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Canon EOS Full Frame for HD
All about using the Canon 1D X, 6D, 5D Mk. IV / Mk. III / Mk. II D-SLR for 4K and HD video recording.


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Old February 19th, 2009, 10:55 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Thane Brooker View Post
For video work, if you *want* to introduce any pan or tilt (either by hand or on a tripod), the IS system gets in the way. First, as you begin to pan, the IS system tries to counteract this, then you reach the limit of the IS system and the picture tends to jump back suddenly.

Things to note when using IS: Battery life is reduced, and the 5D mic picks up the noise of the Image Stabilising system.
Agreed. I will add that some lenses have automatic (or switchable) panning detection, so that they will only correct movement in one axis, making pans more agreeable. "Mode 2" on my 70-200 f/4 L IS looks better than Mode 1 for this reason, but I still prefer to shoot tripod with IS disabled.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 03:06 AM   #17
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Just about to say the same thing, thinking about the Canon HJ40 which has selectable pan or tilt stabilising.

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Old February 20th, 2009, 09:57 AM   #18
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Amazing then that there's ever been a TV industry before IS was invented then! Of course you can shoot handheld without IS, most pros still do as it's not an option on most broadcast or cine lenses. It is helpful though when handheld.
And of course when panning/tilting on a tripod it's completely useless.
Steve
I'm guessing this is sarcasm, which really doesn't work in forums. But, I am a pro and was simply responding to the question with my very real professional experience shooting the 5DII with IS. And those of us who've shot with IS for broadcast and film for years of course know that you don't use it on a tripod.

That's why we call it hand held.
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Old February 20th, 2009, 10:14 AM   #19
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If you read your post though Jim you said "It's the only way to shoot handheld (literally)". That's the bit that implies that all shooting before IS was no good, because it can't be done (literally).
It is better to shoot handheld with IS, sometimes a lot better, but it ain't the way, not by a long shot. Steadycam's another option even.
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Old February 21st, 2009, 12:13 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Steve Phillipps View Post
If you read your post though Jim you said "It's the only way to shoot handheld (literally)". That's the bit that implies that all shooting before IS was no good, because it can't be done (literally).
It is better to shoot handheld with IS, sometimes a lot better, but it ain't the way, not by a long shot. Steadycam's another option even.
Steve
Hey Steve, picked any nits lately <g>? The question was specifically about shooting with IS on the 5DII. That's obviously what I was referring to. Who would would imply that "all shooting before IS was no good" except a nut and I promise you I'm not crazy.

The comment was a simple direct response to someone wondering if you can shoot HD with IS. As someone who's done a good deal of it in the field recently I gave him a simple affirmative with the additional - it's the only way to shoot hand held. Obviously this is the 5dII forum so anymore qualification seemed unnecessary.

The comment also echos the opinion of virtually everyone who's written about shooting the 5dII without a tripod. That is, hand held work can't be done useably with the 5dII without an IS lens. Hope that clarifies things
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Old February 21st, 2009, 12:16 PM   #21
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Didn't realise it was specifically about the 5d, sorry.
Surprised IS is so essential, why is that, rolling shutter issues?
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Old February 21st, 2009, 01:54 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Steve Phillipps View Post
Didn't realise it was specifically about the 5d, sorry.
Surprised IS is so essential, why is that, rolling shutter issues?
There's rolling shutter, as well as the relatively slow ~1/45 shutter at 30 fps. Normally, one shoots film with a 180 degree shutter. Typically, the 5D MkII shoots a 240 degree shutter, making it a bit sloppy.

Add to this the relatively small weight, small size, and SLR form factor, makes shooting with longer lenses handheld an issue.

