View Full Version : Canon XH A2 (Just wondering what it will be)


John Welsh
August 23rd, 2007, 12:34 PM
No, there's no official (nor even a non-official) statement about A2 I spotted. I was just thinking what features are to expect in A2.
I think:
-Full HD sensor, maybe CMOS
-grain buttons added
-Chip change might mean 24f > 24p (true progressive)
-touch screens gain power today, so I think soon we might have touch screen LCDs. Just press on the face of a person on LCD, and it is instantly in focus, so that you dont need to worry about being out of focus, just because the LCD is too small. (though I prefer the ring)
-HDMI out
-maybe other media (Harddisk, P2 ...)
-

Of course, it is in some way senseless to speak about it now, since we heard nothing about A2 yet. But it always seems to be interesting to hear what other people might expect or want to have on A2.

Michael Wisniewski
August 25th, 2007, 03:20 AM
Hopefullly the luck of 2.0 will grace the XH A2.Some things I'd like to see:

Better balance / ergonomics - Unfortunately, the XH A1 actually balances really well when it's turned on it's side. The weight of the tape mechanism on the bottom gives it very nice stability. How silly is that?

Hard disk / solid state recording

Bigger / high res LCD

Automated file/video management - a la the Sony XDCAM. The ability to use metadata on clips as recorded to make sorting, organizing, and searching much easier.

I'd also like to see a simple camcorder dock so I don't have to keep plugging/unplugging all the wires everytime I use the cam.

Sina Basy
August 26th, 2007, 06:31 PM
and of course a larger sensor :D

Bill Koehler
October 22nd, 2007, 11:06 PM
3.5 inch LCD (or larger)
Replace tape with dual CompactFlash slots,
similar to XDCAM EX but oh so much less expensive...

That should tweak both Panasonics and Sony's expensive noses :-)

With the move to flash memory, there could also be options for
recording with better color sampling & higher bit rates.

The component analog output need NOT outclass the digital output :-)

Eric Brown
October 23rd, 2007, 10:19 PM
[QUOTE-grain buttons added[/QUOTE]

John, I sincerely hope you're kidding about the grain button. It was on the XL2 and they had to eliminate it because it such a cheesy, useless feature. Disaster, actually, is probably the best way to describe it.

Eric Brown
October 23rd, 2007, 10:21 PM
That being said, I would like to see what an A2 would have to offer. Other than a grain button...

David Chia
October 24th, 2007, 12:32 AM
-touch screens gain power today, so I think soon we might have touch screen LCDs. Just press on the face of a person on LCD, and it is instantly in focus, so that you dont need to worry about being out of focus, just because the LCD is too small. (though I prefer the ring)



my old Sony PDX10 has that function. I use a PDA pen to touch the screen instead of my big fat finger. It works great for rack focus

Bill Zens
October 24th, 2007, 07:26 PM
60p frame rates for slo mo...

Nic Smith
November 3rd, 2007, 10:34 PM
Be good to see a 3CMOS sensor for no image smearing in bright lights, at least 2/3in in size for a nice 16mm depth of field, or even a 1 inch sensor.... dream on....

And yes, a move to solid state recording, or hard disk, with AVCHD instead of the old HDV would be even better.

Colin Zhang
November 5th, 2007, 05:45 AM
Be good to see a 3CMOS sensor for no image smearing in bright lights, at least 2/3in in size for a nice 16mm depth of field, or even a 1 inch sensor.... dream on....

And yes, a move to solid state recording, or hard disk, with AVCHD instead of the old HDV would be even better.

I thought AVCHD was only for consumer cams? If they make a move to sold state or hdd, I'd still like to see the option of tape...

Nic Smith
November 5th, 2007, 09:19 AM
Yeah, it mostly has only been implemented on consumer cams. Its only a new format, but has arguably better quality and a better implementation than the older HDV format which uses MPEG2 compression and relies on keyframes and God knows what else to reduce the filesize, which makes it a real annoyance to edit without intermediary codecs. Any formats that use an H.264 codec I would say are better for quality and for post production. Of course, completely uncompressed would be nice... but I doubt thats likely anytime soon in a camera of this price range.

Oh, and as for tape, I dont think so. Tape takes as much time to capture to computer as it does to record onto. It's a hassle. The P2 systems and Professional Disc systems, or anything like them, are more likely to increase in popularity I think. Already most consumer cams are HDD or DVD or both. Only the cheapest consumer cams still use tape.

