The perfect 35mm adapter? at DVinfo.net
DV Info Net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Alternative Imaging Methods

Alternative Imaging Methods
DV Info Net is the birthplace of all 35mm adapters.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old November 17th, 2006, 03:53 PM   #1
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canary Wharf, London E14
Posts: 166
The perfect 35mm adapter?

With many adapters now on the market what separates them from one another. MINI35 and MOVIEtube are both robust, have 15mm and 19mm rod support, battery mount for supply to adapter, power out to external devices (viewfinder, LCD etc), BNC, robust carry handle, shoulder support, FF support and are built like a tank, well the MOVIEtube anyway, MINI35 is a little delicate for my liking. (inspected one this week)

On the otherhand the MINI35 requires a different £1,250 camera support for each camera and no universal battery mount (differs with each mount, many be a good thing for some but then there is the expense of a different battery for each mount)

One major flaw for both is the price £8,000+ for each, then there are the add ons and different mounts.

Then there are the DIY adapters: SG Pro, M2, Letus, Brevis, GO-35. These are very popular, great value for money as they offer the same quality images as the MINI35 and MOVIEtube plus they offer universal camcorder mounting (almost) but like the MINI35 and MOVIEtube they have their disadvantages; robustness, no additional connections, no adequete battery support.

Most of the people who buy the DIY adapters are probably film making enthusiasts and not production companies (although not for me to say).

With the 35mm adapters become more and more popular is it time for the DIY adapters to step up and move closer to the MINI35 and MOVIEtube pedigree?

What makes the perfect 35mm adapter, besides low cost? Your thoughts please.....

This thread is in no way a put down for commercial DIY adapters, but by people stating what they think would make the perfect 35mm adapter may assist DIY designers help improve their current products. Keep up the good work DIYers.
__________________
Tony Relph.
anthonyjohnrelph@hotmail.com
Tony Relph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 17th, 2006, 04:49 PM   #2
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Wellsboro, Pa
Posts: 285
One that doesn't absolutely EAT light.
Wade Spencer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 17th, 2006, 04:56 PM   #3
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canary Wharf, London E14
Posts: 166
Light loss seems to be the hate for all that use 35mm adapters but when filming shouldnt professional lighting be used anyway? Using redhead, brunette or blonde lighting should help this in some way. Are people using 60w light bulbs from their table lamp or something?
__________________
Tony Relph.
anthonyjohnrelph@hotmail.com
Tony Relph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 17th, 2006, 05:06 PM   #4
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canary Wharf, London E14
Posts: 166
For the DiGi35 I am looking to incorporate a V-mount, Viewfinder out, Fischer 2 Pin, 2 x 4 Pin, BNC and also a DC to DC convertor to enable 18-36v down to 12v
__________________
Tony Relph.
anthonyjohnrelph@hotmail.com
Tony Relph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 18th, 2006, 05:43 AM   #5
Trustee
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Honolulu, HI
Posts: 1,961
The problem with light loss is serious in that it may prevent the use of practical lighting. For instance, many digital camcorders can get a decent image of a nightime city skyline. If you want that skyline in your background with a 35mm adapter that loses two f-stops, you are out of luck. All the studio light in the world won't bring back a city skyling, or any such background, that an adapter gobbled up in the ground glass.

I used the Sony FX1 that has decent light sensitivity on a night shoot and not even a half stop of light loss would be acceptable. Fortunately, a 35mm adapter may not be necessary in these circumstances since it is easy to throw a cityscape out of focus. On the same shoot, we wanted to throw the businesses across the street out of focus but it wouldn't work. The trick of moving the camera backwards and zooming in had the double hit of reducing the angle of view and closing the lens down as we zoomed. We had to frame our shot in such a way that it almost was ruined.

Sometimes, good light sensitivity and shallow depth of field must be used together...
Marcus Marchesseault is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 20th, 2006, 10:32 AM   #6
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canary Wharf, London E14
Posts: 166
Just a quick question about the Nikon BR-3 mount. What the cheapest but good lens to use with this? A friend of mine is making a DIY adapter after reading about them on DVinfo. I havent actually really tested the nikons so dont know what works well, Ive been using ARRI T1.3 zeiss lenses. He has a small budget for the lens, any advice?
__________________
Tony Relph.
anthonyjohnrelph@hotmail.com
Tony Relph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 20th, 2006, 10:38 AM   #7
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Wellsboro, Pa
Posts: 285
My Lowell DP kit isn't exactly top of the line, but I wouldn't compare it to a table lamp either.....

Blasting the subject with light in a music video shoot, I still had to have the iris wide open, and then my range of what could be in focus was nil. Just not ideal in my opinion.