Rather than true handheld, I prefer using a passive stabilizer, like a SteadyTracker. You still get a handheld look, but within tolerable limits.
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Old February 21st, 2009, 07:54 PM   #23
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Rather than true handheld, I prefer using a passive stabilizer, like a SteadyTracker. You still get a handheld look, but within tolerable limits.
Jon, in that case, with the cam on a SteadyTracker, do you turn off IS or do you still need it to combat any lingering rolling shutter issues, etc.?
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Old February 21st, 2009, 09:27 PM   #24
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Jon, in that case, with the cam on a SteadyTracker, do you turn off IS or do you still need it to combat any lingering rolling shutter issues, etc.?
We use Nikon lenses in order to gain better exposure control. I have the 70-300mm IS lens, but we untwist it when we use it for video, so there is no IS.
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Old February 22nd, 2009, 03:00 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Steve Phillipps View Post
Didn't realise it was specifically about the 5d, sorry.
Surprised IS is so essential, why is that, rolling shutter issues?
Steve
Like Jon says, form factor and weight...no shoulder resting for stability. Basically if you're shooting hand held you're shooting like all the people you always see holding their point and shoots up an looking at the LCD (cell phones too). The comments from people shooting the 5DII unstabilized has been universal with opinions like "even if everyone calls you Steady Eddie you can't shoot this hand held".

With my nikon primes it would be virtually unuseable without support. But with the 24mm-105mm IS that I got specifically for run and gun stuff it does remarkably well hand held. I've actually been shooting a lot of outdoor, back country snowshoeing and mountain sports stuff to perfect technique with the 5DII and IS, because even with IS the form factor is very different than any of the advanced IS video systems I've used.

However, I'm finding that the form factor actually has a real plus with IS and the "hold it out in front of you" shooting that it mandates. I'm getting a nice jib arm type of motion with my shots because of the ability to grab the auto focus quickly and then "float" the camera gently.

Like I said, I'm still perfecting the technique, but I'm finding that like some other still systems a little movement seems to engage the IS and a subtle movement on either plane really masks any jitter and allows for a nice gentle movement that is more like a steadicam or jib than a traditional pan or tilt on a tripod.

I just shot some great back country footage, all handheld, yesterday that's for a commercial project but that I can edit and post. I think it's pretty exceptional and I promise to get it up by the weekend after we get back from location.
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Old March 5th, 2009, 07:48 PM   #26
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thanks for this thread! About to purchase the 5dii and was weighing whether to get the 24-105 f/4 IS
or the
24-70 f/2.8

I feel for video the IS would be much more beneficial than the extra stop.

In fact, with the high ISO capability, it seems the only thing the 24-70 f/2.8 would offer is DoF (only 1 stop at that).... IQ opinions aside.
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Old March 6th, 2009, 01:10 AM   #27
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thanks for this thread! About to purchase the 5dii and was weighing whether to get the 24-105 f/4 IS
or the
24-70 f/2.8

I feel for video the IS would be much more beneficial than the extra stop.

In fact, with the high ISO capability, it seems the only thing the 24-70 f/2.8 would offer is DoF (only 1 stop at that).... IQ opinions aside.

I can chime in on some thoughts... I bought the 24-105L IS F4 after the advice of Jim and others. My alternate choice was a F2.8 28-70 lens.

It came down to... what am I going to use it for the most? Handheld daylight footage, when I wouldn't need the extra lens speed of the f2.8, but would want the IS to smooth out the handheld footage. That made the 24-105 my choice. Still wish it was f2.8 instead of f4 (not quite fast enough for night video, but i have a lot of other faster lenses).
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Old March 6th, 2009, 02:49 PM   #28
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And isn't it a great lens Dylan. As much as I'd love it to be a continuous f/2.8 throughout, that would make it a much bulkier lens like the 24-70, so I think Canon hit the sweet spot with this lens as a genuinely high IQ lens with great size and weight and IS that really makes it work for film making on the move.

I really can't say enough good things about the IQ as a cine prime or photographic lens. C'mon Canon, give us manual control so we can really use this great glass.

And I still have a really nice little back country piece I shot all handheld that I think shows this system's potential. I'm still totally in the weeds with new business (gratefully) but I'm going to get it up in the coming days...
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Old March 6th, 2009, 07:03 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Jim Giberti View Post
And isn't it a great lens Dylan...
It's like butter and candy melted together. Makes my 28-135mm IS feel cheap and trashy (this lens is for sale now, if anyone wants a low cost IS zoom, still a good lens, email me). The 24-105 is definitely worth the buy for anyone picking up the 5D kit.
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