If I worked at Sony, I would have designed the HVR-Z7 to have an option to be like this:

http://www.ikegami.com/image_j2/hdl40hs.jpg

instead of only being this:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/images/largeimages/532558.jpg

If I had worked at my house I would have have designed my pinhole camera to be this:

http://www.panavision.com.au/Images/Genesis.jpg

Instead of this:

http://www.sciencebuddies.org/mentoring/project_ideas/Photo_img015.jpg

when you guys just slay me, really, you do.


CS

If I had worked at your computer I would have made your post like this:

I say good chaps, your posts fill me with mirth and merriment like no other.

Sincerely and with much esteem,
Sir C.S. the Third, ESQ.

Instead of this:

when you guys just slay me, really, you do.


CS

P.S. I'm sorry Tim, this is just such an abstract thread and I love this stuff.

If I worked on properly organizing this site, I'd move this thread to this:

Area 51

Instead of this:

Sony HVR-Z7 / HVR-S270

edit: oops, sorry; image tags are off in this forum.

Actually, this was intended to be a serious thread about wanting the HVR-Z7 to have a shoulder pad and VF option like that Ikegami box camera, but since it's now in the Area 51 zone, I guess I will just say that I'm glad I DON'T work at Sony because I'd goof off too much dreaming about my perfect camera and I'd be paid in these:

http://www.admit-one.net/webimages/1000pennies.jpg

instead of these:

http://blogs.venturacountystar.com/vcs/dennert/archives/money.jpg

Actually, this was... about wanting the HVR-Z7 to have a shoulder pad and VF option... But it can have those options... and when it does, it's called the HVR-S270.

But it can have those options... and when it does, it's called the HVR-S270.

LOL! I knew someone would say that. But that camera is bigger, heavier and cost a lot more. I just like the little box camera approach like what Ikegami did. Probably wouldn't balance too well, but that's a minor detail ;)

I just like the little box camera approach like what Ikegami did. Hmmm... the JVC Pro HD series GY-HD110?

Yes, I actually like the JVC design quite a bit. But the Ikegami is an even more minimalist design. Of course, it has no way to attach a battery, but again...minor details. I'm telling you, I'm really digging that Ikegami camera...or maybe I just like saying Ikegami.

S'okay Tim, maybe I just like saying the abbreviated version Ike, since it's pronounced "Icky."

Back in A51 territory now.

Spoken like a true Gentleman. I doff my cap to you, Sir.

May your days be filled with mirth and merriment, forsooth!

Alas, I must be away, farewell.


CS

If I worked at Sony, I would have designed the HVR-Z7 to have an option to be like this:
http://www.ikegami.com/image_j2/hdl40hs.jpg
instead of only being this:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/images/largeimages/532558.jpg


Ignoring the bs from the other postings, I think you have a very valid point. I have been using the Z1 for almost 18 months now, and many times it occured to me how easy it would be for this to be adapted to be a shoulderable camera. I did have a chance to look at the Z7 at a recent show.

Anyway, I bought a Hoodman sunshade for the viewfinder. All it would take would be a simple magnifier device to view that close up, plus a shoulder rest and remote combo. I am surprised an aftermarket company hasn't come up with this.

The Z1 weighs about 5 lbs loaded. The Z7 is heavier, partially due to having an interchangeable lens. It is particularly surprising that the higher end HDCAM EX, with full HD resolution, does not have an interchangeable lens. The designers of these cams should think about how they are used, in particularly in the event coverage arena.

Thanks for the support Mark. I'm glad you see my point about having a by-design option to make a handheld camera into a shoulder mount (when needed) instead of just being directed to buy an existing shoulder mounted camera (which can't be turned into a small box camera even if you wanted to).

The beauty of the Ikegami design, unlike other third party shoulder mount accessories, is that the shoulder pad is very low profile and the camera is designed to accept a normal ENG viewfinder on the camera handle. It's sort of like the RED camera approach where you can add stuff to a box camera to make it into other configurations. The HVR-Z7 is already basically a box camera with a handle so if they had reworked the handle/mic/LCD area a little, they might be able to allow an ENG style viewfinder to be mounted.

Of course, I'm not expected the HVR-Z7 to be redesigned, but I'm just throwing out design ideas, hoping maybe Canon or Panasonic or even Sony takes a hint for future products. We're starting to see an evolution of camera design away from the standard VX1000 style handycam form so I'd like to see these designs become even more versatile.

I can't see why people find this thread so 'weird' as if what Tim is suggesting is absolutely ridiculous.

I am one of the few people in existence on this planet that loathes the Z1 for two reasons; one, because it's a ridiculous idea making it entirely handheld, and two, because everybody loves it so much and fails to realise its design is poor. A bit like everybody's love for iPods and Macs just because they're popular.

Rule. Professional cameras should be shoulder-mounted. End of. Shoulders are for supporting, hands are for operating the lens and other functions. Why should hands operate AND support? Especially with a camera so incredibly bulky, which is constantly pulling leftwards on your right hand, and when you pull focus or manual zoom you're moving the camera as well because it's not supported properly. It's just cumbersome. And on top of that you're so detached from the camera because you're holding it so far out in front of you if you want to use the viewfinder.

Well lets see.The S270 is based on the SonyDSR series body. Those bodies were solid as a rock and you grew big shoulders if you used it for any length of time.
I would have hoped that Sony would have put the S270 into a compact body along the lines of the JVC HD100/200 series.

Perhaps IF they come out with a fullsized version of the soon to be released Z5 they will go with a compact body type.
Of course the DSR cameras have 2 XLRs on the back plus the power outlet to power a receiver and a built in D tap for a light so I'm sure something would have to go if they cane out with a compact body.

Along the lines of the Ike, I've worked with them as a remote camera although the ones I've worked with are not the 40S series. The ones I've used have noshoulder pad, no VF and are powered off of a triax and feed signal thru fiber cable. An interesting setup. Ben Lynn has worked with them for a long time. They are quite pricey and not really something I would take out on a run and gun event but maybe that's because I can't afford them. Picture quality is absolutely amazing but then it would have to be for live TV.

I agree the Z1 is one of the most awkward and uncomfortable cameras I have ever used but it does produce a nice picture. The Z7 looks to me to be as awkward especially trying to hold the camera and operate the lense. I would prefer to have the S270 but looking forward to see what Sony might do with the Z5 in fullsized form.
I can speculate and dream but the heads at Sony will never tell until the time comes IF it does.

Don

Hi there
I have always used my Z1 with a shoulder mount, as I too find it bulky and awkward to use.
In fact the other day I had to shoot a couple of sequences handheld without the support and found it very difficult.
I use the LCD 90% of the time, reverting to the EVF only when I have to put a rain cover on the camera.
I've used it with a Petrol hood on the viewfinder and this works ok, except for my eyes i'm a bit too close to the screen to focus comfortably. I've just ordered one of the Hood Pro-loupe accessories mentioned on another thread... I hope this will improve my set up further and make focusing more comfortable.
The shoulder mount set up allows far more stable shooting, but due to the front heavy nature of the camera gets tiring to hold after a while, especially with a mattebox...
The S270 would certainly suit my needs, but it is out of my price bracket at the moment and the Z1 serves me well.
I think we all design our perfect camera in our heads, or look at our gear and think, if only they had done this!!! or as I have with the Z1 so many times, why didn't they make it a small shoulder cam... even if it looked like an XL1.
Gareth