Granted, this one of the DIY adapters, and I thought the image was spectacular, but the light loss was just too great at this point.
Wade Spencer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 20th, 2006, 11:01 AM   #8
Major Player
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 916
Wade, that's precisely why the Brevis is designed for multiple diffusers, swapped by users. The standard diffuser has extremely low light loss (.5 to .7 stops with an f1.4 50mm attached), while diffuser option 1 and now, diffuser option 2, go up from there.

I just did my first tests with diffuser option 2 which I'm completely ecstatic about. Light loss is the greatest, (1.5 stops or so) but the emulation of film bokeh at those wide open apertures is going to make a lot of people very, very happy. I was expecting a hit in terms of sharpness, but this one may actually be right on par with the standard diffuser...which is very crisp. I'll wait until the xh-a1 shows up (this week?) to post some HD clips. Based on what I'm seeing, the combination of option 2 diffuser, XH-A1, and the Lomo 85mm cinema lens in front of me, is going to drop some jaws.
Dennis Wood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 20th, 2006, 02:15 PM   #9
Trustee
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: London UK
Posts: 1,939
Most important factors:

1:Sharpness
2:Light loss
3:Build quality

So far the letus35 FE let me down very badly, failing in all of the major three. My Redrock M2 has impressed in all of the above areas. I hear quotes of .5 stop light loss, but I think it is a little more than that. My Brevis from Dennis arrives this week and I cannot wait. I have heard that all the three points are very well served plus it has a great 20hr rechargable battery built in, is lightweight and can be used without rods making handheld more possible.

Today I shot 3 interviews for a doco series for Channel 4 and also some nice sequences and shots to go with them on the M2. Outside was nice and easy, but inside the House of Lords with limited space, time and a very large dark hallway it was tough. DOF was down to about 2 inches on my nikon f1.2 stopped down to about f1.4 and 9db gain. I was focusing pulling the entire way through it. Fortunately it looks great. I am having to use my XDCAM for more spontaneous stuff, especially inside as the need for light makes the adaptor nearly impossbile with strong lights.

How far have you got Tony with your design, when do you think i will be able to meet up with you to have a look? Are you still planning to make the image flip? It would be nice but as light loss is so important perhaps you should go down Dennis' route of making it a screw on addition rather than built into it so you can take it off if you need that extra stop, which inside you invariably do! As you know London right now is bloody dark and any natural light that was coming into windows a couple of months ago is long gone!!!
__________________
Philip Bloom
Cinematographer, Director, Filmmaker www.philipbloom.net
Phil Bloom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 20th, 2006, 11:54 PM   #10
Major Player
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 916
Phil, we're certainly not perfect, but a ton of effort goes in to keeping everyone happy :-)
Dennis Wood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 21st, 2006, 05:30 AM   #11
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA.
Posts: 4,476
Phil.

There was a UK Channel 4 crew out here for the 2006 Red Bull Air Race final. I was fortunate enough to be on the outside of the fence where they shot a to-camera with rapidly approaching aircraft as a backdrop.

I don't know whether they worked a deal with the pilots or not, but I was lucky to harvest the low fly-towards and sharp pull-ups with the 500mm end of a zoom lens - sweet.
Bob Hart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 21st, 2006, 09:09 AM   #12
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canary Wharf, London E14
Posts: 166
Cant seem to find a decent Nikon Nikkor 50mm f1.4 anywhere. Anyone got one to sell or know where to get a decent one? Tried eBay but no good (statches and dust).
__________________
Tony Relph.
anthonyjohnrelph@hotmail.com
Tony Relph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 21st, 2006, 09:27 AM   #13
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: santa fe, nm
Posts: 3,264
Images: 10
it looks like jvc is about to release their 35mm lens mount adapter for the HD100/110/200/250. I think this adapter uses mirrors rather than ground glass focusing screens. If this is true, the light loss should be minimal. The only problem will be adapting to the 1/3" lens mount used by JVC.
Bill Ravens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 21st, 2006, 09:38 AM   #14
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canary Wharf, London E14
Posts: 166
Anyone got the web link for this JVC 35mm lens mount adapter?
__________________
Tony Relph.
anthonyjohnrelph@hotmail.com
Tony Relph is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 21st, 2006, 09:59 AM   #15
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: santa fe, nm
Posts: 3,264
Images: 10
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=78280
Bill Ravens is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY USA

Scan Computers Int. Ltd.
+44 0871-472-4747
Bolton, Lancashire UK


DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Alternative Imaging Methods

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:20 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2024 The Digital Video Information Network