C100 B Cam: XF100 or XA20 at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon Cinema EOS Camera Systems

Canon Cinema EOS Camera Systems
For all Canon Cinema EOS models: C500 / C300 Mk. II / C300 / C100 Mk II / C100 and EF / PL lenses.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old November 14th, 2014, 01:43 AM   #1
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Sutton, Australia
Posts: 291
C100 B Cam: XF100 or XA20

I've been using an XF100 (50Mbps MPEG-2 4:2:2 codec) as a B Cam for the C100 - the footage can be matched pretty well, just wondering how XA20 footage (MPEG-4 AVCHD 4:2:0 at 24Mbps, same codec as the C100) would match. Anyone with experience?
Rainer Listing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 23rd, 2014, 06:55 PM   #2
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Charlottesville
Posts: 245
Re: C100 B Cam: XF100 or XA20

I own the Canon G20 (which is essentially the XA20 without the XLR inputs) and I've shot weddings where my C100 is my A Camera, my 70D is the B camera, and the G20 is the safety camera. Since the G20 is generally a very wide shot of the entire ceremony I think it works well with the other two cameras. However, if you were to try to shoot an interview where the C100 is a medium shot and the G20 is close up, it would be as clear as day that the cameras don't match.

The reason is that the C100 retails FAR more detail than either the G20 or the 70D, so much that the C100 is very hard to match with less expensive cameras because the other cameras look very soft.

So if you just need a very wide shot of a ceremony (or another event) then the G20 can work well with the C100. Or if you are just getting b roll with one camera and using the other for a roll then it could work. But if you're cutting back and forth between somewhat similar shots of subject you will likely not get good results IMHO.

I will also say that the 70D is very difficult to match the C100 as well because it is retains much less detail and is much worse in low light than the C100.

I'm actually looking to replace the 70D for next year's wedding season and I don't think any of Canon's DSLRs besides the 1DC will be able to match the detail level of the C100. I've seen some people get away with a 6D or a 5D Mk III, but I've also seen people try to do that and end up with very different looking shots.
Michael Silverman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2014, 10:50 AM   #3
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Maidstone, Kent, UK
Posts: 190
Re: C100 B Cam: XF100 or XA20

With apologies for being nit-picky, the G30 is the XA20 without the XLR inputs. The G20 (/G25) were a slightly older generation cam more akin to the XA10 (minus XLR)

Regards
David
David Johns is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2014, 11:20 AM   #4
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,551
Re: C100 B Cam: XF100 or XA20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Silverman View Post
so much that the C100 is very hard to match with less expensive cameras because the other cameras look very soft.
If you plan on staying with Canon then yes but every new 4k camera that is out now, even the ones under 1K will match and even outperform the c100 when it comes to detail, getting the same dynamic range and low light sensitivity is another thing, it depends on what the b-camera has to do, if it needs to have xlr connection and good videocamera functionality then the sony x70 might be a good option.
Noa Put is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2014, 11:46 AM   #5
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Charlottesville
Posts: 245
Re: C100 B Cam: XF100 or XA20

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Johns View Post
With apologies for being nit-picky, the G30 is the XA20 without the XLR inputs. The G20 (/G25) were a slightly older generation cam more akin to the XA10 (minus XLR)

Regards
David
Yes my mistake that's correct. The G30 and XA20 have a better processor and are better in low light (among some other improvements). However, from the test footage that I've seen comparing the G20 and G30 I think in most situations they resolve about the same amount of detail. I think that even if the G30 and XA20 give you a little more detail than the G20, there's no way it would be close to the detail you get with the C100 if both shots are of the same subject. I think that it's really the sharpness and detail that provides the biggest difference because the C100 has a very different look than Canon DSLRs and camcorders. I've actually seen footage from the Panasonic GH4 and Sony A7S intercut better with the C100 because they both are very sharp cameras that collect tons of detail.

I've found that it's not something that can be fixed using a sharpening filter because there's no way to add in detail that isn't captured in the first place. You could add a noise removal filter like Neat Video or Denoiser II to the C100 footage to soften it, but then you're losing much of what you get from the C100.

I think it would be easier to match one of the DSLRs to the XA20 because they both have a softness to them that tends to look very similar in regards to skin tones.
Michael Silverman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 12th, 2016, 03:38 PM   #6
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Arizona
Posts: 44
Re: C100 B Cam: XF100 or XA20

If you HAVE to match a G30 with a C100 MkII (using Wide DR), what setting on the G30 would work best? Which would give you the flattest image to try to match to the C100?

Thanks!
Deborah Gallegos is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

Omega Broadcast
(512) 251-7778
Austin, TX

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

EVS
(800) 238-8480
Glendale, CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon Cinema EOS Camera Systems

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:34 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2015 The Digital Video Information Network