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Canon EOS Crop Sensor for HD
APS-C sensor cameras including the 80D, 70D, 7D Mk. II, 7D, EOS M and Rebel models for HD video recording.


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Old March 20th, 2011, 10:06 PM   #31
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Re: Wedding Equipment

and yes, you do turn off the lcd, which you can only do with magic lantern
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Old March 25th, 2011, 02:54 PM   #32
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Re: Wedding Equipment

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Originally Posted by Geoffrey Chandler View Post
I forgot one important thing - I feel like I need one more camera. Should I get a small HD camcorder to roll for the ceremony or another DSLR???
Easy.. if it's your first real event with the DSLR workflow, bring a backup camera that you're very familiar with... whatever camcorder you were using before would be ideal. Chances are, the DSLRs go just fine, but if not, she still gets here wedding video.

One thing in particular about Canons and Weddings.. you do only get your 10-15 minutes of recording... once you hit the 4GB limit (inherent in all FAT32 files, which means any camera using SDHC memory cards), it doesn't just open another file like a video camera, it stops. Period. Done.

Film people aren't phased by this in the slightest, because a normal 35mm film load goes 10 minutes. But for event work, this means you absolutely need a B camera. And if that B camera is also a DSLR, you need enough overlap to ensure that the two are staggered enough to get "A" going again before "B" stops.

If you have a Canon that runs MagicLantern, you can opt to auto-restart recording. This doesn't deliver a continuous stream, but keeps the video going, with 1-2 second delays in-between (no ML yet for my 60D, but I know satisfied users, and have donated to the 60D development effort here: 60D - Magic Lantern Firmware Wiki)
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Old March 26th, 2011, 06:18 AM   #33
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Re: Wedding Equipment

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Originally Posted by Dave Haynie View Post
once you hit the 4GB limit (inherent in all FAT32 files, which means any camera using SDHC memory cards)
Not really.

Cameras that use the AVCHD format (like the Panasonics for example) can create a new file and keep on going.
Actualy the record limit is there because of the Fat32 file system plus the inability of the recording format to create a new file. AVCHD overcomes this problem.
The new file system inroduced for the SDXC cards (exFAT if I remember well) will allow for larger than 4GB files and will overcome the problem in a different way.
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Old March 26th, 2011, 02:02 PM   #34
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Re: Wedding Equipment

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Originally Posted by Spiros Zaharakis View Post
Not really. Cameras that use the AVCHD format (like the Panasonics for example) can create a new file and keep on going.
You left out the part of my quote that made it clear I was discussing the Canon HDSLRs in particular. The FAT32 4GB limit is hard -- no files on FAT32 larger than 4GB. And since SDHC requires FAT32 (it's part of the standard... obviously, you can format it as NTFS, ext4, XFS, whatever 64-bit file system you like on a PC, but it doesn't work in other devices).

Yes, video cameras usually keep going. Panasonic (I own the HMC40 and TM700) starts a new file precisely at the 4GB boundary -- you have to catenate such files together to avoid a glitch, but it works fine. Other camcorders, Sanyo for example, close out the GOP and open a new file, apparently, but leave a gap of a few seconds. It's not a matter of AVCHD or not, it's simply how well or how poorly the device's firmware deal with file management.

And in the case of the Canon HDSLRs, they just stop. It has nothing to do with the recording format, it's simply that manufacturer's implementation of that format. And if you run Magic Lantern firmware on your Canon (not available for my 60D yet), you can "keep going" automatically, though there will be a gap of a few seconds in-between files.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiros Zaharakis View Post
Actualy the record limit is there because of the Fat32 file system plus the inability of the recording format to create a new file. AVCHD overcomes this problem.
Again, not part of the AVCHD specification. It's generally expected that video cameras will keep recording for some time... Panasonic consumer cameras, for example, will keep going, but only for 12 hours, regardless of how much storage you have. Even in time-lapse mode. Also not part of AVCHD, just an arbitrary decision they made. Some AVCHD cameras end files on GOP boundaries, some on 4GB boundaries. Some HDSLRs keep recording in new files, Canon doesn't. Maybe they have their reasons, but it's just a simple matter of software -- nothing remotely related to the Quicktime wrapper or any other firmware element preventing this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiros Zaharakis View Post
The new file system inroduced for the SDXC cards (exFAT if I remember well) will allow for larger than 4GB files and will overcome the problem in a different way.
Yes, it's exFAT, also sometimes called FAT64, and yes, it allows for files larger than 4GB. Which is the only real point of SDXC vs. SDHC, the electronics are identical (well, SDXC cards can run a faster hardware protocol, but they're pin and signal compatible). And both the more recent Canon and Panasonic cameras and camcorders support SDXC... but are they using the requited exFAT? Don't know... I do know my TM700 will not recognize a 32GB SDXC card formatted with exFAT. Have yet to buy any 64GB cards, not just due to price but the fact they only worked in the TM700, at least until I got the 60D.

Now, obviously, a 64GB or 128GB SDXC card could still be formatted with FAT32, and thus still incur this limit. Or the devices could use exFAT, but still impose the same limit, as annoying as that would be. And in fact, from what I've read at least, the 4GB limit exists, SDHC or SDXC, on the Canons (well, so far, only the 60D, T2i and T3i support it). This could be fixed in firmware (hint to Canon), at least for those not residing in the EU. And for that matter, even the EU guys could go to 29'59" before Dieter and Francois Law come gunnin' for their illegal camera.

The SD Card Association's official formatting utility (yeah, they have one) will only write FAT32 to SDHC, and in theory, only write exFAT to SDXC.
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