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Canon EOS Crop Sensor for HD
APS-C sensor cameras including the 80D, 70D, 7D Mk. II, 7D, EOS M and Rebel models for HD video recording.


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Old October 17th, 2010, 11:49 AM   #1
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New to DSLR

I'm thinking of switching to HD-SLR, coming from HDV would like your views on the new 60D for video.
I come from the Sony Z5, someone has made this change?

Thanks...
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Old October 17th, 2010, 11:59 AM   #2
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Using a HDSLR myself i never sold my hdv cam though and getting good good footage with these dslrs takes far more effort and a friend who bought a 60D just hated it[the moire/aliasing] after selling his pana 700
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Old October 17th, 2010, 04:23 PM   #3
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When I got my T2i, I put my Canon XHA1 for sale. Had a few interested inquiries but nobody bought it, and I'm glad I haven't sold it.

I'm sure you've read some articles on the pros and cons on shooting with DSLR...if you haven't, google them right now. If you shoot short films or music videos, DSLR's are great, but if you're shooting longer events, you'll wish you had a camcorder (that's my opinion, anyways).

Don't forget the costs of lenses, audio equipment and accessories...which will easily cost double or triple than the 60D did.
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Old October 17th, 2010, 10:42 PM   #4
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I have Sony EX1 and am looking at the 60D. It's not a replacement for the EX1 but another tool.

Long record and run and gun is good for EX1.
60D is for shoots with known short takes which may be local cable spots and more theatrical type shoots (that can certainly include corporate work).

60D Upsides:
Control over shallow DOF
Interchangeable lenses
low cost compared to other shallow DOF devices
great low light performance
small size may mean inexpensive stabilizer use
small form factor good when discrete is important
(good still camera . . . let's not forget that)



60D Downsides:
12 minutes records
Alias and Moire
need for second sound recording device
no time code
possible overheating (although less common than it would appear)
need to buy ancillary gear for many uses such as follow focus, rods, shoulder device, external video monitor
transcode the H.264 codec to something else for editing
Rolling shutter issues may be worse than CMOS video cameras
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Old October 21st, 2010, 11:47 AM   #5
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I'm kind of shocked this thread stalled. I'd have thought this would be a hot topic.

I'll throw a couple of curves and see if anyone takes a swing.
Why get a 60D instead of a Letus or Redrock 35MM adaptor?
Why get 60D instead of Sony VG10 or Panasonic AF100?

My own answer is that for many situations 60D would be faster and easer to setup for shallow DOF work than a 35MM adaptor. The new large chip video cameras are first generation in a field which I think will have very rapid changes. The 60D body is inexpensive and the lenses will likely transfer to whatever happens as the Video Bodies mature. The less you spend on the body, the more you can spend on lenses. The 60D will get you those pretty pictures for less money and greater flexibility (depending on what you consider flexibility of course).
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Old October 22nd, 2010, 12:12 AM   #6
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If I may join in here, I also have a Z5 and I recently bought the 550D to supplement the Z5.
But let me tell you:

For video work get a camcorder
For still pictures get a DSLR

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Old October 22nd, 2010, 01:16 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stelios Christofides View Post
For video work get a camcorder
For still pictures get a DSLR
Not very useful without explaining why. DSLR serves a specific purpose and many people are doing Broadcast work with them given the limitations. It's not a replacement for a video camera. It's a tool with a specific purpose that is very difficult to do with a video camera.

So I'll respond. If you want affordable and flexible control over lenses and shallow depth of field get a DSLR for video 'cause you aren't doing that easily with camcorder without having a much big rig and budget.
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Old October 22nd, 2010, 03:48 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Why get a 60D instead of a Letus or Redrock 35MM adaptor?
Because a 60D gives you more dynamic range, much better lowlight performance with no light loss, no vignetting and no softening of the image due to the ground glass. It's also quicker to set up and it means you can have two cameras (your camcorder + DSLR) for the same price as one camera plus an adaptor. Plus you don't have to get rails like you do with an adaptor, and it gives you much more mobility than a adaptor rig will.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Why get 60D instead of Sony VG10 or Panasonic AF100?
Because a 60D much cheaper than an AF100. And compared to the VG10 the 60D is cheaper and has better lens selection, multiple frame rates, and manual audio levels - three very important things for the serious videographers.

