ATOMOS Subforum?

James Kuhn · December 5th, 2011, 12:44 PM

Mike...I 'think' Marty is referring to the Time Code actuation available on the 'Samurai', it allows HD-SDI 'Trigger Record' to 'start and stop' recording.

J.

Mike Watson · December 5th, 2011, 01:12 PM

I know it looked like I was responding to him, but mine was just a stream of consciousness statement. I had been hoping/assuming you could plug it in to A/C power, and you can't. (Directly, at least). Just wanted to share that.

James Kuhn · December 5th, 2011, 04:41 PM

Aaaahhh. I understand, I'm sorry for the confusion.

J.

David Elkins · December 5th, 2011, 06:37 PM

I am getting no love triggering the Samurai to record via LANC. Anyone else get it to work? The device I am using has been able to trigger many makes of camera (Canon, Sony) so I am confident it works. Are there flavors of the LANC protocol that I am unaware of?

Also, the Samurai manual (page 13) states this for LANC control:

There are 5 ways to start and stop record.

4. Via LANC for Sony and Canon Cameras
5. Via the LANC serial port
controlled by a third party computer or controller.
For system and OEM integration, contact support@atomos.com

I have contacted Atomos Support and waiting to hear back, but there seems to be a known issue based on this being in the manual.

Mike Sims · December 5th, 2011, 07:50 PM

David- There are definitely different implementations of LANC. I also am having problems with this. According to Atomos, controllers for Sony and most Canon cameras (but not Panasonic) should work. This is contrary to the Samurai User Manual which has a misprint. I have reported the problem to Atomos and they are working on it but I don’t know at what priority. Perhaps if you, and everyone else experiencing this, also contact Atomos Support we can get a quicker solution. One thing they have stressed is that besides a LANC controller connected to the Samurai LANC IN you must also have a connection from the Samurai LANC OUT to the camera (the LANC chain must be terminated at the camera not the Samurai). Not only are my controllers not triggering the Samurai, the Samurai is not passing the commands through to the camera at this time. If anyone gets a solution for this please report here what controller and camera you are using.

Edit: We crossed posts and I see you have reported this also. It also seems that the manual may have already been modified from when I reported this so maybe something will happen soon...

David Elkins · December 6th, 2011, 10:44 AM

That's interesting, Mike. Can you elaborate on the "loop through"? I am not sure I follow, because if you are sending a line out of the device/camera's LANC where are you supposed to bring the terminating line to? Most camera's I know only have 1 port.

This is a critical problem for me to solve because I am using my Samurai in an unconventional set-up. I have been waiting for months for the Samurai as the last piece and if it doesn't work, well, a lot of time has been wasted on my part.

Mike Sims · December 6th, 2011, 12:51 PM

Yes, David, I know exactly what you mean. My set up is rather unconventional as well (I’ll be starting a thread about it soon.) I paid for the Samurai eight months ago and bought all the other equipment at the same time. By the time the Samurai arrived the “send it back date” was long passed on everything else. Fortunately it all works.

What I was talking about is connecting the LANC controller to the Samurai LANC IN and connecting a patch cord from the Samurai LANC OUT to the camera’s LANC port. This should allow the controller to trigger record/stop on the Samurai while the Samurai passes these commands through to the camera. It would start/stop recording to tape on the camera for a tape back-up and, more importantly for me, pass zoom commands to the lens. Right now the controller won’t trigger the Samurai and commands don’t pass through to the camera. A stop-gap solution for me has been to connect a patch cord from the camera LANC port to the Samurai LANC IN and trigger the camera with it’s IR remote. This also triggers record on the Samurai. I don’t have a reliable way to mount the camera remote to the pan/tilt arm which is how I’m used to working. What Atomos has said definitely will not work is just connecting the controller to the Samurai without a connection from the Samurai out to the camera.

I know they are working on figuring it out. I got another e-mail this morning asking me to try something and report back. So far I have been very pleased with support from Atomos. Here are a couple of other things I have learned from them which I haven’t seen reported yet here:

They intend to produce a sun-screen for the Ninja and Samurai but have not yet started working on it and don’t know when it will be available.

