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-   -   Canon HF-G10 soft image (http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-vixia-series-avchd-hdv-camcorders/498177-canon-hf-g10-soft-image.html)

Nigel Moore July 7th, 2011 07:05 AM

Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
I'm considering buying the G10 rather than the Panasonic HDC TM-900. The only (significant) citicism that I've read of the G10 is that its image is a little soft compared to the TM900 which is sharper. But is the G10's image so soft that it can't be charpened in post without causing artefacts? If I can just sharpen in FCP that's good enough for me.

TIA

Gerald OConnor July 7th, 2011 07:28 AM

Re: Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
I have owned the panny 700,750 and 900. And have owned the canon xa10 and xf100 and now the g10. IMO the g10 is as good as the pannys in good light and blows away the pannys in lowlight.

Andree Markefors July 7th, 2011 09:41 AM

Re: Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Moore (Post 1665110)
The only (significant) citicism that I've read of the G10 is that its image is a little soft compared to the TM900 which is sharper. But is the G10's image so soft that it can't be sharpened in post without causing artefacts?

Instead of calling it soft, I feel "not oversharpened" might be more accurate.

Every time you see very sharp footage directly from a camera it's most likely due to a picture profile that adds contrast around edges.

This extra "sweetening" might very well be needed, but it's usually preferred to add it just before final export.

Of course, with many comsumer cams "just before final export" is right after pressing 'rec', because the average user doesn't do anything to the clips.

The HF G10 is aspireing to be more and Canon has made several non traditional decisions to make this a better camcorder. Not oversharpening the image is one of them. Like you say- add the desired amount in post.

Not so easy to remove disturbing halos...

Robert Young July 7th, 2011 12:08 PM

Re: Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Andree Markefors (Post 1665152)
Instead of calling it soft, I feel "not oversharpened" might be more accurate.

Every time you see very sharp footage directly from a camera it's most likely due to a picture profile that adds contrast around edges.

Exactly the case.
The level of "sharpness" is not simply a native quality of the camera/chip, but rather a digital effect that is set to a specific level, either by the user or the manufacturer, and can certainly be overdone.
Higher end cams like the Sony EX1 have a "detail" setting that addresses this issue. Many pro shooters do reduce the detail (sharpness) to achieve a more natural looking image, and to reduce artifact (ringing/halo, etc.)
I notice that the G10 does have some profile adjustments ("softness") that may possibly effect image detail.

Nigel Moore July 7th, 2011 01:01 PM

Re: Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
Thanks to you all!
Quote:

Originally Posted by Andree Markefors (Post 1665152)
Instead of calling it soft, I feel "not oversharpened" might be more accurate.

Every time you see very sharp footage directly from a camera it's most likely due to a picture profile that adds contrast around edges.

Correct, to a point, but in the case of the G10/TM900 the difference is also (supposedly) related to the larger pixel size of the Canon. The panasonic has smaller pixels that allow greater native definition (but probably contribute to poorer low-light IQ).

I'm still erring towards the Canon, but now flipping a coin over the G10 vs. XA10. Hey-ho! :)

Robert Young July 7th, 2011 06:11 PM

Re: Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Moore (Post 1665234)
I'm still erring towards the Canon, but now flipping a coin over the G10 vs. XA10. Hey-ho! :)

I'm holding out for the XA10. Just waiting for Canon to get the dealers restocked.
To me it's well worth the extra cost to be able to add XLR audio/wireless, etc. when needed, yet still maintain the small, convenient size factor.
IMO, Canon made a brilliant move with this camera. I guess that's why they are sold out right now!!

Gerald OConnor July 7th, 2011 07:04 PM

Re: Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
I returned my xa10 because my rocker switch on the handle wasn't working correctly sometimes it was intermittent. A few people had this issue but not that many that I'm aware of. My xlr switches rattled to and that is a bigger issue for people so they need to be taped if your going to be moving the camera around a lot. I guess if you use a good external mic the rattle issus is not heard. This was my favorite camera out of all I have had but no one had any more so I got the g10 and other than the handle items and IR it's just as nice.

Robert Young July 7th, 2011 07:51 PM

Re: Canon HF-G10 soft image
 
I have heard complaints about the handle/XLR rattles.
I am hoping they have corrected that problem on this latest build that has not hit the stores yet.
We will see...


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