Has anyone seen this or has any opinion. On the face of it, at $345 it would seem like an ideal bit of kit to have.

Blackmagic Design: HyperDeck Shuttle (http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/hyperdeckshuttle/)

It's cheap until you start looking at the cost of SSD drives and the absolutely absurd amount of data consumed by uncompressed video! Why can't someone design a Cineform recorder?

The storage and data rates for uncompressed video are listed below:

525 NTSC uncompressed

8 bit @ 720 x 486 @ 29.97fps = 20 MB per/sec, or 70 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 720 x 486 @ 29.97fps = 27 MB per/sec, or 94 GB per/hr.

625 PAL uncompressed

8 bit @ 720 x 576 @ 25fps = 20 MB per/sec, or 70 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 720 x 576 @ 25fps = 26 MB per/sec, or 93 GB per/hr.

720p HDTV uncompressed

8 bit @ 1280 x 720 @ 59.94field = 105 MB per/sec, or 370 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 1280 x 720 @ 59.94field = 140 MB per/sec, or 494 GB per/hr.

1080i and 1080p HDTV uncompressed

8 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 24fps = 95 MB per/sec, or 334 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 24fps = 127 MB per/sec, or 445 GB per/hr.

8 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 25fps = 99 MB per/sec, or 348 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 25fps = 132 MB per/sec, or 463 GB per/hr.

8 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 29.97fps = 119 MB per/sec, or 417 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 29.97fps = 158 MB per/sec, or 556 GB per/hr.

1080i and 1080p HDTV RGB (4:4:4) uncompressed

10 bit @ 1280 x 720p @ 60fps = 211 MB per/sec, or 742 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 24fps = 190 MB per/sec, or 667 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 50i = 198 MB per/sec, or 695 GB per/hr.
10 bit @ 1920 x 1080 @ 60i = 237 MB per/sec, or 834 GB per/hr.

Uncompressed video - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncompressed_video)

The recorded video will eat through SSD's very quickly, but SSD's are the lowest cost per Gb solid state storage available today. Even given the high cost of SSD's and the large amount of data being recorded, if you compare it to ProResHQ on high end compact flash then the cost per minute is not all that different.

Long term storage of so much data is going to be an issue. A typical workflow might involve shooting uncompressed and then converting to the codec of your choice on ingest to the edit platform. The import/transcode process should be just about as fast as a straight import as the bottle neck will be the amount of data rather than the processing on an up to date computer. As the recording is uncompressed and you choose your codec on ingest, it is almost like having a camera that can record to the codec of your choice.

The main issue I do see with the Shuttle is the lack of monitoring of any description, so it's all to easy to forget to turn off the character output on the camera and end up with rushes with all your camera data burnt in to the image.

I just don't see where this fits in.

The Hyperdeck might have some applications for high end effects work where uncompressed is desirable but these guys are not short of cash and will use something with monitoring. Shooting uncompressed for most applications is more trouble than it's worth.

A device that recorded to Prores with some monitoring for under $1,000 like the Atmos Ninja makes a lot more sense. I would imagine devices like this for around $500 are not that far away.

On the face of it the BlackMagic drive did seem like a good option, but looking at the specs for uncompressed video, it may seem like an overkill.

Now if BlackMagic could make this device so it also recorded 35mbs files straight from the EX camera, then it may be an interesting option.

I just don't see where this fits in.


Really? I can see a fit. OK not so much for the EX1 but I can see a fit.

My view is that you'd record your footage to it and then transcode to Prores back at base. It wouldn't be an everyday tool but would be great for chromakey work.

As its SDI and HDMI it will work with the EX1 and smaller cameas. All my small AVCHD cameras have HDMI. I could bypass that horrific to handle codec and use one of these boxes. Then transcode it all to a format of my choice.

I'm giving this serious consideration. It wouldn't be an everyday tool but it would be a boon for my AVCHD units and the ability to use it for Chromakey work on the EX1 is just a bonus.

lol, somehow manufacturers tend to forget to add dimensions and weight to new products.
Especially, when things are said to be portable, I'm curious about dimensions and weight.
And with internal batteries I need to know how long they last. (I guess, more people would like to know.)

