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Canon EOS Full Frame for HD
All about using the Canon 1D X, 6D, 5D Mk. IV / Mk. III / Mk. II D-SLR for 4K and HD video recording.


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Old February 20th, 2009, 12:08 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Joe Wentrup View Post
5. Bad ergonomics.
Bad ergonomics? It's no different than any other D-SLR. Add
the optional battery grip if you want 1D / 1Ds type ergonomics.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 12:31 PM   #17
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Testing your experience with your existing photo cam is a good test, but my guess is that it will only feed your gear obsession. Kind of like dating a girl you don't care about to see if you're ready to date the girl who haunts your dreams. You know which girl you'll be thinking about. :)

Ha! Very apt analogy. I am definitely haunted at the moment.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 01:05 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Chris Hurd View Post
Bad ergonomics? It's no different than any other D-SLR. Add
the optional battery grip if you want 1D / 1Ds type ergonomics.
IMHO discussion of the cons should be in another thread, but since we're already here, I'll throw my hat in. The ergonomics for stills shooting are excellent as long as you use the optical viewfinder.

But as soon as you start shooting video, ergonomics go out the window. But let's not talk about video: it is a stills camera, after all. So lets talk about just stills.

As soon as you start shooting handheld stills with liveview, ergonomics go out the window. This would be completely rectified with a swing out tilting LCD.

Currently, if you shoot hand held and want to achieve critical focus at f/2.8 or wider, you have to buy an Eg-S screen and focus manually, because the standard focusing screen cannot show any depth of field wider than f/3.5. Furthermore, the stated autofocus error tolerances are wider than that what's needed for critical f/2.8.

By the time you get down to f/2, f/1.4, and f/1.2, it's pretty much required that you spray-and-pray because there are no optical viewfinder screens to get you close enough with certainty (no real ground glass, no split prism, no microprism collar).

Not to mention that some lenses shift focus when stopping down, requiring you to focus with the DOF preview button, which is too dim with the high resolution focus screens.

Liveview is the perfect solution to all these problems: it allows fully critical focus and WYSIWYG. But it's very un-ergonomic to use handheld because you have to hold it up in front of your face like a digicam user. That's hard to do with the 600mm f/4 L IS. ;)

A swing-out tilting LCD would allow handheld stills shooting with all the benefits.

Of course, the biggest benefit would be for video shooters.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 01:31 PM   #19
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As soon as you start shooting handheld stills with liveview, ergonomics go out the window. This would be completely rectified with a swing out tilting LCD.
How many D-SLR's have a flip-out LCD though? (admittedly a rhetorical question; because the answer is none that I can immediately think of). In other words, while the criticism may be valid, it applies to *all* D-SLR's, and not just the 5D Mk. II in particular (since it's no different ergonomically than any other D-SLR). My point is that it's hard to label the lack of a flip-out LCD as a "con" since D-SLR's in general don't have flip-out LCD panels to begin with. Live-view enabled or not, there's currently no such thing as a Canon or Nikon D-SLR with a flip-out LCD.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 01:46 PM   #20
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Are we talking about a still camera or a video camera?

I'm hoping to buy a video camera in the next couple of months and, though I'm still reading about this camera, I've pretty much discounted it from consideration largely because of its ergonomics as a video camera.

So, to me, talking about it being a great still camera really doesn't enter into a discussion about using it for video.

My Canon S3 IS takes great looking SD video but its ergonomics suck! (Plus, it ain't even got a jack for an external mic.) For that matter, the picture of my HV20 looks great to me but I can't get used to the tiny size of it.

After saying all that, I'm curious to see pictures of how people are using it as a video camera. I imagine it being some kind of Rube Goldberg contraption with wires and doohickeys sticking onto the tripod--made moreso due to the form factor of its SLR heritage.

If Canon put the same camera in a traditonal camcorder form factor*, I'd probably jump at it. Fingers crossed for something like it at NAB.

