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Canon EOS Crop Sensor for HD
APS-C sensor cameras including the 80D, 70D, 7D Mk. II, 7D, EOS M and Rebel models for HD video recording.


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Old October 6th, 2010, 05:41 AM   #1
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60D - likes & dislikes

Having had 60D for a week now here's my experience. Feel free to ask questions.

- Having ran 60D continuous for 3 hours straight - NO OVERHEATING YET.. room temperature.. pretty pleased about that, especially having sold my 7D due to the overheating issues for wedding / event video that I do.

- Good size & Weight

- HDMI output switches to SD on record, and changes aspect ratio. When plugged onto my Lilliput LCD monitor, it gives a 1-2 second pause as it switches resolution - WHICH IS REALLY REALLY ANNOYING! would appreciate any tips on this. Composite out works ok, but its really at a much lower quality of image compared to HDMI on SD. I can't really tell critical focus at all with composite out because its so fuzzy.

- Video mode has no white balance colour shift option - for my 5D mark 2 this is accessible straight from the menu. I tend to shift +3 green on white balance for a more of a filmic look it.

- Dont cheap out on SD cards. Having considered Adata brand, transcend brand etc.. decided to fork out double or triple the price for a class 10 32gb sd card from Sandisk. Having the assurance of sandisk because footage is too important to lose or corrupt for non-repeatable events! having said that, my first class 10 sd card was transcend which I have to say I have not had any trouble with at all with under buffering. So thats now my backup card, with the 32gb sd card being the main.

- Steadicam on a merlin. After comparing the canon 14mm f2.8 L, Tokina 11-16 f2.8 and Canon EFS 10-22 f3.5-f4.5 instore heres my take. Basically comparing all 3 lenses at 14/15mm.

- This relates to a previous post I had on which Charles Papert kindly answered my questions.
http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-eo...nce-query.html

- Canon 14mm f2.8 L - no doubt the best lens for steadicam if budget is not an issue. Tremendously sharp, low distortion, True L class lens. But weighing the price / Return on Investment / value, this seems to be ultra luxury item, which leaves two real contenders which is the below two lenses
- Tokina 11-16mm f2.8 - having owned this from my 7D days, awesome sharpness, low light performance, build quality. But what really ticked me off was the distortion at 14/15mm its really stretched badly at the sides. At the pretty much the same price on the 2nd hand market as the 10-22mm it was a close call, but I chose the 10-22mm EFS from Canon for the following reasons
- Canon 10-22mm f3.5-f4.5. - I pretty much bought this lens primarily for steadicam. at 14mm this has the same hyperfocal distance as Canon 14mm f2.8 L. Since on steadicam, everything need to be stopped down anyway to about f11 at 14mm for a 1m hyperfocal for a crop sensor camera, the extra half stop of light of Tokina wasn't that much of an advantage. After testing and comparing the distortion at 14/15mm between this and Tokina, i have to say Canon is the marginal winner.
- Compared to 5D2+16-35mm combo: My 60D + 10-22mm is alot lighter than the 5D2 combo, having shorter hyperfocal distance than the 5D2 at 24mm, this allows for slight better low light performance on a steadicam.
- Light weight!!! my 60D + 10-22mm combo is only 1.16kg. Compared to 1.4-1.5kg of the 5D2 + 16-35mm combo. This means I lose one mid weight on the nose, and on mid weight on the spar of the merlin. That is alot of counter weight reduced, which improves long merlin operation sessions.

All in all, I'm absolutely stoked with the 60D, highly recommended.

Quick [likes] which I am sure many of you guys already would have read up,


- Manual audio
- 720/50/60p
- 1080/24/25p
- the flipout screen @ higher resolution than 5D
- two scroll wheels, which gives it more of a 5D feel than the 550D which its buttons which I dislike.
- Crop factor! - one of the main reasons I got this as a B roll camera, reach further without buying expensive lenses.
- Dial in K white balance - one of the things I did not like about 550D was this.
- iso in 1/3 stop increments, just like the 5D / 7D. which 550D does not have i think (could be wrong)
- PRICE!! - Very well priced... considering other attributes above, it was a no brainer.

Dislikes
- lack of HD hdmi output during record
- SD cards - this is debateable, but having own 96 gigs of CF cards already, having to fork out extra for new memory media isn't something I prefer to do. - lack of high speed SD card readers, like FW800 CF card readers that lexar / sandisk already offers.
- White balance color shift adjustment in video mode.
- Lack of dedicated white balance button like on 7D / 5D.
- Video mode option far away from manual / av / tv option on the scroll wheel.
- Video mode has no custom registered setting like on 5D you have 3 available, so I can't do 720p and 1080p quick setting.

Comments / questions welcome!

Last edited by Josh Fung; October 6th, 2010 at 02:56 PM.
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Old October 6th, 2010, 08:44 AM   #2
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Josh, this is good reading. However, I find someone switching to from a 7D to the 60D surprising. Your primary stated reason is overheating of the 7D. My reading indicates the 7D is not terrible in that regard. What information did you read that indicated no overheating issues with the 60D? I see a few very recent posts to that effect, but I would think it is too early to make a call until more reports are issued.
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Old October 6th, 2010, 09:57 AM   #3
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Excellent report, Josh -- many thanks!