The DNxHD upgrade is expected to ship in February.

Robert Fierce · December 6th, 2011, 02:37 PM

Mike Watson-
B&H does list an AC power option for the Samurai. The B&H order No. is ATOMACP001 $80.00

Matthew Hurley · December 6th, 2011, 03:10 PM

Just tested a tried and true ProLanc controller on a Sony NX5U and the Atomos NINJA. This ProLanc controller is a simple On/Off/Record/Stop affair only. It will control the Sony NX5U when plugged directly into the camera, but when looped through the NINJA neither the camera or ninja work.

It appears the NINJA is not accepting or passing the low voltage Lanc signal during loop through.

Tested another vendors Lanc controller and it to did not work with the NINJA. Rather frustrating if one wants to use the NINJA when mounted on a handheld rig.

Also tested the ProLanc controller directly plugged into my Sony FS-100.It worked fine, yet when looping through the NINJA once again nothing happens!

This is the controller I am using. ProLance LRC-01 controller. http://www.prolanc.com/products.html

Mike Watson · December 6th, 2011, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Fierce

Mike Watson-
B&H does list an AC power option for the Samurai. The B&H order No. is ATOMACP001 $80.00

Near as I can tell, there is nowhere on the Samurai to plug in a DC adapter like that one. If there was, they are certainly available for less than $80. I did look for a standard-ish DC jack on the Samurai, and didn't find one, hence my conclusion that it was not possible.

I did qualify my earlier statement, in that I think there is an AC adapter out there that looks like a 970 battery but plugs into the wall (AC/DC transformer style) that would probably power it. I'm sure I have one in the archives here somewhere, as I know I've used one before.

David Elkins · December 7th, 2011, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Sims

Yes, David, I know exactly what you mean.

What I was talking about is connecting the LANC controller to the Samurai LANC IN and connecting a patch cord from the Samurai LANC OUT to the camera’s LANC port. This should allow the controller to trigger record/stop on the Samurai while the Samurai passes these commands through to the camera. What Atomos has said definitely will not work is just connecting the controller to the Samurai without a connection from the Samurai out to the camera.

I know they are working on figuring it out. I got another e-mail this morning asking me to try something and report back. So far I have been very pleased with support from Atomos.

Thanks for the explanation Mike. Why Atomos does not make this information available is beyond me. Contrary to your experience with Atomos support I cannot say the same. They have yet to respond to my request after 3 days other than an automated reply. Unfortunately, looping through is not an option for me because I am using a custom made BE-HD10 camera that has no LANC. I am triggering with a motion activated device for a camera trap. I suppose I could throw a small Sony handicam into the enclosure to complete the loop, but that is just another thing to have to supply power to which is at a premium in this rig. I really thought this was going to work, but now I may be going with the PIX 240.

Robert Fierce · December 7th, 2011, 01:22 PM

Mike-
B&H used the wrong picture, but they do sell the AC adapter for the Samurai. The correct picture can be found in the Samurai manual, item 13, listed as optional. However, if you can find a cheaper solution please let us know as $80 does seem a bit much. Thanks

David Elkins · December 7th, 2011, 02:22 PM

Robert,
I purchased the Sony AC-VQ1050D and it powers the Samurai no problem. While pricey ($98), time is money and I have no idea how long it will take to get the Atomos version. Plus it includes a 12V adapter so I can charge the batteries from my truck if necessary.

On another note, I can report that the Samurai draws about 6.5 watts in standby and jumps to 7.4-7.6W when recording using a SSD. Just FYI, this is important for the project I'm working on.

Mike Sims · December 7th, 2011, 03:08 PM

David- That is an interesting application. If you can say at this point, what subject are you going after? I have built a couple of camera traps in the past based on the old Pixcontroller boards. They had the ability (although I never used it) to activate a servo which was mostly used to switch on and off Nightshot mode on the Sony cameras. Can your trigger circuit possibly trigger a servo or solenoid to physically touch and trigger the record/stop on the Samurai touch screen? It might be crude but effective.