Walter,

Somewhere on the Hyperdeck site it says that the battery lasts about an hour. I don't know if that's an hour of recording or a mix of standby/record but there it is. It'll definitely need an extra battery.

Given that the difference in quality is fairly negligible, the reasons for me using one of these guys would be:

1) ProRes files

2) Extended recording times over (say) the Nikon D800's 20 min max.

Since I film events, having something that can shoot unattended for 60-90 mins is highly desirable. If the Hyperdeck only supports uncompressed then this kinda rules it out, whereas the Ninja seems to offer all the variations, so I would assume that ProRes 422 LT (for example) would get a lot more recording time in he same space.

Would I be correct in thinking the Ninja can do this?

The original Hyperdeck Shuttle only supported uncompressed. The Shuttle 2 supports uncompressed and DNxHD in either MXF or MOV containers.

I am currently testing my new BM w/ OcZ 240gbs ssd. The BM interup recording at haft of the space in my hard drive (144Gbs. ) does any body have the same problem?

Thanks

Could your clarify a few things? Is this a Shuttle or a Shuttle 2? Which OCZ SSD model is it? Did you try to record one large file? What BMD software/firmware version were you using? What format were you using to record? How did you format the SSD, on a Mac or a PC?

I've never tried to record a file that was larger than about 50 GB.

Thanks for asking Jay. It's the Shuttle 2. OCZ 240Gbs vertex3. Recording SD MOV wrap via SDI. Firrmware used comes with the package, not sure the version. I format the SSD with Mac. I do recording events so I have to know the capability of the device.

I don't see anything unusual with your setup. there have been a few reports of dropped frames with that model SSD and the Shuttle 2, but it seems to be one of the most commonly used SSDs with the recorder, so a problem like that should have shown up before. The only thing that I can suggest is downloading the 3.01 version of the Shuttle software/firmware and see if that helps. if not, file a support ticket with BMD. They are pretty good about tracking down these problems.

Does this problem occur with all three formats (DNxHD MXF, uncompressed MOV and DNxHD MOV)? How big a file can you record before the problem occurs?

Just wonder why compressed videos take too much space with BMD? This completely limits the use of the unit

Avid DNxHD compression is about 1/6 of uncompressed.
But is called lossless because it is so close to uncompressed in picture quality.
Many cameras have recording in higher ratios of onboard compression with lower quality.
That is what the Shuttle is for, higher quality with lower(or no) compression using HD SDI or HDMI output from the camera head.

Thanks Paul
Does that mean if we record in DNxHD we can have 6x longer for the same space that to record in uncompressed? and how to do that with Shuttle deck 2?

Yes, 6x longer.
You need to use a software utility called Black Magic Hyperdeck Utility to change settings on the Shuttle 2 to the desired format, DNxHD, ProRes or Uncompressed.
You can also set record trigger to SDI timecode or SDI start/stop(or never).
This is done over a usb connection.

Wow great, how come I did see these modes with Utility 2. Will check it over again . Does the DNxHD give good compression with 4:2:2 color sampling?
Thanks Paul.

Yes.
10bit 4:2:2
It is termed a lossless codec because it is so close in quality to uncompressed.

You can also set record trigger to SDI timecode or SDI start/stop(or never).
This is done over a usb connection.

However the sdi start stop function is not working with an F3 camera

Damn!
Crash record then.

Yeah the start/stop function doesn't work with my EX1 either. I tried to record DNxHD Quicktime (from 1080 sp) and my 240gbs SSD got full at 2hrs18minutes

Now I am trying it with DNxHD alone (From SD) to see if it can get any longer

2hrs 18 minutes is pretty good.
I think it is better to leave 20% or 15 minutes free on the ssd though.
I have encountered severe frame dropping on a HyperX 120Gb SSD when it was nearly full.
As an SSD fills up it gets to a point where the write speed decreases.

This kind of media is quite cheap when compared with Sony or Panasonic memory or even compact flash cards.
It is about the same as what I paid for DVCPro tapes many years ago.
And they're getting cheaper.