Which frame rate & frame size were you shooting at for your three-minute overheating test?

I'm considering a 60D to replace my Rebel T2i.

Hope this helps,
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Old October 6th, 2010, 11:22 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Fung View Post
- Crop factor! - one of the main reasons I got this as a B roll camera, reach further without buying expensive lenses.
???? The reach is precisely the same. The crop factor doesn't affect magnification merely FOV.
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Old October 6th, 2010, 11:58 AM   #5
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Nevertheless, the cropped Field of View is like having a 1.6x extender
built right into the camera, but without the loss of light inherent to tele-
converters. That was his point, and it's one of the advantages of the
APS-C sized sensor.
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Old October 6th, 2010, 12:07 PM   #6
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I think it would be nice if you also tested this on worst case condition. for example, outdoors on 80-90 degree weather.
My 7d overheated last week (2 of them) when exposing them outdoors on a wedding. It started blinking red just right when the bride is walking -- (the most annoying part!!!)
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Old October 6th, 2010, 01:02 PM   #7
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Great post. I have both the T2i and 60D.

60D LIKES over the T2i
LCD Screen
Kelvin Temp WB
1/3 ISO stops
Better feel in my hands
Detailed and Accurate Battery Meter
Over heating issues may be better (at least that is what I have found so far)

60D DISLIKES over the T2i
Inaccurate exposure meter with manual focus lenses ( But still trying to figure this one out)
Position of on/off switch
Position of delete button

The last two dislikes are probably because I shot with the T2i first, but if I never shot with the T2i, I would not have a preference.
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Last edited by Mark Von Lanken; October 6th, 2010 at 01:37 PM. Reason: added a feature
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Old October 6th, 2010, 02:06 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galen Rath View Post
Josh, this is good reading. However, I find someone switching to from a 7D to the 60D surprising. Your primary stated reason is overheating of the 7D. My reading indicates the 7D is not terrible in that regard. What information did you read that indicated no overheating issues with the 60D? I see a few very recent posts to that effect, but I would think it is too early to make a call until more reports are issued.
HI Galen,

7D was my first DSLR i got in christmas 2009. I loved that camera. But as a primary camera for weddings, it could not last the ceremony. After few hours of preparation shoots. I think 7D overheating is well known issue, and may differ between different production batches I dont know. But 2 weddings were enough for me to consider the 5D instead of 7D amongst various other reasons, so I sold off the 7D after 2 months and got the 5D instead. Now having owned full frame for 6-7 months now, I love the camera. It certainly has not given me any overheating troubles in that regard.

I figure 60D was a great B Roll camera and as a steadicam camera, since canon gave it 25p manual audio amongst other attributes. :)


Chris, ran the 3 hour overheat test in 1080 25p.

The Crop Factor I mentioned was in comparison to my 5D, not 7D.

=)
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Old October 6th, 2010, 02:44 PM   #9
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How do you weigh the 60d vs the 7d. For me personally I have been having a really hard time picking between the two cameras because they both have features i really want. The articulating screen on the 60d and manual audio are incredibly appealing to me. However the dual digic 4 processors and full 1080 hdmi output on the 7d makes me think that is the better choice if i want to be doing any cinematic critical focus shots. I'd love to hear your opinion on this.
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Old October 6th, 2010, 03:18 PM   #10
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Hi Peter,

For me my two main complaints for the 7D were overheating and lack of manual audio.
Build quality is as good as the 5D, very solid.
I think HD out during recording is very appealing, CF cards and same battery as 5D is also a winner. However reliability, although I havn't lost any footage due to overheating via CF card it is certainly worrying. I had to in one occasion to turn off the 7D for 15minutes due to overheating, mid ceremony in a wedding, turning it back on in time for the vows only for it to overheat again 5mins on. I think that was the final straw for me for the 7D. On a run and gun shoot such as weddings I have enough things to worry about, like seperate audio, creativity, focus, composition. Not having to worry about whether any shots will be lost due to overheating is a big plus. Dual Digic on the 7D doesn't mean much for me, as far as I'm concerned basically increases frame per second for high speed photos to 9 shots per second, dual digic contributes to the overheating by the way as well. Unless Canon improves heat dissipation in these DSLR bodies, dual digic is something to avoid in my opinion.

60D build quality is very good, especially when I'm after lightweight, although this is plastic compared to magnesium bodies of 7D / 5D, its very solid.
For the price 60D is an absolute steal. The only thing 7D has over this for video is probably is CF cards + HD out. Although I doubt it is full HD output via hdmi during recording, more like 720p. Many cinematographers are using 5D which dont have HD out during HDMI and that works ok. If you're after critical focus, it think an LCD with peaking / false color - marshall LCD which costs as much as 60D by the way, would benefit you more than purely HD out over HDMI during recording.
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