View Full Version : XLR and Phantom power-confused.


John Disdle
March 5th, 2018, 08:25 AM
I have just bought a Prosound Handheld Dynamic Mic from maplin for use with a Behringer 502 mixer. I don`t need anything expensive so £20 is about right.

The reviews are all good, and the answered questions on site, assured me it had an XLR cable to plug into any mixer etc.

It does have an XLR plug on the mic, but the other end is a ¼ inch jack. So very disappointed, as there is very little output listening via the headphone amp. If I buy an XLR female to male cable, will it use the phantom power for more output please?

The mixer diagram does show the XM8500 mic with an XLR to plug into the mixer. Both mics seem about the same sensitivity at -75db.
Many thanks...

Roger Gunkel
March 5th, 2018, 10:15 AM
Hi John,

The Maplin Prosound Dynamic mic is definitely not a 'Pro' mic and at that price will be a low quality dynamic. To be honest, any equipment that has 'Pro' in the name is going to be pretty low quality.

Dynamic mics do not have phantom power and connecting an XLR to it with a phantom output from a mixer is likely to destroy the mic if the connections are not correct. The mixer sends 15V phantom power through the XLR connector so a powered mic, capacitor or condenser with external powering ability should be ok.

The Maplin lead supplied with the mic is probably intended for a PA amp input and it is not clear on the mixer whether the input under the XLR is for a mic or line input.The other inputs are for line level and would give extremely low volume from a mic.

It really depends on what you want to use the mic for, as something like a Shure SM58 or one of the Shure beta mics would be much better for hand held at a sub £100 price. The other downside with the cheap Maplin mics is that they tend to pick up a lot of handling noise.

Roger

Rick Reineke
March 5th, 2018, 11:47 AM
Can't go wrong with an SM57 or 58 (same mic except for the 58's 'ball' windscreen). Even a pre-owned one would likely work ok.. they are pretty much indestructible.
As was stated, dynamic mics do NOT require Phantom Power.

Rob Neidig
March 5th, 2018, 12:27 PM
Quick correction to Rick's post - I believe he meant to say "Dynamic mics DO NOT require phantom power."

As others have noted, the Prosound mic does not appear to be that great. However, one of the major issues is the XLR to 1/4-inch cord. Using it forces you to plug into the "Line" input on your Behringer mixer. It isn't real clear from the manual, but it appears that using the Line input means you only have 40dB of gain available. If you use a normal "mic cable", meaning XLR connections on both ends, you would plug into the "Mic" input on the Behringer. It appears this has 60dB of gain available. Since the Prosound mic is pretty cheap, and Behringer gear is also pretty cheap, then you still may not get great sound, but it should be far better than what you are currently getting with the XLR-1/4-inch cable.

Have fun!

Richard Crowley
March 5th, 2018, 03:30 PM
The "Prosound Handheld Dynamic Mic" appears to be a cheap imitation of something like the standard Shure SM58, etc. Although the "specifications" seem to have been written by people who know nothing about microphones, we can assume that it is an ordinary, low-impedance, balanced dynamic microphone.

It will not use phantom power (as with any dynamic mic). Although, typically it will tolerate phantom power without damage.

The supplied XLR-Female to 1/4 inch phone male cable is probably designed to plug into a guitar amplifier, etc. If you plug the 1/4 inch plug into most any mixer it will probably be a line-level input and you will hear little (or no) signal level plugging a dynamic mic into a line-level input.

But if you use an XLR-Female to XLR-Make cable, you can plug it into the proper mic-level input of your typical mixer and hear a much stronger signal.

John Disdle
March 6th, 2018, 02:16 AM
Thank you all for your replies.

I think the best option, is to take the mic back for a re-fund, and build a mic pre-amp. Using one of the several mics I have laying about.
I was hoping to save time and effort. Mic pre-amps seem to be either very expensive, or none existent....

Peter Parker
March 6th, 2018, 10:23 AM
Better hurry up John, haven't Maplins got the Administrators in?

https://www.maplin.co.uk/clearance-shop

Rick Reineke
March 6th, 2018, 10:39 AM
Quick correction to Rick's post - I believe he meant to say "Dynamic mics DO NOT require phantom power."
Yes, I meant to say "do NOT". Thanks Rob.

Bernie Beaudry
March 6th, 2018, 11:37 AM
Thank you all for your replies.

I think the best option, is to take the mic back for a re-fund, and build a mic pre-amp. Using one of the several mics I have laying about.
I was hoping to save time and effort. Mic pre-amps seem to be either very expensive, or none existent....
Why do you need to build a preamp? The mixer has a mic preamp in its mic input. If you used an xlr to xlr cable you would be able to plug into the mic input of the mixer, not the line input and you might get acceptable level that way.

Bernie Beaudry
March 6th, 2018, 11:46 AM
I have just bought a Prosound Handheld Dynamic Mic from maplin for use with a Behringer 502 mixer. I don`t need anything expensive so £20 is about right.

The reviews are all good, and the answered questions on site, assured me it had an XLR cable to plug into any mixer etc.