Mathieu Ghekiere
November 5th, 2007, 01:01 PM
No touch screen please... It's a pain to work with. Just have well placed buttons on the camera that make it simple, easy, and especially fast to get what you want.
Even for focus, please don't...

Colin Zhang
November 5th, 2007, 05:29 PM
You make a good point Nic, but I'm pretty reluctent to spend a few thousand dollars on something uncompatible with all my previous work. 3CMOS censors would be nice, but I think if they included that it might take a blow to the lux rating, which is an important factor for many.

Benjamin Hill
November 5th, 2007, 05:46 PM
Biggest complaint I have is the audio inputs; the XLR's should be independently mic/line switchable, and you should be able to use the onboard mic along with an external mic. It is a great on-board mic that I can't even use half the time.

I would also like better audio controls, the little dials are barely usable. Other than these shortcomings it is an outstanding camera.

Nic Smith
November 5th, 2007, 06:13 PM
You make a good point Nic, but I'm pretty reluctent to spend a few thousand dollars on something uncompatible with all my previous work. 3CMOS censors would be nice, but I think if they included that it might take a blow to the lux rating, which is an important factor for many.

Yeah that is true that the CMOS sensors aren't as sensitive to light, but thats why i said it should also be a much bigger sensor, at least 2/3 inch or even 1 inch. I just can't stand the image smear from CCD sensors when i shoot into a bright light source, and instead of getting a beautiful lens flare, its covered by a huge streak down the video. Not a good way to get that filmic look..

Dan Keaton
November 5th, 2007, 06:34 PM
Dear Nick,

Could you please share the custom preset you are using, or the individual setup values for the custom preset?

Certain custom preset or setup values will cause the smear problem.

Nic Smith
November 5th, 2007, 07:16 PM
Dear Nick,

Could you please share the custom preset you are using, or the individual setup values for the custom preset?

Certain custom preset or setup values will cause the smear problem.

The cutsom presets have nothing to do with the smear problems. I use an XL2 and have had problems with it from the beginning, even buying a polariser to try and curb the problem. Then I researched CCD vs CMOS sensors and found that an inherent flaw in CCD is that each light sensor is designed in such a way that when faced with an extremely bright light source, like the sun, it will cause not only the areas on the CCD that are immediately in contact with the light to react, but surrounding areas as well, leading to a smear.

This is a flaw with CCD sensors and one of the biggest reasons to make the move to CMOS I think. I'm prepared to put up with less sensitivity to light to eliminate this problem, and if the sensor is 2/3in anyway, it wouldnt be so much of a problem.

Although, If I'm wrong here, please correct me. But this is the way I understand it.

Andris Krastins
November 6th, 2007, 06:24 AM
Like others I'd like a bigger LCD and a better sensor, although the current one is not bad at all, but the LCD is a bit too small.

And I hope it will remain a tape camera, because tapes are cheaper, easier to replace, and are a good permanent storage solution, as well as other factors.

I'd also like a better customization of on screen LCD readings, so that I can choose exactly what data I see.

As well as a iris jog button. I'm all for rings, but sometimes I find myself in a position where it's uncomfortable to use iris ring.

Paulo Teixeira
November 6th, 2007, 07:16 PM
3 CMOS chips, an HDMI port and a bigger LCD screen is almost a given for an XH-A2 but I would rather see Canon releases an HD version of the GL2 first with a 1/2” CMOS chip, HDMI output and a 3.5” LCD screen. That camcorder is in dying need of a replacement and I really hope Canon will deliver. Back in 2005 I was constantly hoping that Canon would release it so that I can take it with me to the Azores, Portugal but during the first few days of August I had no choice but to buy a Sony HC1 since I was leaving around the 11th of that month. I almost ended up picking the Panasonic GS400 since I already owned the DV953 but with the footage I got out of the HC1, it was well worth it.

Canon knows that an HD version of the GL2 would sell like crazy and it would be a tragic mistake if they let that slip by.

Ethan Cooper
November 6th, 2007, 08:25 PM
but I would rather see Canon releases an HD version of the GL2...
...That camcorder is in dying need of a replacement and I really hope Canon will deliver.

Paulo,
I don't understand. Doesn't the XH-A1 already fill that request? Maybe I'm misunderstanding something.

