BEST 35mm adapter for shooting weddings?

Bob Hart · January 11th, 2007, 01:37 PM

Dennis.

I had a metal bar with a tripod hole drilled and tapped into it at centre and two plain holes near each end, one to suspend the camera inverted on the left side and one to support the monitor on the right. This kept the tripod load closer to balanced.

It is not ideal if shooting close to your moving subject as a pan right also becomes a sort of dolly in of about 5" for a 60 degree or so pan.

A side benefit is you may not have to pull focus if the subject moves from centre to right. It is just plain awkard and fiddly and cannot be handheld wich is why I abandoned this approach.

You could hang the camera out in front and the monitor behind and use it like a broadcast camera. A pan across a close subject then becomes almost a sort of lateral track but you don't see the dynamic change.

Flipping the image optically is not such an impossible deal and it would probably be a simpler challenge to build a flip attachment for the back of a Brevis or SGPro than to physically invert the CCD wedge in the camera.

This otherwise introduces all manner of potential issues like longer signal ribbon cables from the CCD sub-boards, with the possibility of new capacitive, inductive and RFI problems due to the longer unshielded cables and altered routing.

When attempting some repairs on a JVC, I was trouble shooting a dead green channel by swapping out the little sub-boards which plugged onto the back of the CCDs. Just disturbing the boards was enough to physically alter the optical registry of the red channel CCD.

If I was to go about doing the camera inversion thing again, I would make a box shaped frame to surround the camera body, mount the lower face to the tripod and use the upper face to suspend the camera inside, something like the cage they make for lightweight cameras to be fitted onto full steadycam rigs.

Dennis Hingsberg · January 11th, 2007, 01:41 PM

Thanks for your advise. It sure would be awesome thought to flip the CCD in camera!

Bob Hart · January 11th, 2007, 01:50 PM

If the CCD wedge could be flipped and remain centrally registed on the lens axis it would be by far the best solution. What is the prospect of getting Panasonic to advise on an electronic in-camera flip solution?

With JVC going that route and JVC being owned by Panasonic or its parent, the intellectual property may have already gone across or be under development.

Dennis Hingsberg · January 11th, 2007, 02:13 PM

Bob,

Would Panasonic even advise on such a request ie. flipping around their CCD? I doubt they would even do that sort of thing but if you want to try for me that would be swell!

In the meantime I got my hands on an HVX and as you know from my other post www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=82245 I was considering the removal of the stock lens and designing a virtually no-light-loss relay lens (similar to the one in my mini35) to be used with some 35mm adapter (likely with help from the guys at Cinevate, SGPro or Daniel Schaumberger). This would be ultimate "low light loss", "no flip trick needed" 35mm HD camera.

You had sent me some email on the subject and I appologize for not responding as of yet. I've had a large collection of thought lately to have to deal with regarding the relay lens bit and didn't want to reply until I had something adequate or substantial to talk about. Thanks for your emails however.

Ben Winter · June 21st, 2007, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Hingsberg

Bob,

Would Panasonic even advise on such a request ie. flipping around their CCD? I doubt they would even do that sort of thing but if you want to try for me that would be swell!

In the meantime I got my hands on an HVX and as you know from my other post www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=82245 I was considering the removal of the stock lens and designing a virtually no-light-loss relay lens (similar to the one in my mini35) to be used with some 35mm adapter (likely with help from the guys at Cinevate, SGPro or Daniel Schaumberger). This would be ultimate "low light loss", "no flip trick needed" 35mm HD camera.

You had sent me some email on the subject and I appologize for not responding as of yet. I've had a large collection of thought lately to have to deal with regarding the relay lens bit and didn't want to reply until I had something adequate or substantial to talk about. Thanks for your emails however.

Well, this is an old thread but if you take off the stock lens and design a relay lens for it, you still need to flip the footage afterwards. So that really does you no good, other than disable the camera for any non-adapter use and nix its resale value.

Josh Green · June 21st, 2007, 08:34 PM

jason magbanua shoots weddings with a 35mm adapter all the time so it's definetely possible. I think he has someone tag along with him though just see he can make sure that he's got a shot to work with.

Dennis Wood · June 21st, 2007, 09:06 PM

Patrick shoots with a fleet of XH-A1's, the steadicam flyer, and two Brevis units: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...ghlight=brevis

Light efficiency is his number one concern, so he uses the Brevis with our CF1L imaging element. From our discussions, the ability to pop the adapter on without rails, grab a few shots and remove it is also a major factor in their use of the adapter. His footage was good enough to catch the eye of some very interesting folks...more later :-)

Eric Ramahatra · December 29th, 2007, 08:46 AM

hi,

this thread is very interesting to me. I've shots lots of wedding using a 35mm adapter but i really need a relay lens instead of the stock one : too long ! i look like Terminator !

Here is one of those i prefer.
http://www.tophos.com/film.php?f=cecile-stephane

Dennis Wood · December 29th, 2007, 11:45 AM

There've been quite a few changes since this thread was fired up. Notably, Patrick and his crew at stillmotion.ca have won a WEVA award, are now sponsored Canon shooters (with a Canon national TV ad done using the Brevis!) and have a few more accolades they haven't announced yet. They're also the world's most prolific Brevis users with a fleet of adapters in their kit. We're pretty excited about fitting them out with a few of our flip modules to raise the bar once again for this talented crew.