Sorry about your slow response from Atomos support. I suspect as more and more units get out there they may be temporarily overwhelmed. I was supposed to hear back from them today but haven’t yet.

James Kuhn · December 7th, 2011, 10:13 PM

I just got the craziest email from Atomos announcing their attendance at the 2011 IBC in Amsterdam, September 9 - 13. "FIND US AT STAND 6.C28e". Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't IBC 2011 already occur?

This is a little odd, don't you think?

J.

December 5th, 2011, 12:44 PM	#136
James Kuhn Major Player Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Merritt Island, Florida Posts: 865	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? Mike...I 'think' Marty is referring to the Time Code actuation available on the 'Samurai', it allows HD-SDI 'Trigger Record' to 'start and stop' recording. J.

December 5th, 2011, 01:12 PM	#137
Mike Watson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 1,082	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? I know it looked like I was responding to him, but mine was just a stream of consciousness statement. I had been hoping/assuming you could plug it in to A/C power, and you can't. (Directly, at least). Just wanted to share that.

December 5th, 2011, 04:41 PM	#138
James Kuhn Major Player Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Merritt Island, Florida Posts: 865	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? Aaaahhh. I understand, I'm sorry for the confusion. J.

December 5th, 2011, 06:37 PM	#139
David Elkins Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 147	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? I am getting no love triggering the Samurai to record via LANC. Anyone else get it to work? The device I am using has been able to trigger many makes of camera (Canon, Sony) so I am confident it works. Are there flavors of the LANC protocol that I am unaware of? Also, the Samurai manual (page 13) states this for LANC control: There are 5 ways to start and stop record. 4. Via LANC for Sony and Canon Cameras 5. Via the LANC serial port controlled by a third party computer or controller. For system and OEM integration, contact support@atomos.com I have contacted Atomos Support and waiting to hear back, but there seems to be a known issue based on this being in the manual. __________________ www.elkinseye.com Last edited by David Elkins; December 5th, 2011 at 07:39 PM.

December 5th, 2011, 07:50 PM	#140
Mike Sims Major Player Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 880	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? David- There are definitely different implementations of LANC. I also am having problems with this. According to Atomos, controllers for Sony and most Canon cameras (but not Panasonic) should work. This is contrary to the Samurai User Manual which has a misprint. I have reported the problem to Atomos and they are working on it but I don’t know at what priority. Perhaps if you, and everyone else experiencing this, also contact Atomos Support we can get a quicker solution. One thing they have stressed is that besides a LANC controller connected to the Samurai LANC IN you must also have a connection from the Samurai LANC OUT to the camera (the LANC chain must be terminated at the camera not the Samurai). Not only are my controllers not triggering the Samurai, the Samurai is not passing the commands through to the camera at this time. If anyone gets a solution for this please report here what controller and camera you are using. Edit: We crossed posts and I see you have reported this also. It also seems that the manual may have already been modified from when I reported this so maybe something will happen soon...

December 6th, 2011, 10:44 AM	#141
David Elkins Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 147	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? That's interesting, Mike. Can you elaborate on the "loop through"? I am not sure I follow, because if you are sending a line out of the device/camera's LANC where are you supposed to bring the terminating line to? Most camera's I know only have 1 port. This is a critical problem for me to solve because I am using my Samurai in an unconventional set-up. I have been waiting for months for the Samurai as the last piece and if it doesn't work, well, a lot of time has been wasted on my part. __________________ www.elkinseye.com

