View Full Version : FCP: Exporting full res


Jim Newberry
June 16th, 2008, 02:33 PM
From FCP, if I export to QT movie, using current settings, and checking "make self contained," will that result in full res, highest quality output? Or will that compress the footage at all? At this point I just want to give raw footage from a client--is this the way to go, or should I use Compressor, and if Compressor, which format will give me full res?

Uncompressed 10-bit?

By the way the footage is 30f HD 16:9 from a Canon XH-A1.

Shaun Roemich
June 16th, 2008, 04:15 PM
If you use "Current Settings", FCP will export using the Codec and Quality settings of the Timeline, not the source footage, unless they are one and the same.

Jim Newberry
June 16th, 2008, 04:18 PM
Thanks for the response. Perhaps this is a dumb question, but how do check the codec setting for the timeline?

eta: OK, I think I figured it out: highlight clip in timeline, and then select "item properties" under EDIT menu...

Shaun Roemich
June 16th, 2008, 04:34 PM
Better way is to select the Sequence in the Browser and select Item Properties, to be absolutely sure.

Jim Newberry
June 16th, 2008, 04:52 PM
OK, so if I export with "current settings," I'll get the same settings as my sequence? And this will not compress or otherwise degrade the image?

What about using the clips in the capture scratch folder--those should be full quality, right? Say you imported footage and you don't need to edit it--you could just use those .mov files in the scratch folder? Any downside to that?

William Hohauser
June 16th, 2008, 06:10 PM
If you captured in DV-NTSC and the sequence is in DV-NTSC then when you export as "Self-Contained" the file is a direct transfer of the data in the original files except the parts that have to be rendered (fades, color-correction, etc). It's a very clean way to make a digital copy of your edit. Files that were originally in a different codec will be rendered into the sequence's codec.

Make sure your client can view these files. They are not typical QuickTime files as indicated by the different icon they carry. I'm not entirely sure but I think you need a form of Final Cut installed to use these files.

Jim Newberry
June 16th, 2008, 07:09 PM
If you captured in DV-NTSC and the sequence is in DV-NTSC then when you export as "Self-Contained" the file is a direct transfer of the data in the original files except the parts that have to be rendered (fades, color-correction, etc). It's a very clean way to make a digital copy of your edit. Files that were originally in a different codec will be rendered into the sequence's codec.

Make sure your client can view these files. They are not typical QuickTime files as indicated by the different icon they carry. I'm not entirely sure but I think you need a form of Final Cut installed to use these files.

Is there an alternative file format or codec that's more universal?

Mike Barber
June 16th, 2008, 08:26 PM
Is there an alternative file format or codec that's more universal?

Shaun was just citing DV-NTSC as an example.

In order to figure out what you need to do, tell us what you captured your footage as, as well as the timeline settings. Also, how are you delivering the footage to the client? Tape? Hard drive?

Jim Newberry
June 16th, 2008, 09:18 PM
Shaun was just citing DV-NTSC as an example.

In order to figure out what you need to do, tell us what you captured your footage as, as well as the timeline settings. Also, how are you delivering the footage to the client? Tape? Hard drive?

I'm delivering the footage on disc or hard drive. Sequence properties: HD (1440x1080), 48K stereo audio, compressor: HDV 1080p30.

By the way, when I said, "Is there an alternative file format or codec that's more universal?" I was responding to William who said: "Make sure your client can view these files. They are not typical QuickTime files as indicated by the different icon they carry. I'm not entirely sure but I think you need a form of Final Cut installed to use these files."

Craig Parkes
June 16th, 2008, 11:11 PM
Jim, the quicktimes with the final cut logo on macs are still just quicktimes and can be viewed by anyone - they just have metadata that makes them optimised for use in Final Cut Pro (generally to do with Final Cut's gamma settings etc.)

Dino Leone
June 17th, 2008, 11:08 AM
Jim, the quicktimes with the final cut logo on macs are still just quicktimes and can be viewed by anyone - they just have metadata that makes them optimised for use in Final Cut Pro (generally to do with Final Cut's gamma settings etc.)

Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but since it's HDV, it's MPEG2, for which you'll need the special codes (included with FCE and FCS). A "regular" OS X install won't be able to play those. So, I agree with William, make sure the client has those codecs. If not, he should be able to watch the clips using VLC.
Best,
Dino

Shaun Roemich
June 17th, 2008, 11:49 AM
Just remember that every transcode to another Codec is another transcode "hit" in terms of re-compression.

In the "olde" days, we used to "bump up" U-Matic (a composite format) to BetaSP (a component format) for post as component holds up better in multiple pass post but we still took a generational loss going to Beta in the first place. I mention this only out of nostalgia: digital transcodes are a little more forgiving than analog dubs, but the premise is the same.

If you CAN get by with passing on the MPEG streams, do it.

Jim Newberry
June 17th, 2008, 02:45 PM
OK, I'm a bit confused. My client asked for .mov files, which I'll get if I export from FCP at current settings, right? Is mpeg a codec as well as a file format?

"Just remember that every transcode to another Codec is another transcode "hit" in terms of re-compression."

In my situation, when is the footage being transcoded? When I capture it to FCP? When I export it with current settings?

Dino Leone
June 17th, 2008, 03:07 PM
OK, I'm a bit confused. My client asked for .mov files, which I'll get if I export from FCP at current settings, right? Is mpeg a codec as well as a file format?

"Just remember that every transcode to another Codec is another transcode "hit" in terms of re-compression."

In my situation, when is the footage being transcoded? When I capture it to FCP? When I export it with current settings?

