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Old September 6th, 2009, 05:32 PM   #61
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... Cheap media, unlike SxS or P2. Better codec than the EX or the JVC cameras, giving 4:2:2. Better quality, and none of the editing problems of AVC-HD.

The other thing I would like to see are all three main formats (and the 60Hz equivalents): 1080i/25, 1080p/25, and 720p/50.
#1 is reasonable if you assume Canon does NOT build on what it has done in the 5DM2 and 7D. Otherwise, you are out of luck.

#2 All those formats I believe are in the 7D. So the remaining missing piece is the video camera itself, and the appropriate lenses.
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Old September 7th, 2009, 03:50 PM   #62
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#1 is reasonable if you assume Canon does NOT build on what it has done in the 5DM2 and 7D. Otherwise, you are out of luck.
My assumption is that an "XL-H2" is more likely to build on an XL-H1 than a 5D2 - I regard the latter as a (very good) still camera with a video mode. In that respect, the move to higher than HDV quality would be answering what Sony have done with the EX and JVC have done with the HM700.

H264 would be one answer, but that is difficult to edit natively. It's no better quality than MPEG2 necessarily, just achieves a given level at a slightly lower bitrate. In a camera like this, MPEG2 at 35/50Mbs seems a good compromise - relatively easy to edit, high quality, but still a low enough rate to fit on SDHC/CF cards. Going to 50Mbs wouldn't just yield 4:2:2 - it would put clear marketing water between it and Sony and JVC at 35Mbs.
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#2 All those formats I believe are in the 7D. So the remaining missing piece is the video camera itself, and the appropriate lenses.
Well, not quite - I don't think the 7D does 1080i/25, and I didn't think the XL-H1 did 720p/50. I'd see the ability to record 1080i/25. 1080p/25 and 720p/50 (as on the EX) as a very good thing.
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Old September 8th, 2009, 04:05 PM   #63
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Well, not quite - I don't think the 7D does 1080i/25, and I didn't think the XL-H1 did 720p/50. I'd see the ability to record 1080i/25. 1080p/25 and 720p/50 (as on the EX) as a very good thing.
You don't have to take my word for what the Canon 7D can do.
Have a look at this web page, click on the Features tab, and have a good read.
The format+framerates the 7D will do are right at the top.

Canon EOS 7D Digital SLR

Last edited by Bill Koehler; September 8th, 2009 at 04:06 PM. Reason: typo
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Old September 8th, 2009, 05:05 PM   #64
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Have a look at this web page, click on the Features tab, and have a good read.
Yes, and from that it's as I thought:
Quote:
selectable frame rates: 1920 x 1080 (Full HD): 30p (29.97) / 24p (23.976) / 25p, ..........{plus other frame sizes....}
no 1080i/25.

At 1920x1080 you just get 30p, 24p, and 25p.
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Old September 9th, 2009, 07:44 AM   #65
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Considering video capable DSLRs, their rolling shutter when it comes to their CMOS sensor is absolutely horrid. Using live view on the D90 and the Canon, I was getting huge amounts of rolling shutter artifacts. When it's actually recording, this would never be able to be used for matchmoving...

If Panasonic's AVC-Intra is a sign of what's to come, the consortium that made HDV should make a professional tapeless format that isn't consumer centered like AVCHD is.

Once that codec is out, a XL-H2 could be possible.
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Old September 9th, 2009, 10:09 AM   #66
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Well my feeling is with this supposed XL H2, they will probably go with CF cards and an H.264 codec very much in line with what's coming from the 7D. Of course, it'll have HD-SDI, or hopefully 3G HD-SDI for 4:4:4.

What will make this camera amazing besides the tech being built for video in mind (a specific APS-C sensor that will try to minimize/eliminate CMOS cons?), is the fact that it'll be a camera which focuses on video first.

I would think it's form factor will be somewhere very close to what the XL series is now.
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Old September 9th, 2009, 02:27 PM   #67
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......... the consortium that made HDV should make a professional tapeless format that isn't consumer centered like AVCHD is.
Isn't that what 35Mbs or (even better) 50Mbs MPEG2 are? The latter (as XDCAM 422HD) has (like AVC-Intra 100) gaining full acceptance for future broadcast acquisition, according to recent EBU tests. Based on HDV (as MPEG2), but a much higher quality, and giving 4:2:2 in the 50Mbs version.

For a prosumer camera, 50Mbs means easily recordable onto fairly cheap memory cards.

Why bother with H264? It won't necessarily give any better quality than MPEG2, just give the same at a slightly lower bitrate. Against that is lack of support from NLEs, and a likely need to transcode before editing.
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Old September 9th, 2009, 05:19 PM   #68
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Canon Announcement September 29, 2009

"During this fall, Canon will make one of its largest and most important launches in the company’s history and we hope you can attend. During a luncheon, you are invited to listen to CEO Jouko Tuouminen, Marketing presiden Monica Forsberg and trend analyst Magnus Lindkvist, talking about tomorrows trends and factors of success in the continually more digitalized everyday life."

Hmmm ... could this finally be the video camera we're waiting for? Or a 1DMark4?

Or a new product line like Vacuum Cleaners with Optical Image Stabilization?

:)
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Old September 9th, 2009, 06:26 PM   #69
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A Mark7 XLH2 vacuum with OIS? But which codec?
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Old September 12th, 2009, 02:53 PM   #70
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The latest gossip from IBC is that the September Announcement is regarding a 21MP video camera. Canon Europe have the Business Design Centre in Islington Booked for a exhibition in early October...
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Old September 12th, 2009, 03:34 PM   #71
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talking about tomorrows trends and factors of success in the continually more digitalized everyday life."
You need a 21MP video camera for your 'digitalized everyday life'?
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Old September 12th, 2009, 04:51 PM   #72
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You need a 21MP video camera for your 'digitalized everyday life'?
Ughh Yeeeeeeah ....

:)
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Old September 15th, 2009, 11:03 AM   #73
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Everybody at Canon in IBC was tight lipped about the Sep29 event but I got a hint that is about a video camera launch. On the other hand I cannot understand why they didn't launch it at IBC where it would have been more apropriate. Anyway if it is APS or bigger it must be Cmos because CCDs in small form cameras become very hot (thats why Sony put only a 1/2inch chip on EX1/3). If the 21Mp rumor holds then probably is FF. Ideally it will be FF 4/3 with the option for 16/9 APS
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Old September 16th, 2009, 12:40 AM   #74
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... Anyway if it is APS or bigger it must be Cmos because CCDs in small form cameras become very hot (thats why Sony put only a 1/2inch chip on EX1/3). If the 21Mp rumor holds then probably is FF. Ideally it will be FF 4/3 with the option for 16/9 APS
Emmanuel,

I'm not disputing that CCD is hotter than CMOS, but FYI the EX1/3's have 1/2" CMOS's not CCD's. BTW, Sony's F35 has one CCD, their F23 has three CCD's , Dalsa used a CCD, and I believe the Viper uses CCD's as well.
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Old September 17th, 2009, 05:03 PM   #75
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Maybe I wasn't clear. I meant that Sony decided to put a 1/2 CMOS instead of 1/2 CCD in a SMALL FORM camera like EX1/3 because such a small camera cannot deal with the heat emitted from the CCD's. SONY in the much bigger 1/2 3XX line of cameras, uses CCD. In the same manner all the cameras you mentioned (viper, dalsa, F23, F35), all are large cameras that can deal with CCD's heat.

I didn't make that out of my head. It was the response of a SONY tech in last year's IBC on why they used CMOS instead CCD in the EX1/3.
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