AVID's claims for HDV editing at DVinfo.net

Adam Rench · December 9th, 2004, 11:59 PM

This sounds pretty darn good to me. I know that it's slated to come out in mid 2005, but I think it will be worth the wait.

________

"a future version of Avid Xpress Pro software will offer the ability to edit native HDV MPEG and Panasonic DVCPRO HD formats, as well as support Avid DNxHD™ – a revolutionary 10-bit HD encoding technology that enables HD postproduction with the same storage bandwidth and capacity requirements as SD files." (taken from Avid's site - click below for full release)

http://www.avid.com/company/releases/2004/040418_xprohd_prod.html

________

Pretty darn good if you ask me

Richard Alvarez · December 10th, 2004, 09:34 AM

I've seen it demonstrated, it is impressive. Slated out on Dec 30th, with "upgrades" for older versions later.

Adam Rench · December 10th, 2004, 10:00 AM

I didn't know they created their own HD coded. That's pretty cool. It sounds like they are fully committed to getting HD on their systems.

Gary McClurg · December 10th, 2004, 10:24 AM

The only thing is that I don't believe they have the Mac version ready yet.

Gary Bettan · December 10th, 2004, 11:25 AM

The new Avid Pro HD shown at DV Expo West supports their new DNxHD technology. You can read more about it by scrolling down to the bottom of our avid page http://www.videoguys.com/avid.html

This release will be PC only (Mac version will follow). As some may imagine, Apple has their own HD plans and they are not giving Avid the support they need to get the job done right. Instead of waiting for Apple to get them what they need, they will release on WinXP first.

Note: This version does not include the native HDV editing. This will come in the next release (NAB timeframe).

I've spent some time with Avid engineers getting demos and learning about their HD plans and THEY GET IT! Their HD strrategy ( which includes all HD including HDV and the panasonic DVCPRO HD) is right on the mark. We don't need or should we accept that HD editing has to be huge uncompressed files. Avids HD CODEC is superb, and i believe it will position Avid as the standard for HD editing.

Gary

Adam Rench · December 10th, 2004, 01:48 PM

Awesome! that's the answer i was hoping to hear. The place I will be ordering my software from has a really good deal on the Adobe video suite and i was very tempted to take it and then purchase the cineform software. It looked great, but then I started reading about Avid's plans, and it sounded great. I will have no problem waiting until mid 2005 for HDV editing capabilities.

thanks for that post Gary!

Grinner Hester · December 12th, 2004, 03:48 AM

I'm not convenced Avid gets it at all.
While their codec is neat, their interface is old and the 3D DVE is as nasty as it was in '95 when it came out.
Now that they've killed off Symphony, they have a HUGE gap in their product line. It jumps from the toy that is Adrenaline to Nitris.
Hmm, do I wanna pay 40k for an offline box with lotsa bugs(again, the DVE is just nasty and despite what Avid prints, it's 8 bit) or do I wanna sink 140 grand into a box that's worth 70k, paying half for the name on the box.
This is why Sony is selling so many Xpri systems and why Media100 is moving so many 844/X systems. It's why products like VelocityQ were developed.
Avid has seen more profit in gaining market share in the consumer world. To me, that aint getting it when they use to be on top of the broadcasts world's virtual mountain.
They let themselves get kicked off by FCP for cryin out loud.
Nope. I don't think they get it.

Gary Bettan · December 12th, 2004, 10:12 AM

Grinner -
Avid has gone into the consumer business (I think prosumer is a better description) to create a world full of Avid editors, some of who they hope will become professional Avid editors.

As for your comments about Nitris & Adreneline, I think you oversimplify this level of video editing and the broadcast marketplace in general. But most of all, I don't really see how these points pertain to the subject at hand. The original poster is looking for an affordable HD/HDV NLE for him to migrate to.

I really like the path and developement direction Avid is taking with Xpress Pro. The new features in the new Xpress Pro HD are quite exciting: Real-time multicam, two streams of video and a graphic layer in real-time with software only, Marqee titling tool.

Gary

Richard Alvarez · December 12th, 2004, 12:58 PM

I always wonder what a comment like the "Interface is old" means.