December 6th, 2011, 12:51 PM	#142
Mike Sims Major Player Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 880	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? Yes, David, I know exactly what you mean. My set up is rather unconventional as well (I’ll be starting a thread about it soon.) I paid for the Samurai eight months ago and bought all the other equipment at the same time. By the time the Samurai arrived the “send it back date” was long passed on everything else. Fortunately it all works. What I was talking about is connecting the LANC controller to the Samurai LANC IN and connecting a patch cord from the Samurai LANC OUT to the camera’s LANC port. This should allow the controller to trigger record/stop on the Samurai while the Samurai passes these commands through to the camera. It would start/stop recording to tape on the camera for a tape back-up and, more importantly for me, pass zoom commands to the lens. Right now the controller won’t trigger the Samurai and commands don’t pass through to the camera. A stop-gap solution for me has been to connect a patch cord from the camera LANC port to the Samurai LANC IN and trigger the camera with it’s IR remote. This also triggers record on the Samurai. I don’t have a reliable way to mount the camera remote to the pan/tilt arm which is how I’m used to working. What Atomos has said definitely will not work is just connecting the controller to the Samurai without a connection from the Samurai out to the camera. I know they are working on figuring it out. I got another e-mail this morning asking me to try something and report back. So far I have been very pleased with support from Atomos. Here are a couple of other things I have learned from them which I haven’t seen reported yet here: They intend to produce a sun-screen for the Ninja and Samurai but have not yet started working on it and don’t know when it will be available. The DNxHD upgrade is expected to ship in February.

December 6th, 2011, 02:37 PM	#143
Robert Fierce New Boot Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Albany CA Posts: 15	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? Mike Watson- B&H does list an AC power option for the Samurai. The B&H order No. is ATOMACP001 $80.00

December 6th, 2011, 03:10 PM	#144
Matthew Hurley Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Atlanta Georgia USA Posts: 77	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? Just tested a tried and true ProLanc controller on a Sony NX5U and the Atomos NINJA. This ProLanc controller is a simple On/Off/Record/Stop affair only. It will control the Sony NX5U when plugged directly into the camera, but when looped through the NINJA neither the camera or ninja work. It appears the NINJA is not accepting or passing the low voltage Lanc signal during loop through. Tested another vendors Lanc controller and it to did not work with the NINJA. Rather frustrating if one wants to use the NINJA when mounted on a handheld rig. Also tested the ProLanc controller directly plugged into my Sony FS-100.It worked fine, yet when looping through the NINJA once again nothing happens! This is the controller I am using. ProLance LRC-01 controller. http://www.prolanc.com/products.html __________________ http://www.youtube.com/user/JustAnotherCameraMan

December 7th, 2011, 01:22 PM	#147
Robert Fierce New Boot Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Albany CA Posts: 15	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? Mike- B&H used the wrong picture, but they do sell the AC adapter for the Samurai. The correct picture can be found in the Samurai manual, item 13, listed as optional. However, if you can find a cheaper solution please let us know as $80 does seem a bit much. Thanks

December 7th, 2011, 02:22 PM	#148
David Elkins Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 147	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? Robert, I purchased the Sony AC-VQ1050D and it powers the Samurai no problem. While pricey ($98), time is money and I have no idea how long it will take to get the Atomos version. Plus it includes a 12V adapter so I can charge the batteries from my truck if necessary. On another note, I can report that the Samurai draws about 6.5 watts in standby and jumps to 7.4-7.6W when recording using a SSD. Just FYI, this is important for the project I'm working on. __________________ www.elkinseye.com

December 7th, 2011, 03:08 PM	#149
Mike Sims Major Player Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 880	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? David- That is an interesting application. If you can say at this point, what subject are you going after? I have built a couple of camera traps in the past based on the old Pixcontroller boards. They had the ability (although I never used it) to activate a servo which was mostly used to switch on and off Nightshot mode on the Sony cameras. Can your trigger circuit possibly trigger a servo or solenoid to physically touch and trigger the record/stop on the Samurai touch screen? It might be crude but effective. Sorry about your slow response from Atomos support. I suspect as more and more units get out there they may be temporarily overwhelmed. I was supposed to hear back from them today but haven’t yet.

December 7th, 2011, 10:13 PM	#150
James Kuhn Major Player Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Merritt Island, Florida Posts: 865	Re: ATOMOS Subforum? I just got the craziest email from Atomos announcing their attendance at the 2011 IBC in Amsterdam, September 9 - 13. "FIND US AT STAND 6.C28e". Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't IBC 2011 already occur? This is a little odd, don't you think? J.