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Old April 22nd, 2008, 10:16 AM   #1
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is Samsung SC-HMX20C AVCHD?

Hi there,
I need a small, 2nd camera... frustrated because AVCHD is so difficult to work with (I'm on a Mac, edit with AVID).
Just wondering if the Samsung SC-HMX20C is AVCHD, or perhaps something else that's more Mac (and hopefully AVID) friendly.
Cheers,
Malcolm
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Old April 22nd, 2008, 10:39 AM   #2
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This article indicates that it is:

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6517472.html
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Old April 22nd, 2008, 10:59 AM   #3
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According to http://product.samsung.com/digitalcamcorder/ it's using H.264 or some derivative of it, so it may or may not be AVCHD. Samsung is a member of the AVCHD consortium but so far there doesn't appear to be any conclusive information about AVCHD in the HMX10 or HMX20.
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Old April 22nd, 2008, 11:06 AM   #4
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Thanks guys,
I guess I'll bide my time, wait and see. Something's going to break this AVCHD/editing logjam, I hope.
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Old July 3rd, 2008, 01:52 PM   #5
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Samsung SC-HMX20C HD camcorder review

http://www.engadgethd.com/photos/sam...nds-on/856851/
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Old July 4th, 2008, 12:00 AM   #6
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The Samsung SC-HMX20c is not a bad little camera. I played around with it at Circuit City and played with the files created by the camera:

http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/06/17...corder-review/

See:
Quote:
For what it is (and for what it costs), Sammy's latest HD camcorder excels. After a week with it, we simply couldn't find enough niggles to tell you to look elsewhere if you're already close to pulling the trigger. Do we wish the LCD backlight was a wee bit brighter? Sure. Do we wish the low-light performance was a smidgen better? Of course. But at the end of the day, is the SC-HMX20C a solid buy for the price? We think so. Take a peek at the (completely unedited) clips below to get a very loose feel for what this unit can do.

Right-click and Save As...
27.5MB: 480p clip at the ball field

84.9MB: 1080p clip at the ball field

38.3MB: 1080p clip in dimly lit hallway

47.7MB: 1080p shot, leisurely walk in the neighborhood

35MB: 1080p shot of flower bed

10MB: SlowMotion capture of pitcher
The image sensor is 0.55", which is larger than most HD consumer cameras. The camera uses the Sony IMX017CQE chip for the image sensor.

You may want to download the clips and try editing them. Also, your local Circuit City or Best Buy may have the camera in stock. Try going there and playing around with it.

If you bring in a good quality SD memory card, or better yet SDHC memory card, you can try recording your own files to the card. Just remember to select the memory card as the output. (The camera has its own 8GB internal memory.)


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Old July 7th, 2008, 07:21 AM   #7
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About european version of Samsung camcorder VP-HMX20 here - >
http://crave.cnet.co.uk/camcorders/0...9297077,00.htm
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Old July 18th, 2008, 06:59 PM   #8
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I bought one for about $650 at Circuit City and love it. I took it on my family vacation to the Black Hills last week, along with a DSLR, and I used the HMX20 for stills more often than the DSLR because it takes fast sequential images, and is just plain fun to use. Zooming leads to a lot of shaky cam, and the anti-shake feature adds a sort of periodic jerkiness to the image which bothers me, but I love the image quality and not having to deal with DV tapes.
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Old July 30th, 2008, 09:32 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Diaz View Post
http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/06/17...corder-review/You may want to download the clips and try editing themBob Diaz
Hi Bob,
For whatever reason, I can't get to the page to download some test files. And where I live (in Ottawa, Canada), no store seems to carry this camera, so I can't test it out myself.

I'm interested in it, even though I'd prefer the Sony, say (my other camera is a Sony, and I'm looking for compatibility), or the just-announced Canon, especially if it's got the higher frame rate - - except that I use Avid to edit and from everything I gather, AVCHD is a pain (extra steps, extra time) to edit...
My hope is that the Samsung HMX20, which records mpeg (is it mpeg 4?) would be a better fit with Avid.
Any chance you could send me a file... or do you know another way for me to get one?
Or... any comments about my editing conundrum? (MacBook Pro, 4GB RAM, Leopard, Avid Media Composer).
Cheers, Malcolm
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Old July 31st, 2008, 12:38 AM   #10
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All the files are way too big for email, most email systems barf at 10MB or less and the files are well beyond that. You can try a left click on the links below. This assumes a fast connection. With dial-up, this will take forever just for one file.