Of course the 60D's weaknesses compared to the other two are the aliasing, softness & 4gb record limit.
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Old October 22nd, 2010, 05:05 PM   #9
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The DSLRs have pointed out that they are very capable of producing cinema-like quality IF care is taken on crafting the shots (in a controlled atmosphere like a movie set) and realizing the limitations of the cameras and working around them.
The moire/aliasing can be fixed, but do you think that these companies that also make professional camcorders will fix the problem to our satisfaction? Probably not, as then they risk exposing themselves to lost sales in the lower-end prosumer line.

I'm kind of looking forward to see what Nikon will produce with the D7000, as they don't have the problem of a camcorder lineup to lose sales from.

Having said all that, I'm planning on buying a 60D once I save enough! :)
(My G10 just doesn't cut it very well for video... :P)
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Old October 22nd, 2010, 06:47 PM   #10
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Coming from HDV I always feel that the holy grail for video besides the high resolution, is to make video look like movie--the dynamic range of color, DOF controll, low light and absent of video noise. I think that DSLR is just far better than HDV in all of those areas.
Though I still have my HDV these days I almost never use it. I keep the HDV for the sake of playing the DV tapes only.
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 01:32 AM   #11
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I did sell our Canon XH-A1 HDV cameras after we bought our Canon 5DIIs but now being pretty experienced with working around the limitations of DSLRs I am looking at buying a couple of proper camcorders for use in addition to the DSLRs. I will definitely get a Canon XF305 for all that work for which a proper camcorder is superior. I will be looking carefully at whether a Panasonic AF100 could replace the DSLRs although as we like the 5DIIs for stills & now have a lot of nice Canon EF glass it's more likely that we would use it in addition.

I was so glad that I saw footage shot with the Canon 5DII at just the time when I was seriously considering purchasing a Letus 35mm adapter which saved me a ton of hassle by not going down that route.
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 12:30 PM   #12
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So now we're getting a picture why a DSLR is a good alternative to a 35MM adaptor. We're also seeing the importance of continuing to have a typical camcorder in addition to a DSLR.

So why get a DSLR vs a Panasonic AF100, Sony VG10, Sony's future large chip "pro" camera?

John Wiley pointed out the frame and lens advantages. VG10 is 30p in 60i. 60D is native progressive and also has 24p for those not aware.

I've had a few moments to look at the AF100 up close at a recent trade show. It certainly is a nice camera at a reasonable price. My concerns are that it's 4/3 chip rather than APS-C. That's also a 2x crop rather than 1.6 (Canon 5D MkII is 1.0). That makes it just a bit harder to be wider and shallow.

I have mixed feelings about the AVCHD 24Mbps. It's OK but I understand the 60D may be closer to 40Mbps although there are other factors besides data rate. Another concern is that it's a first generation large chip camera and I think there may be changes coming very quickly. The 60D is much less expensive and ultimately the lenses will transfer to whatever video camera bodies come down the road.

The 60D being smaller makes it easier to sue for steadycam/stabilizer type work as well.

There are advantages to the AF100 regarding audio in and video monitoring to consider but I can't help feeling it's still first generation as noted above.

Sony will have something in store as well. Unknown is whether it'll be a "pro like" VG10 or other more radical design changes and lens compatibility, codec, price, etc.

I'm not sure what Canon will do but my hunch is their plan may be already reveled. I've talked to a couple of people at Canon and the sense I get is, the XF series is their run and gun fixed lens camera. The DSLR cameras will not change form factor as they want a still camera that can be used for video. Basically they feel the form factor is one of the strong selling points. It seems they're not inclined to make a line of large chip video form factor cameras at the moment. I can speculate that might change in a year or so but you can start shooting now with their DSLRs.

Any thoughts on Canon 60D vs the first generation of large chip video bodies or any more about previous points?
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 01:31 PM   #13
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One thing for sure though HDSLR or HDV or any video it is still miles from matching what GWTW a 71 year old film looks like on Blu Ray for colour and contrast.
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 02:18 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martyn Hull View Post
One thing for sure though HDSLR or HDV or any video it is still miles from matching what GWTW a 71 year old film looks like on Blu Ray for colour and contrast.
Just rent a Sony F35 then or maybe just shoot on 35 film. Sorry but your comments are pointless unless of course you're willing to give each of us $250,000.

The fact that Canon DSLRs are making into major broadcast and some feature work speaks for itself. People like the look.
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Old October 24th, 2010, 03:49 AM   #15
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You want to cool down it was a point, i own DSLR[550D still looks video] but was pointing out there is no video cam of any price at present that cam match what was filmed on this film 71 years ago.

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Gone-w...d-Blu-ray/758/
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