keep claiming your adapter is different than Wayne's, yet you won't even spill the beans on your own stuff. You say you decided not to go into business so there's no reason not to share what you've learned from this board. Giving back, it's called.

No attack here, nor was my previous post, if you re-read it without being so defensive.

As for my "long and tiresome assult" (assault?), mine wasn't half as long as yours, so I don't follow you there.

I'm not even having trouble with my adapter; mine works great. I was given a very expensive achromat by someone in the business of selling 35mm adapters, which will probably blow your mind.

What I'm getting at is not what lenses you're using. I just asked for some details on your adapter. What's different about yours than Wayne's?

Try to calm down before you answer this time. I'm not attacking you and it's a basic question we've all been asked.
Bill Porter is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Alternative Imaging Methods

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:19 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network