*that'd be a wierd looking device
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Old February 20th, 2009, 01:53 PM   #21
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My point is that it's hard to label the lack of a flip-out LCD as a "con" since D-SLR's in general don't have flip-out LCD panels to begin with.
Agreed. As a still camera, fixed LCD is par for the course. Of course, live HDMI output would satisfy that need somewhat, too, via third party LCD and EVF.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 02:02 PM   #22
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A flip out LCD screen would be a great feature - even for a still cam.

Imagine needing to shoot over a crowd as a famous person walks by. If you could tilt the LCD down, you would be able to frame and time your shots.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 07:20 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Chris Hurd View Post
Bad ergonomics? It's no different than any other D-SLR. Add
the optional battery grip if you want 1D / 1Ds type ergonomics.
I referred to the 5D as a video camera. As a still camera it should work fine.
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Old February 21st, 2009, 03:40 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Daniel Browning View Post
Liveview is the perfect solution to all these problems: it allows fully critical focus and WYSIWYG. But it's very un-ergonomic to use handheld because you have to hold it up in front of your face like a digicam user. That's hard to do with the 600mm f/4 L IS. ;)
What I'd really like is liveview in the viewfinder, like a video camera! This would be perfect for shooting stills. I find I almost have to double my shutter speed when using liveview as I have no forehead and nose to rest against. So on my 35mm lens, using the viewfinder I can take shake-free shots at about 1/30, but using liveview I find I need to go to 1/60 to get a shake-free shot.

And, what would be even better is 10x zoom picture in picture, so I could frame and focus without needing to switch.
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Old February 21st, 2009, 05:51 AM   #25
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What I'd really like is liveview in the viewfinder, like a video camera!
But then it wouldn't be a Single Lens Reflex. The optical viewfinder is the whole idea behind the SLR.

I'd like to have this thread go back on topic (what are your top five reasons to go with 5D MK. II). Because what we're talking about now isn't even about what the 5D Mk.II actually is (it's a specific type of still photo camera -- an SLR -- that happens to have an HD video recording mode). As for wish-lists of what you want to see it morphed into, that's a subject for a different thread.
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Old February 21st, 2009, 09:04 AM   #26
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Since I just joined the 5D2 club, I'll chime in

5. I finally get to own a camera better than my wife's (40D).

4. An excuse to buy the 35/1.4L

3. And the 135/2L

2. I can ebay my FX1 and stop scaring the children.

And finally, the #1 reason to buy the 5DMkII

1. ISO 25600! I'm sure I'll never use it, but its fun to say!

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Old February 21st, 2009, 10:01 AM   #27
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Just an ice breaker.

I've misunderstood number 5 as I finally get to own a camera better than my wife

And so I jump into conclusion... of what the heck...I'd be better buy this camera right now..

and learned later you are referring to your wife's 40D.
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Old February 22nd, 2009, 09:19 PM   #28
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I'd probably echo most everything here especially owning two big, long HD rigs with 35mm adapters.

The one thing that I'm just in love with that surprisingly didn't get mentioned - shooting tapeless to inexpensive CF cards.

That is revolutionary in and of itself.
It makes our production workflow so much faster and simpler.
That was going to by my #6, but the thread said top 5. :)
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Old February 23rd, 2009, 07:00 AM   #29
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more or less the same reasons as others.

5) To stop using my 35mm adapters (once a necessary evil)
4) Low light
3) Inconspicuous filming.
2) Skill building. I learned so much when I bought my first video camera (Sony HC1). Owning my own camera allow to me to get into video more than I ever could with borrowing cameras at work occasionally. Again when I got a 35mm adapter, I learn about how shooting films differs than video. With the 5D2 I'm already learning so much more about still photography which is ironically what I started with prior to going digital and led me to video.
1) I'm bad with money.
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Old February 24th, 2009, 12:44 PM   #30
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Fixed LCD is par for the course.
I hope the recently-announced Olympus E-620, with a tilt and swivel LCD, is a sign of things to come for all DSLR cameras.
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