I suppose for some that means "Out of date, old-fashoioned, or even obsolete" That could also be interpreted as "refined", "Established", "Proven" ,
or "Time-tested", "indsutry standard, globally acknowledged"

Whereas a "Whole new look" or "Radical new interface" that "Thinks outside the box" could be interpreted as "Experimental," "Beta version", "Unproven", "re-inventing the wheel"

I guess it all depends on where your comfort level sits when spending money and your clients time.

Adam Rench · December 12th, 2004, 01:55 PM

To me, Avid sounds like it will be the best I can get for the money I'm spending, and this includes Avid editing experience too. Currently I work in computers, which will help me greatly in learning the Avid applications, but if I decide to change to a professional editing job, then I will have experience in the most widely used product there is.

I will be pretty happy with that. :o)

Darren Kelly · December 12th, 2004, 10:18 PM

Frankly the bang foro teh buck is the Canopus system in my opinion. For abouot $400.00 more than Xpress Pro, you gat a hardware solution that outputs in RT. I saw as many as 7 layers, and it only gets better as processors improve.

Avid's plan is to edit in MPEG2 TS. I talked with Avid at the show, and frankly the typical Avid Arrogance was all over the place. They think they are the best.

I've been in this industry since 1976, and a non linear editor since 1994 and guess what. while I've owned Avid for a few short months this summer, I have made millions without ever knowing how to use AVID.

Do yourself a favour. Use the tool that does the job the best on the day you're buying. Editing is not about using a specific type of software, it's about making a good story.

DBK

Adam Rench · December 12th, 2004, 11:00 PM

very true.. excellent points. I'll check out the Canopus system, but I'm barely scraping up enough to get the Avid editing sytsem. We'll see :)

Grinner Hester · December 17th, 2004, 12:39 AM

"I guess it all depends on where your comfort level sits when spending money and your clients time"

Exactly, Richard. This is why it's increasingly harder to sit clients in front of a symphony.
It's embarrasing much of the time. I got a lot of bang for the buck with this system and probaby will for another year or two to come. It's gonna have to do it as the second system though cuz I simply have to upgrade.
Avid will do well in the consumer and prosumer world.
They've shot themselves in the foot in the broadcast world and have given up on being the indusrty standard.
This blows for those of us that have so deeply invested in them.
Great for kids in basements though.

Adam Rench · December 17th, 2004, 12:08 PM

So which program(s) is going to emerge as the best then? I not sure if I'm correct in this, but I think Lord of the Rings was done in Avid no?

How about I, Robot? Now that movie was incredible. I know I wont have even 1/100th of the money needed to purchase an editing system like that, but it would be still neat to know which system was used for I, Robot.

Grinner Hester · December 17th, 2004, 01:35 PM

many.
Right now, the best NLE is Fire*. Link it to Inferno* and there aint much that can't be done. Still doesn't mean an entire movie will be made on it not touching other computers and apps. That's just not the way feature films are made. It's not as if an Avid product was involved in the special effects in the films you mentioned. It's just a cutter. A tool. There are better tools.
Quantel's new line rocks. Scope em out. iQ was the first to mix resolution on a timeline and has matured nicely.
Xpri is rock solid and has been HD cpable for quite a while now. Certainly worth looking at. 844/X has been nurtured to the delight of many. It'll just get better and offering the power of a Nitris in a 70k pricetag will move alot of em. Maybe one to my place next year.
Velocity HD is a killer beast for the price. You can compair it to a symphony in many ways. Not the pricetag.
FCP is always a winner too.
I'd get any one of these before getting an Avid product today.
Always lookoing for the most bang for the buck, I'm more than open to anything they offer that would change my mind.
I truely hope they release a great product at a great price in the next year or two.