January 11th, 2007, 01:41 PM	#17
Dennis Hingsberg Trustee Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,055	Thanks for your advise. It sure would be awesome thought to flip the CCD in camera! __________________ Blog: www.hingsberg.com Ultimate Exposure Guides for FS5/F7S/F5/F55

January 11th, 2007, 02:13 PM	#19
Dennis Hingsberg Trustee Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,055	Bob, Would Panasonic even advise on such a request ie. flipping around their CCD? I doubt they would even do that sort of thing but if you want to try for me that would be swell! In the meantime I got my hands on an HVX and as you know from my other post www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=82245 I was considering the removal of the stock lens and designing a virtually no-light-loss relay lens (similar to the one in my mini35) to be used with some 35mm adapter (likely with help from the guys at Cinevate, SGPro or Daniel Schaumberger). This would be ultimate "low light loss", "no flip trick needed" 35mm HD camera. You had sent me some email on the subject and I appologize for not responding as of yet. I've had a large collection of thought lately to have to deal with regarding the relay lens bit and didn't want to reply until I had something adequate or substantial to talk about. Thanks for your emails however. __________________ Blog: www.hingsberg.com Ultimate Exposure Guides for FS5/F7S/F5/F55

June 21st, 2007, 08:34 PM	#21
Josh Green Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 77	yip jason magbanua shoots weddings with a 35mm adapter all the time so it's definetely possible. I think he has someone tag along with him though just see he can make sure that he's got a shot to work with.

December 29th, 2007, 08:46 AM	#23
Eric Ramahatra Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Paris Posts: 72	hi, this thread is very interesting to me. I've shots lots of wedding using a 35mm adapter but i really need a relay lens instead of the stock one : too long ! i look like Terminator ! Here is one of those i prefer. http://www.tophos.com/film.php?f=cecile-stephane __________________ JVC HD200+redrock M2+1.4 lens+steadicam Flyer mini35 weddings

January 11th, 2007, 01:37 PM	#16
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	Dennis. I had a metal bar with a tripod hole drilled and tapped into it at centre and two plain holes near each end, one to suspend the camera inverted on the left side and one to support the monitor on the right. This kept the tripod load closer to balanced. It is not ideal if shooting close to your moving subject as a pan right also becomes a sort of dolly in of about 5" for a 60 degree or so pan. A side benefit is you may not have to pull focus if the subject moves from centre to right. It is just plain awkard and fiddly and cannot be handheld wich is why I abandoned this approach. You could hang the camera out in front and the monitor behind and use it like a broadcast camera. A pan across a close subject then becomes almost a sort of lateral track but you don't see the dynamic change. Flipping the image optically is not such an impossible deal and it would probably be a simpler challenge to build a flip attachment for the back of a Brevis or SGPro than to physically invert the CCD wedge in the camera. This otherwise introduces all manner of potential issues like longer signal ribbon cables from the CCD sub-boards, with the possibility of new capacitive, inductive and RFI problems due to the longer unshielded cables and altered routing. When attempting some repairs on a JVC, I was trouble shooting a dead green channel by swapping out the little sub-boards which plugged onto the back of the CCDs. Just disturbing the boards was enough to physically alter the optical registry of the red channel CCD. If I was to go about doing the camera inversion thing again, I would make a box shaped frame to surround the camera body, mount the lower face to the tripod and use the upper face to suspend the camera inside, something like the cage they make for lightweight cameras to be fitted onto full steadycam rigs.

January 11th, 2007, 01:50 PM	#18
Bob Hart Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PERTH. W.A. AUSTRALIA. Posts: 4,476	If the CCD wedge could be flipped and remain centrally registed on the lens axis it would be by far the best solution. What is the prospect of getting Panasonic to advise on an electronic in-camera flip solution? With JVC going that route and JVC being owned by Panasonic or its parent, the intellectual property may have already gone across or be under development.

June 21st, 2007, 09:06 PM	#22
Dennis Wood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 916	Patrick shoots with a fleet of XH-A1's, the steadicam flyer, and two Brevis units: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...ghlight=brevis Light efficiency is his number one concern, so he uses the Brevis with our CF1L imaging element. From our discussions, the ability to pop the adapter on without rails, grab a few shots and remove it is also a major factor in their use of the adapter. His footage was good enough to catch the eye of some very interesting folks...more later :-)

December 29th, 2007, 11:45 AM	#24
Dennis Wood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 916	There've been quite a few changes since this thread was fired up. Notably, Patrick and his crew at stillmotion.ca have won a WEVA award, are now sponsored Canon shooters (with a Canon national TV ad done using the Brevis!) and have a few more accolades they haven't announced yet. They're also the world's most prolific Brevis users with a fleet of adapters in their kit. We're pretty excited about fitting them out with a few of our flip modules to raise the bar once again for this talented crew.