New: Canon VIXIA consumer HD camcorders for 2009

[Pete Bauer]

I think some of the posted links don't work correctly for on-the-fly generated pages (AJAX or whatever they use), but if you navigate directly in your browser, the Canon site works properly.

In any case, the answer is that the 24p is written as 60i to tape as with all the other small Canon camcorders, including the solid state 'corders. BUT, the wildcard is the specs page SEEMS to indicate BOTH 2:3 and actual "native 24p." Indeed, an interesting, if confusing spec sheet. I don't see why they'd put both in the camera -- if I shoot 24p I can't imagine I'd ever want it to be written to 60i -- but maybe there's a reason.

[Chris Hurd]

Update: Tentative prices, see http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/989182-post2.html

Have pics, will try to get them up tonight (heading out to dinner now).

[Bob Curnow]

I'm stoked... I'll be getting a vixia HF S10 or S100.

I was just telling the wife last night I'm holding out a few more days on getting a HF11 avchd camcorder to replace her HV20, because CES is just around the corner.

Also I should get two of them; she hates it when I leave her HV20 in 24p mode... she's a 60i type of gal. If I had two and made a custom mount, I could record everything in 24p and 60i at the same time :)

Bob C

[Bob Curnow]

Also note that these new camcorders announced today (except the HV40) have HDMI 1.3 (x.v.color)... if that means anything to anybody.

Bob C

[Robert Morane]

How would the S100 compete with the Pana HC150?

[Lou Bruno]

By virtue of a 58 MM lens and larger CMOS chip there will be increased resolution. It does make me wonder how well the signal to noise ratio will be since the camera is still a single chip camera and excessive grain could be an issue due to amount of pixels.

Originally Posted by John M Burkhart

Keep your eye on the HF S10/S100. Canon claims 900 lines of resolution out of that little guy, that's more than their professional HDV line-up. I saw some footage from a demo unit in Japan, and it was simply outstanding.

JB

[David Zeno]

I am an HV20 owner, but I am really loving the look of the HF S10

[David Sholle]

Originally Posted by Dan Brockett

If the CMOS sensors follow suit with still cameras, the higher pixel count in the HFS10/100 will result in noisier images in low light unfortunately. The lower line models may turn out to be the ones to buy because of less grain and noise in lower light since they have the less dense imagers.

Dan, the old rules for still cameras don't necessarily apply here. For example, it looks like the image sensor in the HF S10 and S100 is 1/2.6", which is substantially larger than the 1/4" sensor used in the S20 and S200. What this means, along with the larger diameter lens used in the S10 and S100, is that the total amount of light hitting the S10/S100 sensor will be greater. Now, with a higher pixel density, individual pixels may receive fewer photons, but in a 1920X1080 image taken from an 8.59 Megapixel sensor, numerous sensor pixels will be combined/averaged to create individual pixels in the 1920X1080 image. So, theoretically, the S10/100 should be able to have better low light performance than the S20/200. I don't know the details of Canon's Digic processor, but I would be surprised if the S10/100 has low light performance worse than that of the S20/200.

[David Parks]

Originally Posted by John M Burkhart

Keep your eye on the HF S10/S100. Canon claims 900 lines of resolution out of that little guy, that's more than their professional HDV line-up. I saw some footage from a demo unit in Japan, and it was simply outstanding.

JB

It even can record bars/tone. Pretty neat.

[Mathieu Kassovitz]

Canon VIXIA HF S10 and VIXIA HF S100 Flash Memory Camcorders

Both models feature the new DIGIC DV III Image Processor, an 8.59 Megapixel Full HD CMOS Image Sensor.

Video: Approx. 6.01 Megapixels (3264 x 1840)

What exactly does it mean? Does it provide external record 3k as the announced Red-Scarlet?

[Evan Donn]

Originally Posted by Mathieu Kassovitz

Video: Approx. 6.01 Megapixels (3264 x 1840)

What exactly does it mean? Does it provide external record 3k as the announced Red-Scarlet?

No, it means the active area on the chip uses 3264x1840 sensor sites which are sampled to produce the final 1920x1080 image, hopefully resulting in higher resolved resolution than a chip which used only the actual 1920x1080 resolution. Since this is a single chip camera the additional resolution should also allow results closer to that of a 3 chip camera... the drawback of course being that with more sensors crammed into a smaller area the light hitting each site is less and low light performance may suffer, but we won't know for sure until test footage comes out.

[Ron Evans]

Is the gain control independent or have they just done what Panasonic do and label when the exposure control moves into gain after the iris is full open. Nice to see but if one knows where the guide mark is for zero gain this has been available all along. I have a mark on my Sony's roughly where 0 is as Sony foolishly don't indicate. It is available because on playback data code reports all the information!!!! If the control is really independed( ability to set gain at 9 db and iris at F4) then this will be really great.

Ron Evans

[Chris Hurd]

Gain control is independent.

HF S10 pics added to first three posts of this thread... menus, displays, etc.

[Ian G. Thompson]

Well, aside from a missing a "real" focus ring, I think this cam is much better than the old Panasonic GS400 from several years back (in terms of manual control).

[Ron Evans]

Chris, that looks like an AGC Gain limit control rather than an independent gain control. I would like to maximize the depth of field by independently setting gain and iris. ie fix gain at 6db and then set exposure with iris at say F4 or F5.6. A limit control is still very handy to stop too much gain introducing grain.

Ron Evans