audio help with 5d at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon EOS Full Frame for HD

Canon EOS Full Frame for HD
All about using the Canon 1D X, 6D, 5D Mk. IV / Mk. III / Mk. II D-SLR for 4K and HD video recording.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 31st, 2011, 11:57 PM   #1
New Boot
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: apple valley ca
Posts: 17
audio help with 5d

I will be shooting some talking head shots for my company this week, and would love some advice on the best way to record sound with this camera. I have some great wireless mics that we will be using as well.

1. Can we use the zoom to record straight to the camera so we don't have to sync it later in post, or is this not a great idea when using the 5d.
2. Can we listen to the sound while we record using the zoom as well, or does anyone know what configuration i would need to get to accomplish this.
3. I would like to configure the sound setup so i can use it anywhere I shoot not just at this shoot as well. I do a lot of out door shooting.
4. I read that some are using a juicelink box to record sound as well instead of zoom, anyone know which is better?

I know some use magic lantern with this camera ( i haven't tried this yet) but is this needed to listen to the audio as we record it?

I currently have a small azden mic i was using for syncing sound

Any input would be great, or setups that you are currently using.

Last edited by Jason Rae; August 1st, 2011 at 12:01 AM. Reason: forgot a question
Jason Rae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2011, 02:04 AM   #2
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Camas, WA, USA
Posts: 5,513
Re: audio help with 5d

The JL and ML gives less noise than recording into the camera than you get recording with the H4n into its memory card. I've never tried routing the H4n output to the 5D2, but be aware that headphone amps often have poor quality compared to amplifiers that are designed for the recording signal chain. Even the (very nice) Fostex FR-2LE has noisy headphone amps.

Note that the camera always has a high pass filter enabled. It's fine for normal dialog, but will sound thin for recording full range music or a really rich, deep, bass voice. It's good for reducing wind noise though...

And, yes, to monitor from the camera you need Magic Lantern. You will also either need to make your own cable or use the A/V cable that ships with the camera. You can't just plug headphones into the A/V output.

Overall, the JL/ML/5D2 combination has less noise than an H4n or DR-100, but the JL/ML/5D2 can sound slightly harsher than the dedicated recorders at high sound levels. And, as mentioned above, recording into the camera has limited bass.
__________________
Jon Fairhurst
Jon Fairhurst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2011, 08:20 PM   #3
New Boot
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: apple valley ca
Posts: 17
Re: audio help with 5d

thanks Jon, your always a great help!!!

one more quick question and not sure if you want me to start a new thread on this or not, but whats the best config for having a monitor with the camera. I just got a email saying we will have a nice 27 inch hd monitor to look at while shooting.

Will the camera send out a full hd signal for us to look at. If it dosnt whats the best way to config this so we can look at the footage through the monitor.

thanks again
Jason Rae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2011, 01:17 AM   #4
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Camas, WA, USA
Posts: 5,513
Re: audio help with 5d

Just connect the HDMI. It puts out HD in Live View and playback, but not during recording.

Some TVs/monitors have a problem with switching between HD and SD. If that's the case, just use the NTSC output. You can either use the A/V cable that ships with the camera or solder your own TRRS 1/8" plug on a custom cable.

For narrative work, I use the x10 magnification to set the focus points. I put gaffers tape on the follow focus as a reference.
__________________
Jon Fairhurst
Jon Fairhurst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 5th, 2011, 08:58 AM   #5
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kansas City, MO
Posts: 4,449
Re: audio help with 5d

Jason, if you do loop through the Zoom to the camera (using one of those $45 little pad cables to get from line out to mic out from the recorder), be aware that the Zoom's output is the headphone jack. So you'll need a Y adapter to monitor the Zoom. And, if you adjust the headphone gain after setting up the camera meters, you'll change the level going to the camera too.

I like to double record so I have the same mic going to the recorder and to the camera, and for a quick rough cut I can use the camera audio if necessary. As Jon says, it sounds thin but for some things may be useable. But you don't want to rely on it 100% because you have no way of knowing what you're really getting (unless you use Magic Bullet, which I don't).

What I do is put a file on my recorder with -12 db tone. I play that back into the camera and set the camera's meters to that tone. Then, whatever adjustment I make to the recorder's gain will go to the camera--as long as nobody touches the headphone gain.

Recently my Zoom died--that very mini jack fell apart inside the recorder, and the electronics guy trying to fix it couldn't get the proper parts and connectors. So I gave up on it and got a Marantz PMD661, which costs twice as much. It has two RCA outputs independent of the 1/4" headphone jack, so it's nicer for passing through the audio to the camera. Still, I never trust the camera audio. Syncing your files isn't that difficult, but you want to make sure to slate everything verbally. If you are careful and always turn on and off the recorder when you do the camera, then you'll end up with the same number of audio clips as video clips and life is easy. If you don't do that, you can have trouble finding the right file to go with the right video file. The syncing is easy, keeping organized is the hard part.
Bill Pryor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 9th, 2011, 03:32 PM   #6
Major Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Nashville, TN.
Posts: 581
Re: audio help with 5d

I fought the long fight with audio but am no expert.....I use a combo system - I use a RODE mic into the camera. This is my backup/sync audio. I then use the ZOOM H4n to feed in my wired XLR Lav mics which I mic the talent with. And or use a couple of wired XLR handheld mics if ok.
I then use DualEyes to sync the sound (very easy to do) and I then have MOV clips with the Zoom audio replacing the original RODE on camera sound. Just place the MOVs and one WAV into a dualeyes session and it does the rest.
This works best for me cause I can shoot with the headphones plugged in DURING recording and adjust the audio as needed.
I've bought all the crap to transfer the zoom directly into the 5Dmk2 but I just feel like that's not the best sound I can get so I use the ZOOM as my main audio recording device.
YMMV
Harry
__________________
Nashville TN using Canon 5D MK3, Canon 550D, RODE SVM mic, 70-200 f2.8L II IS, 24-105 f4L IS, 50 and 85 f/1.8, Vegas Pro 11, Zoom H4n, Blackbird, Lilliput Monitor, Lightroom
Harry Simpson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 9th, 2011, 03:56 PM   #7
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: West Orange, NJ, U.S.
Posts: 163
Re: audio help with 5d

Jon,

You mention the 5D always employing a high pass filter. Does this extend to situations where an external mic is used. A Rode Stereomic for instance. If so, there goes my plan for getting better sound at live music events.
Mike Hammond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 9th, 2011, 04:24 PM   #8
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Camas, WA, USA
Posts: 5,513
Re: audio help with 5d

The high pass (low cut) filter is always ON in the 5D. This is true even with Magic Lantern, and true whether the mic is internal or external. It's fine for dialog and casual music recordings, but not for recording good quality, full-range music.
__________________
Jon Fairhurst
Jon Fairhurst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 11th, 2011, 01:47 PM   #9
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: West Orange, NJ, U.S.
Posts: 163
Re: audio help with 5d

Thanks Jon. Good to know. I guess I'll still go with the stereomic to get overall sound regardless of where the camera is pointing in relation to the music source, and continue to increase the quailty of the audio in post.
Mike Hammond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 10th, 2011, 12:40 AM   #10
New Boot
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: apple valley ca
Posts: 17
Re: audio help with 5d

thanks for all the replys, really learning a ton from everyone about these cameras....

thanks
Jason Rae is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon EOS Full Frame for HD

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:37 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network