OK, I just tested this here at work. I'm outputting files from FCS the same way as described by you (export using Quicktime, same settings as source). I'm using HDV 1080p24 from a Canon A1. These movies end with .mov and when I try to open one on a Mac that does not have either FCE or FCS installed, quicktime player shows a dialog saying it needs additional software (= mpeg2 codecs).
On my MBP, Quicktime player identifies the files as Apple HDV 1080p24.
.Mov (a generic name for a movie) is a container for many formats, including mpeg2. The mpeg2 codec is just the part of quicktime that's needed to play such (mpeg2) files.

Again, your client needs those codecs to watch these clips. Otherwise you'll have to reencode. You'll see the codecs (components) on your mac if you go to /Library/QuickTime.

Dino

Jim Newberry
June 17th, 2008, 03:50 PM
OK, I just tested this here at work. I'm outputting files from FCS the same way as described by you (export using Quicktime, same settings as source). I'm using HDV 1080p24 from a Canon A1. These movies end with .mov and when I try to open one on a Mac that does not have either FCE or FCS installed, quicktime player shows a dialog saying it needs additional software (= mpeg2 codecs).
On my MBP, Quicktime player identifies the files as Apple HDV 1080p24.
.Mov (a generic name for a movie) is a container for many formats, including mpeg2. The mpeg2 codec is just the part of quicktime that's needed to play such (mpeg2) files.

Again, your client needs those codecs to watch these clips. Otherwise you'll have to reencode. You'll see the codecs (components) on your mac if you go to /Library/QuickTime.

Dino

Thanks, that's very helpful. Is there a way I could export this with a more universal codec? If so, what would that be?

Jim Newberry
June 23rd, 2008, 07:23 PM
Can anyone suggest a codec that would degrade the image as little as possible, but be more universal than the current one? These .mov files I exported won't open on Macs without FCP 6 installed.

Craig Parkes
June 23rd, 2008, 11:26 PM
H.264 Is the highest quality regular playback codec - requires Quicktime 7 or above but is generally the most accepted in terms of bang for buck.

HOWEVER - it won't be suitable for your client to edit etc and will take a long time to transcode.

It's always a difficulty when clients say "Just give me a Quicktime." - Forgive them, because they do not know what they speak.

A Quicktime could be almost anything, do they need uncompressed, or editable on their system, or just ready for downconvert for web, or ready for output for web.

The request "Can you just give me..." when it comes to file based formats is always a headache - the best thing you can do is try and talk it through with their client - and if they don't know exactly what they want - then you should ask them what they need it for and then repost here and people should be able help out.

Jim Newberry
June 23rd, 2008, 11:46 PM
Thanks for the reply. From what I know so far they will be editing the footage, apparently with FCE. Which sucks because then (afaik) they can't use my FCP 6 files, nor my QT .mov files that are HD1080p30.

And I can't give them my camera tapes because the footage was shot with an XH-A1 at 30 frames.

How come the H.264 won't be suitable for editing--because it's been compressed and therefore degraded?


H.264 Is the highest quality regular playback codec - requires Quicktime 7 or above but is generally the most accepted in terms of bang for buck.

HOWEVER - it won't be suitable for your client to edit etc and will take a long time to transcode.

It's always a difficulty when clients say "Just give me a Quicktime." - Forgive them, because they do not know what they speak.

A Quicktime could be almost anything, do they need uncompressed, or editable on their system, or just ready for downconvert for web, or ready for output for web.

The request "Can you just give me..." when it comes to file based formats is always a headache - the best thing you can do is try and talk it through with their client - and if they don't know exactly what they want - then you should ask them what they need it for and then repost here and people should be able help out.

Aric Mannion
June 24th, 2008, 03:18 PM
DON'T DO h264. They are very compressed. It is true that HDV videos in Final Cut are .mov files. But the trick is that they are actually mpeg 2 (same codec as DVDs). The great thing about HDV is that it is HD, accept compressed so that the file sizes can be smaller. It's not compressed too much, but if you are exporting a self contained HDV timeline from Final cut it may have to compress even more!
It is a very weird concept: exporting self contained does not compress the video and is the ideal way to export.
EXCEPT in the case of HDV, where if you add transitions or happen to cut within the GOP it HAS TO recompress in those areas.
The best thing to do is export apple pro res. Although I'm not sure if people without that codec can even view those files (same problem with HDV's mpeg2 codec though.)
So for a high quality export you may want to export as "animation" codec or "uncompressed"? You'll get mammoth file sizes though.
Go to your sequence settings and you can change your render settings there to prores, animation, or uncompressed, and then export self contained current settings.
If you do export current settings note that you have to go to the RT drop down menu on the tope left of your timeline and make sure the settings are best quality or dynamic. If the quality is low there I think it effects your export.

Dino Leone
June 24th, 2008, 09:46 PM
Thanks for the reply. From what I know so far they will be editing the footage, apparently with FCE. Which sucks because then (afaik) they can't use my FCP 6 files, nor my QT .mov files that are HD1080p30.

And I can't give them my camera tapes because the footage was shot with an XH-A1 at 30 frames.

How come the H.264 won't be suitable for editing--because it's been compressed and therefore degraded?

The main difference between FCS2 and FCE is that the latter uses the Apple Intermediate codec and not HDV native codec. So I think if you export as Apple Intermediate codec (which also will generate .mov files) your client will be fine. I have used FCE (v3.5.1 at the time) myself with an XH A1 (using 1080p30) and it worked very well. I, like many others here on the forum, just dropped the 30p footage into a 1080i60 timeline... in any case that works beautifully. (I don't remember the details but the footage stays 30p).

Come to think about it, it might be that the Apple Intermediate codec might be your best choice - although very much disc-hungry. H264 is like the last option you want to take; as Aric mentioned, it's heavily compressed.

Dino