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Old September 22nd, 2011, 07:26 PM   #151
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

^ This, x 1,000.

If waiting on a particular camera is stopping someone from making their film, then that film will never be made.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 12:08 AM   #152
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale View Post
Waiting for the next best thing in cameras as an answer is delusional, the tools are already to hand.
But waiting until November if you are in the market for a camera isn't delusional at all. It's nice to come early to game-changing technology. I bought the 5D2 within a month or so of its release, and I've more than gotten my money out of it. People looking to buy a 5D2 during the last few month have faced a tougher choice.

I agree that there is always something around the corner, so one can pathologically wait forever. But with the Canon and RED announcements coming in November, waiting makes a lot of sense right now - unless you've got an immediate paying gig. And in that case, one can always rent.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 01:41 AM   #153
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Absolutely if you're going to be buying new kit in the near future it would be worthwhile holding off buying a new camera.. Although, you'd have to suspect that the cameras that may be about to announced will meet the specs and the price you need.

The game changing aspect would really depend on the market you're working in, so it doesn't work if there's only a small demand there, even though it's successful elsewhere. However, there is an element of sucking and seeing about that.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 02:22 AM   #154
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale View Post
Waiting for the next best thing in cameras as an answer is delusional, the tools are already to hand.
If that is aimed at me then insult me all you want because I'm waiting for the next best thing.

My predicamernt is that I had to sell my EX1 to cover my girlfriends car crash and wanted to buy a replacement at a later date. When I was in a position to buy things had changed and affordable cameras with large sensors had arrived BUT crippled Yes I could have gone for another EX1 but decided a large chip camera was the answer For a while I looked at the 5D and GH2 and although lovely pictures the workflow and colour correction were an obstacle.

I am truly frustrated by the Sony FS100 with its awful feature set to the point I wouldn't give Sony the satisfaction of buying it. (I'm just a potential customer why should I matter)

As for the AF100 I think its not bad and better than the FS100 because it has a decent feature set. However its limited in resolution and in how it deals with highlights and although I am impressed on how it can work when the studio is properly lit and within its confines I need a camera that can handle highlights and higher resolution However if it had 10 bit out I may have been swayed..

NOW I did consider the Panasonic 250 which looks to be a fantastic camera but with the Nov 3rd announcement I think its right to wait for this. I am though frustrated at the moment being stuck with no camera for a number of months in order to wait for the new technology and the big boys make profits on half finished jobbies for those who cant wait or have enough money to throw away.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 02:47 AM   #155
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

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Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale View Post
To be honest, people haven't been prevented from making films. It's never been easier to make films, the costs are lower than they have ever been. It's nothing to do with the cameras, you can make a successful film in every respect with a camera that came out several years ago. The hard part lies within the creative process itself and gathering the people together who will enable a good film to be made.

Waiting for the next best thing in cameras as an answer is delusional, the tools are already to hand.
Such a salient post. For the likes of me anyway!
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 02:52 AM   #156
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

It's not an insult, it's comment on an approach that some people have where the gear itself takes over rather than the films they're trying to make. Some industry technicians do that as well, but if you're the actual film maker it's only a part of what you're trying to achieve.

The EX series will continue shooting for a number of years and the AF 100 & FS 100 offer advantages over the DSLRs. I suspect the Scarlet will be more expensive than those two cameras anyway.

Your best bet might be if this possible large sensor Canon comes out at the same price as the XF 300, but there's a good chance it will be 8 bit.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 03:13 AM   #157
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Brian, thanks for clearing that up it sounded at first insulting but I can see your point now.

Whatever happens I think Nov 3rd will be D day in the camera world.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 03:34 AM   #158
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

I'm not sure about that, but there could be some new tools.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 06:57 AM   #159
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Don't forget that most of the time, announcement date = not shipping date. And new products are almost always scarce, they come with bugs that will be fixed etcetera... so don't think you get what you want on November 3rd... expect to get it early 2012. And you still pay an early adopter price.

I think in this age, you can better spend your money on a good kit and hire a camera when needed. This way, you ensure that you can always use the latest and greatest. It also reduces the risk of investment. If you earn back a new camera < 12 months, it is a wise investment.