Paulo Teixeira
November 6th, 2007, 09:14 PM
The GL2 and the XH-A1 are completely different in size and weight. The Panasonic 100a was very popular at that time but they still released the DVC30 for the people who wanted a smaller version, and that was a direct competitor to the GL2.

If you notice, besides maybe the GS400, the price of the GL2 have never gone down as much as any other camcorder for a reason and it’s been out for around 5 years.

Timothy D. Allen
November 14th, 2007, 01:25 PM
If you had 1 inch CMOS chips in a camera, I'm pretty sure that would bump your price up to that of a RED ONE.

As for the smearing with CCDs, never heard of that. I get beautiful lens flairs with my stuff. No smearing.

I could go tape or solid state, but I would really like to have the option to backup everything to a tape even if I could record uncompressed to a drive.

I get the whole balance thing, and a bigger LCD Screen would be nice.

But...

If Canon could only change one thing about this camera, I would just asked that you give us a feature to flip the image in the view finder! It's not the big of a deal. When the image hits the sensor in the first place it's upside down so you have to actually flip it as it is so we can see it right side up! Why can't I just turn that off? Undo the flip you're already doing?

Seems like to easy of a thing to add to not do it for all us guys who use 35mm lens adaptures!

That's all I have to say about that. :-D

Ethan Cooper
November 14th, 2007, 01:39 PM
If Canon could only change one thing about this camera, I would just asked that you give us a feature to flip the image in the view finder!
Seems like to easy of a thing to add to not do it for all us guys who use 35mm lens adaptures!

I could be completely making this up, but I coulda swore a couple years ago at NAB I saw a JVC camera with this very option. The guy just pressed a little button on the flip out screen and presto, the image flipped. Did this ever make it to market? I think it was in the JVC booth... maybe it was Canon... and it wasn't this past year... maybe I dreamed this. Someone help me out here.

Something else I might have dreamed cause nobody else seems to remember it was this Sony Trinitron back in the 90's had a remote control with a locator feature. You simple walk up to the TV, press a button, and the remote started beeping. It was all built in.. no need to buy some radio shack gadget to do it for you. What ever happened to this simple but great feature?

Nic Smith
November 15th, 2007, 05:27 AM
As for the smearing with CCDs, never heard of that. I get beautiful lens flairs with my stuff. No smearing.

I find this hard to believe. The CCD doesn't have any ability to alleviate this problem, so it would be interesting how you got away with having no CCD smear when pointing straight into a bright light source (such as the sun... yes i know you shouldn't.....)

Thats why I said CMOS instead of CCD, because CMOS doesnt suffer from this..

Timothy D. Allen
November 17th, 2007, 05:04 AM
I suppose there is the possibility that simply have not noticed it, and it is indeed there. But certainly not anything that has caused me any grief over it. But I must agree with you that the CMOS chips are much better, I'm just concerned how much they will cause the cost of the camera to rise.

(Such as not being able to flip the image!)

Ethan, yes. JVC has already implemented this feature into their cameras starting with the HD110U I believe. (?)

Which is why it would be nice if Canon could follow suite. The JVC units that do this are well over $10k, so being able to have the feature in the A1 - or A2 - would be extremely beneficially.

Paulo Teixeira
November 19th, 2007, 11:56 PM
I'm just concerned how much they will cause the cost of the camera to rise.

CMOS chips are cheaper to manufacture.

Timothy D. Allen
November 20th, 2007, 02:27 AM
CMOS chips are cheaper to manufacture.

Well there you have it! CMOS it is!! Thanks, Paulo.

John Welsh
December 26th, 2007, 05:55 PM
If Canon could only change one thing about this camera, I would just asked that you give us a feature to flip the image in the view finder! It's not the big of a deal. When the image hits the sensor in the first place it's upside down so you have to actually flip it as it is so we can see it right side up! Why can't I just turn that off? Undo the flip you're already doing?

Seems like to easy of a thing to add to not do it for all us guys who use 35mm lens adaptures!

That's all I have to say about that. :-D

I dont own A1 (not yet) but I would like to know HOW the image is flipped when using a 35mm adapter.
Is it like a reflection in a mirror (what is left remains left just with upper side down) or is it like the first one mit with things on the left side appearing right?

if it is the first, you can easily fix it using a small mirror attached to you LCD. If the second, a way harder, you need mount two mirrors on your lcd.