December 9th, 2004, 11:59 PM	#1
Adam Rench Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 386	AVID's claims for HDV editing This sounds pretty darn good to me. I know that it's slated to come out in mid 2005, but I think it will be worth the wait. ________ "a future version of Avid Xpress Pro software will offer the ability to edit native HDV MPEG and Panasonic DVCPRO HD formats, as well as support Avid DNxHD™ – a revolutionary 10-bit HD encoding technology that enables HD postproduction with the same storage bandwidth and capacity requirements as SD files." (taken from Avid's site - click below for full release) http://www.avid.com/company/releases/2004/040418_xprohd_prod.html ________ Pretty darn good if you ask me

December 10th, 2004, 11:25 AM	#5
Gary Bettan Sponsor: Electronic Mailbox Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Glen Cove, NY Posts: 757	The new Avid Pro HD shown at DV Expo West supports their new DNxHD technology. You can read more about it by scrolling down to the bottom of our avid page http://www.videoguys.com/avid.html This release will be PC only (Mac version will follow). As some may imagine, Apple has their own HD plans and they are not giving Avid the support they need to get the job done right. Instead of waiting for Apple to get them what they need, they will release on WinXP first. Note: This version does not include the native HDV editing. This will come in the next release (NAB timeframe). I've spent some time with Avid engineers getting demos and learning about their HD plans and THEY GET IT! Their HD strrategy ( which includes all HD including HDV and the panasonic DVCPRO HD) is right on the mark. We don't need or should we accept that HD editing has to be huge uncompressed files. Avids HD CODEC is superb, and i believe it will position Avid as the standard for HD editing. Gary __________________ Check out http://www.videoguys.com 800 323-2325 We are the video editing and live video production experts! DV InfoNet members save 5%! Use Coupon Code DVINFO5OFF

December 12th, 2004, 10:12 AM	#8
Gary Bettan Sponsor: Electronic Mailbox Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Glen Cove, NY Posts: 757	Grinner - Avid has gone into the consumer business (I think prosumer is a better description) to create a world full of Avid editors, some of who they hope will become professional Avid editors. As for your comments about Nitris & Adreneline, I think you oversimplify this level of video editing and the broadcast marketplace in general. But most of all, I don't really see how these points pertain to the subject at hand. The original poster is looking for an affordable HD/HDV NLE for him to migrate to. I really like the path and developement direction Avid is taking with Xpress Pro. The new features in the new Xpress Pro HD are quite exciting: Real-time multicam, two streams of video and a graphic layer in real-time with software only, Marqee titling tool. Gary __________________ Check out http://www.videoguys.com 800 323-2325 We are the video editing and live video production experts! DV InfoNet members save 5%! Use Coupon Code DVINFO5OFF

December 12th, 2004, 10:18 PM	#11
Darren Kelly Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver Posts: 351	Frankly the bang foro teh buck is the Canopus system in my opinion. For abouot $400.00 more than Xpress Pro, you gat a hardware solution that outputs in RT. I saw as many as 7 layers, and it only gets better as processors improve. Avid's plan is to edit in MPEG2 TS. I talked with Avid at the show, and frankly the typical Avid Arrogance was all over the place. They think they are the best. I've been in this industry since 1976, and a non linear editor since 1994 and guess what. while I've owned Avid for a few short months this summer, I have made millions without ever knowing how to use AVID. Do yourself a favour. Use the tool that does the job the best on the day you're buying. Editing is not about using a specific type of software, it's about making a good story. DBK __________________ Darren Kelly

December 10th, 2004, 09:34 AM	#2
Richard Alvarez Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: San Mateo, CA Posts: 3,840	I've seen it demonstrated, it is impressive. Slated out on Dec 30th, with "upgrades" for older versions later.

December 10th, 2004, 10:00 AM	#3
Adam Rench Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 386	I didn't know they created their own HD coded. That's pretty cool. It sounds like they are fully committed to getting HD on their systems.

December 10th, 2004, 10:24 AM	#4
Gary McClurg Major Player Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Springfield, MO, USA Posts: 389	The only thing is that I don't believe they have the Mac version ready yet.

December 10th, 2004, 01:48 PM	#6
Adam Rench Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 386	Awesome! that's the answer i was hoping to hear. The place I will be ordering my software from has a really good deal on the Adobe video suite and i was very tempted to take it and then purchase the cineform software. It looked great, but then I started reading about Avid's plans, and it sounded great. I will have no problem waiting until mid 2005 for HDV editing capabilities. thanks for that post Gary!