Look at the economy right now... we're going to crash very hard (I live in Europe, but the US is bankrupt as well) so I would think twice before investing a lot of money in a camera right now.
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 07:47 AM   #160
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Years and years ago, a similar event played out with the release of the Canon XL-1 ... set to join the fray alongside the Sony VX-1000 and the Panasonic with the name I forget (though the absence of a Firewire connection I clearly remember) -- Canon enthusiasts across the webiverse waxed eloquently on the inability of Canon to do any wrong, of the superiority both technical and philosophical about all things Canon. Chris Hurd was there in those early days, and though a Canon enthusiast he was no Pollyanna -- but some commentors went beyond mere enthusiasm! I forget his nomme de guerre now, and never knew his real one, but one web poster with Bay in his handle (I knew not whether he was a SF Bay, or a Miami Bay, or somewhere else entirely -- he enjoyed using a Hawaiian slang but that's all I know) could imagine nothing less than perfection of a Biblical sort. His rants were legendary.

Truth was rather less than expectation -- the XL-1 was somewhere between fine and OK; the ground had been broken first by Panasonic, then made truly productive by Sony -- for the next decade minor improvements were met with modest gains by all, but in truth nothing came of the great 'promise' of Canon, and any real analysis of the DV era has to lay much acclaim on the Sony camera.

I have no camera-religion -- my loyalty on the issue of who gets my cash is paper thin. Neither do I cling to long-remembered mis-steps -- the afore-mentioned lack of Firewire connectivity, or the inability of the XL-1 to deliver 8-bit precision in the final recording -- but it is worth remembering the past, else we are bound to repeat it!

Cheers,
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 07:47 AM   #161
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

I think RED's mantra will be to have the camera ready to go when they announce it. As for Canon I'm guessing xmas time!
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 11:27 AM   #162
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

When Canon announced the 5D2 in November of 2008, it was shipping almost immediately. Finding one was another story. I got mine around mid-December at a local Fry's store after putting my name on lists at the local camera stores and checking regularly at the nearby Best Buy. Everyone was charging list, so it was a matter of first-one-with-the-camera-wins. I was able to buy a spare battery a couple weeks before I got the camera.

RED's reputation is to announce lots and ship little. It looks like that's changing, with the company taking orders for Scarlet on the 4th. I believe that they plan to ship immediately, but if you're not first in line, you might end up on the backorder list.

If you can wait until November, you can probably wait the short time it will take to get one of these products into your hands. Sure, it will be an exciting, anxious time, like a kid checking the mailbox everyday for delivery of a decoder ring. But not long after it arrives, the importance of the dollars and the time spent will fade in significance...
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 12:36 PM   #163
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Fairhurst View Post
with the company taking orders for Scarlet on the 4th. I believe that they plan to ship immediately, but if you're not first in line, you might end up on the backorder list.
November 3rd I'll be in Caribbean, wish me good luck to find fast internet connection there :)
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Old September 23rd, 2011, 12:50 PM   #164
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Fairhurst View Post
RED's reputation is to announce lots and ship little. It looks like that's changing, with the company taking orders for Scarlet on the 4th. I believe that they plan to ship immediately, but if you're not first in line, you might end up on the backorder list.
If somebody can link me to an official price announcement that would be fantastic (still cant click on scarlet on their site)...

I am holding off jumping off the DSLR ship until the announcement, and seeing what the availability/wait time is. I dont want to sell my stuff, and then be left high and dry around christmas while I wait for scarlet/whatever canon announces (and depends what I buy) to arrive. I need to make the move to higher end stuff shortly here and Im antsy as anything to see what the next round of offerings are... Whatever one offers framerates higher than 60p... I will buy. If canon doesn't offer 120p and EF mount, Im definitely going RED.
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Old September 24th, 2011, 11:41 AM   #165
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Re: Something new from Canon on Nov. 3rd...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale View Post
Waiting for the next best thing in cameras as an answer is delusional, the tools are already to hand.
People are different -- and I probably belong in your "delusional" category: A couple of years ago, just in time for me to put down some money on a ground glass for my XL2, I impulsively sold the camera altogether and bought a new hot 5D2 -- full frame shallow DOF film look has always been my desire. However, as soon as I had my work played in a theater, I started ogling the Scarlet. So a few days ago, when I saw Canon's Nov. 3rd announcement, I sold the 5D2. Now I'm anxiously waiting for an early x-mas present -- hopefully a joint Canon-RED venture ;^)

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