It does have an XLR plug on the mic, but the other end is a ¼ inch jack. So very disappointed, as there is very little output listening via the headphone amp. If I buy an XLR female to male cable, will it use the phantom power for more output please?

The mixer diagram does show the XM8500 mic with an XLR to plug into the mixer. Both mics seem about the same sensitivity at -75db.
Many thanks...
Some mixers have a quarter inch mic input but not the one you have. The quarter inch input on your mixer is a line level input which will yield very low level from a mic level signal. The mic might be just fine, you just need an xlr to xlr cable instead of xlr to 1/4 inch. You could get an xlr connector and replace the 1/4 inch connector, or get a whole different cable.

Pete Cofrancesco
March 6th, 2018, 12:03 PM
Like Rick said Shure SM58 is the undisputed champion of handheld dynamic mics. They’re only $50 used. No need to over think this. Btw I don’t believe you ever said what you are using it for.

Richard Crowley
March 6th, 2018, 12:47 PM
Thank you all for your replies.

I think the best option, is to take the mic back for a re-fund, and build a mic pre-amp. Using one of the several mics I have laying about.
I was hoping to save time and effort. Mic pre-amps seem to be either very expensive, or none existent....

I completely disagree on both counts. There is very likely nothing wrong with the microphone. You simply have not connected it properly (with a proper XLR to XLR microphone cable).
And using an outboard microphone preamp (whether bought or built) is just a bizzare "solution" to this straightforward problem.

David Peterson
March 7th, 2018, 12:28 AM
Wow.

Just wow.

Scratch building a pre amp instead of just using the usual normal cable everyone uses that is meant to be done?

I don't even....

John Disdle
March 7th, 2018, 02:08 AM
Thanks again folks.

Still a little confused!!! From the above posts, I see that a dynamic mic does not use phantom power, but if I buy an XLR to XLR and use the input on the mixer, I will get another 20 db gain. Sounds good, and not as much hassle if it`s successful, so I will go this rout first thanks....

Gary Nattrass
March 7th, 2018, 05:21 AM
Thanks again folks.

Still a little confused!!! From the above posts, I see that a dynamic mic does not use phantom power, but if I buy an XLR to XLR and use the input on the mixer, I will get another 20 db gain. Sounds good, and not as much hassle if it`s successful, so I will go this rout first thanks....

Yes the XLR are mic level inputs and the 1/4inch will be line level so you need an XLR to XLR cable.

Personally I would still take the mic back and buy a better one from studiospares: https://www.studiospares.com/Microphones/Mics-Dynamic/Studiospares-S945-Dynamic-Mic_449630.htm

John Disdle
March 9th, 2018, 10:56 AM
Problem solved! Returned the Maplin mic, and bought a Power Dynamics PDM660 Condenser Mic from Amazon, at £23.
It has a case, mic holder and XLR to XLR cable, although the photo shows an XLR to jack plug. Sensitivity is -46db, and it works very well.
Thanks for all your help...

Paul R Johnson
March 10th, 2018, 04:21 AM
Don't get excited by 20dB gain - microphones produce microvolts - which isn't surprising when you think it's doing a similar job to a wind turbine - just on a much smaller scale - using sound waves to wobble a diaphragm in a magnetic field. The line input is for other devices that stick out millivolts - up to over a volt! The extra gain on the XLR is just what any device needs to have.

Don't think of the phantom power as anything special either - it's just a neat way of piggybacking some powering voltage for mics that need it (condensers, which have electronics inside) via the cable that carries the sound. Dynamic mics just ignore it, and the only practical issue is when you forget to pull the fader down when you connect the cable - and you get a loud POP through the speakers when the voltage suddenly appears. Some people go into melt-down when this happens, expecting to catch their speaker cones flying through the air when they go from 0 to 100mph in an instant. Other people are more relaxed about it and don't stress. Most quietly curse, confident their systems will cope. Never had any speakers blown since 1974 when I first discovered the 'feature'. Perhaps I'm just lucky.If it means a 100m round trip to pull down a fader, or risk it - I risk it every time. It's bad practice and probably stupid, but that's me!

One word of warning. Shure SM57 and SM58 mics are still, after 40 years, the industry standard - the workhorse - and Ebay is FULL of counterfeit ones. Brand new, they're going to be 80+ (in any currency). A new mic cheaper than this on Ebay will be a fake. They work, but sound like your Marlins mics. Just a bit dull and maybe feedback prone, live. The people shifting this dodgy stock are now resorting to scuffing them with a bit of sandpaper, crumpling up or throwing away the destructions and the mic clip, and selling them as used but nearly perfect. I would never buy a Shure mic on Ebay in a million years - and for fun, I've been buying obvious fakes to see what they are like - and there are even Shure 545 mics - the forerunner of the SM57 on sale, but the last one was sold a long time ago, and the counterfeiters forgot that the zip up cases are a newer thing, and that they were always brushed aluminium NOT chromed type finish. I also have a Share SM86 condenser - that magically works without phantom power, because inside it is a dynamic. Ebay also has Sennheiser 835s and 845s that have never seen the inside of a Sennheiser factory. Ebay do nothing about this, and gullible people get 'bargains' for very low prices, but get pretty much a 15 pound microphone in return.