December 12th, 2004, 03:48 AM	#7
Grinner Hester Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: services world-wide Posts: 118	I'm not convenced Avid gets it at all. While their codec is neat, their interface is old and the 3D DVE is as nasty as it was in '95 when it came out. Now that they've killed off Symphony, they have a HUGE gap in their product line. It jumps from the toy that is Adrenaline to Nitris. Hmm, do I wanna pay 40k for an offline box with lotsa bugs(again, the DVE is just nasty and despite what Avid prints, it's 8 bit) or do I wanna sink 140 grand into a box that's worth 70k, paying half for the name on the box. This is why Sony is selling so many Xpri systems and why Media100 is moving so many 844/X systems. It's why products like VelocityQ were developed. Avid has seen more profit in gaining market share in the consumer world. To me, that aint getting it when they use to be on top of the broadcasts world's virtual mountain. They let themselves get kicked off by FCP for cryin out loud. Nope. I don't think they get it.

December 12th, 2004, 12:58 PM	#9
Richard Alvarez Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: San Mateo, CA Posts: 3,840	I always wonder what a comment like the "Interface is old" means. I suppose for some that means "Out of date, old-fashoioned, or even obsolete" That could also be interpreted as "refined", "Established", "Proven" , or "Time-tested", "indsutry standard, globally acknowledged" Whereas a "Whole new look" or "Radical new interface" that "Thinks outside the box" could be interpreted as "Experimental," "Beta version", "Unproven", "re-inventing the wheel" I guess it all depends on where your comfort level sits when spending money and your clients time.

December 12th, 2004, 01:55 PM	#10
Adam Rench Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 386	To me, Avid sounds like it will be the best I can get for the money I'm spending, and this includes Avid editing experience too. Currently I work in computers, which will help me greatly in learning the Avid applications, but if I decide to change to a professional editing job, then I will have experience in the most widely used product there is. I will be pretty happy with that. :o)

December 12th, 2004, 11:00 PM	#12
Adam Rench Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 386	very true.. excellent points. I'll check out the Canopus system, but I'm barely scraping up enough to get the Avid editing sytsem. We'll see :)

December 17th, 2004, 12:39 AM	#13
Grinner Hester Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: services world-wide Posts: 118	"I guess it all depends on where your comfort level sits when spending money and your clients time" Exactly, Richard. This is why it's increasingly harder to sit clients in front of a symphony. It's embarrasing much of the time. I got a lot of bang for the buck with this system and probaby will for another year or two to come. It's gonna have to do it as the second system though cuz I simply have to upgrade. Avid will do well in the consumer and prosumer world. They've shot themselves in the foot in the broadcast world and have given up on being the indusrty standard. This blows for those of us that have so deeply invested in them. Great for kids in basements though.

December 17th, 2004, 12:08 PM	#14
Adam Rench Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas, USA Posts: 386	So which program(s) is going to emerge as the best then? I not sure if I'm correct in this, but I think Lord of the Rings was done in Avid no? How about I, Robot? Now that movie was incredible. I know I wont have even 1/100th of the money needed to purchase an editing system like that, but it would be still neat to know which system was used for I, Robot.

December 17th, 2004, 01:35 PM	#15
Grinner Hester Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: services world-wide Posts: 118	many. Right now, the best NLE is Fire. Link it to Inferno and there aint much that can't be done. Still doesn't mean an entire movie will be made on it not touching other computers and apps. That's just not the way feature films are made. It's not as if an Avid product was involved in the special effects in the films you mentioned. It's just a cutter. A tool. There are better tools. Quantel's new line rocks. Scope em out. iQ was the first to mix resolution on a timeline and has matured nicely. Xpri is rock solid and has been HD cpable for quite a while now. Certainly worth looking at. 844/X has been nurtured to the delight of many. It'll just get better and offering the power of a Nitris in a 70k pricetag will move alot of em. Maybe one to my place next year. Velocity HD is a killer beast for the price. You can compair it to a symphony in many ways. Not the pricetag. FCP is always a winner too. I'd get any one of these before getting an Avid product today. Always lookoing for the most bang for the buck, I'm more than open to anything they offer that would change my mind. I truely hope they release a great product at a great price in the next year or two.