IF you still can't get the files into your computer, try going to a friend's house and using their computer. It could be your WEB Browser has problems with the links...

http://stadium.weblogsinc.com/engadg...eball_clip.MP4

http://stadium.weblogsinc.com/engadg...l_Clip_001.MP4

http://stadium.weblogsinc.com/engadg...y_clip_001.MP4

http://stadium.weblogsinc.com/engadg...dwalk_Clip.MP4

http://stadium.weblogsinc.com/engadg...arden_Clip.MP4

http://stadium.weblogsinc.com/engadg...eball_clip.MP4

The Samsung HMX20 does record in MPEG-4 H.264 and with an Apple, one could use Final Cut Pro or Final Cut Express. It should work with iMovie. I have not worked with AVID, so I don't know the answer...


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Old July 31st, 2008, 07:30 AM   #11
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Thanks Bob,
Just downloaded the first clip. I'll see what Avid can do.
Do you know if it's generally conceded that mpeg-4 is more edl-friendly (maybe less time-consuming to work with) than AVCHD?
Cheers, Malcolm
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Old July 31st, 2008, 07:43 AM   #12
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Hi again,
Well, the 24-second clip imported into Avid in maybe 50 seconds... very easily done.
The video is sharp... I notice that movement (the players pitching or running) is a bit jerky... but not bad.
I haven't tried AVCHD, but I imagine I'd have to go through an extra step or two to get anything from AVCHD into Avid.
Does anyone on this forum (who uses a Mac) have experience with both AVCHD and mpeg-4?
Cheers, Malcolm
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Old July 31st, 2008, 08:24 AM   #13
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hi.
can anybody explain, what does it mean:
in hmx20c user manual samsung states, that it's sensor (most likely Sony’s IMX017CQE but why largest world cmos manufacturer... whatever), so it is [quote]"1/1.8” CMOS (Complementary Metal-Oxide Semiconductor) (Max: 6.4M pixels/Effective: 4M pixels)[end of qoute]
1. so 4M out of 6.4M converts 1/1.8 to smth like 1/2.5-2.2, right?
2. HD image is roughly 2M, thats ok, interpolation and so on, but it even bakes jpeg's, you know, at 3264*2448 (7.99M), 2880*2160 (6.2M), - and all that out of 4M effective pixels?

just curious
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Old July 31st, 2008, 02:40 PM   #14
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The image sensor is very flexible. In 1080 mode it can read 2 x 2 pixels, add them together, and output the result. It can also skip pixels and only use 2 or 4 MP for output. It can also capture still images using all the 6 MP.

For additional information, please see:

http://www.sony.net/Products/SC-HP/c.../imx017cqe.pdf

http://www.sony.net/Products/SC-HP/c...eaturing47.pdf


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Old July 31st, 2008, 07:45 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malcolm Hamilton View Post
Hi there,
I need a small, 2nd camera... frustrated because AVCHD is so difficult to work with (I'm on a Mac, edit with AVID).
Just wondering if the Samsung SC-HMX20C is AVCHD, or perhaps something else that's more Mac (and hopefully AVID) friendly.
Cheers,
Malcolm
AVCHD is Sony/Panasonic marketing name for MAIN or HIGH PROFILE H.264 multiplexed into a Transport Stream that has 4 extra bytes. The Samsung is not going to be any easier to edit. In fact, depending on the NLE it might not be possible to edit: Vegas still doesn't edit Panasonic AVCHD.

When writing my SR12 book I found iMovie 08 and Media Composer worked very well together.

But, AVCHD is not going to be EZ to edit until we all have 3GHz QUAD core computers -- and it will still be SLOW to edit until one gets a pair of QUAD core chips.

That's a lot of compute power for editing a "consumer" format. Of course, Japan doesn't make any money on NLEs. I predict they will introduce BD recorders with a harddisk that includes editing software.

In fact, the camcorders already have editing software built-in. They know the vast majority of consumers only need to delete clips, trim clips, and place them into the correct order. Then burn your playlist to BD.
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