Larry's HV20 clip--raw and then pure 24p

Barlow Elton · March 22nd, 2007, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad Schreiber

Forgive my lack of knowledge on this, but why was pulldown added going out to an .m2t file? I shot Canon XLH1 footage in 24f and went out to .m2t through firewire, and no pulldown was added. Did you go out via HDMI? I'm curious as to the reason for this.

It's a consumer camera and pulldown is added (most likely) for 1080i standards compatibility. It makes it so the camera can simply plug into most HDTV's and display correctly.

Barlow Elton · March 23rd, 2007, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Boston

FYI, I got jerky playback on the H.264 file also. I've had some similar problems when encoding H.264 using MPEG Streamclip.

-gb-

I suspect it might be due to B frames added to the encoding process.(an option in the latest MPEG Streamclip) I can make a version without them and it might play back more smoothly. The only reason I made a high bit rate h.264 was to try and keep the conversion as close in quality to the original m2t as possible.

Unfortunately, I don't have the ability to do HD WMV's on my G5.

Dan Peterson · March 23rd, 2007, 06:49 AM

FYI,
The clip plays better using Nero Showtime (I just bought Ultra 7 Enhanced), although still somewhat jerky.

Fergus Anderson · March 23rd, 2007, 07:11 AM

This 24p raw file plays flawlessly in Media Player Classic using DScaler 5 IVTC mod (72hz display at 24fps is best)

Robert Hicks · March 23rd, 2007, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barlow Elton

I suspect it might be due to B frames added to the encoding process.(an option in the latest MPEG Streamclip) I can make a version without them and it might play back more smoothly. The only reason I made a high bit rate h.264 was to try and keep the conversion as close in quality to the original m2t as possible.

Unfortunately, I don't have the ability to do HD WMV's on my G5.

Barlow, Do a google search for flip4mac and see if that helps.
(Windows Media® Components for QuickTime player should be free)

Kris Galuska · March 23rd, 2007, 11:24 AM

So if it is a normal pull down, we should be able to use vegas or cinaform, correct?

-Kris

Austin Meyers · March 23rd, 2007, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kris Galuska

So if it is a normal pull down, we should be able to use vegas or cinaform, correct?

-Kris

correct, fcp's cinema tools work fine with the footage i've played with thus far. you have to set the removal pattern manually, but once you figure it out it's smooth sailing.

Barlow Elton · March 23rd, 2007, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Hicks

Barlow, Do a google search for flip4mac and see if that helps.
(Windows Media® Components for QuickTime player should be free)

I've already downloaded and used the demo. It watermarks everything now.

Chris Sorensen · March 23rd, 2007, 04:58 PM

There's a free version of Flip4Mac that adds a wmv plugin for playback. Doesn't encode but you can play.

Barlow Elton · March 23rd, 2007, 05:09 PM

Here are some (hopefully) pc friendly clips: divx and wmv

http://media.dvinfo.net/canonhv20/hv20108024p.divx (28 MB)
http://media.dvinfo.net/canonhv20/hv20108024p.wmv (25 MB)

Something's wonky with the wmv. I installed the flip4mac demo again and it will encode, but the clip gradually gets a greenish tint. I have no idea why but it should play ok for most.

Lee Wilson · March 24th, 2007, 01:49 AM

Ah. . . the joys of living in a pulldown free PAL world ! :)

Fergus Anderson · March 24th, 2007, 02:50 AM

Lee do you know how the 25p raw files will play? In VLC will they show interlacing artifacts as they are in a 1080i stream? What will be the effect of the various deinterlacing options such as blend fields in VLC for playback?

How will Vegas be able to handle the files?

Cheers

Etienne Botha · March 24th, 2007, 04:57 AM

Ok wow, I REALLY like the direction of this.

http://stevenbothe.com/up/hv20-raw-24df-AppleTV.mov

720p single pass, apple tv compatible, basic warm processing, sheer for intermediate codec and pull down removal via cinema tools of course

no strobe, just smooth 24p

AMAZING I THINK!

I'm going V1U, but gosh, this is AWSOME for b-roll guys!

I thought there were interlace artifacts in the window awnings, but it was just shadows from fire escapes, hahaha. First try I was really disappointed, played around a bit with my settings, and OMGOSH, I LOVE THIS NOW!

I can't wait to see what comes out next from Sony and Canon!!

Barlow Elton · March 24th, 2007, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lee Wilson

Ah. . . the joys of living in a pulldown free PAL world ! :)

Indeed. I'd almost buy a PAL version of the camera simply to be free from this annoyance.

Barlow Elton · March 24th, 2007, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fergus Anderson

Lee do you know how the 25p raw files will play? In VLC will they show interlacing artifacts as they are in a 1080i stream? What will be the effect of the various deinterlacing options such as blend fields in VLC for playback?

How will Vegas be able to handle the files?

Cheers

I'm sure the actual 25p PAL version of HV20 footage won't have interlace artifacts at all. It's carried in the 1080i stream, but it's pure progressive.

March 24th, 2007, 04:57 AM	#28
Etienne Botha New Boot Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 12	apple tv Ok wow, I REALLY like the direction of this. http://stevenbothe.com/up/hv20-raw-24df-AppleTV.mov 720p single pass, apple tv compatible, basic warm processing, sheer for intermediate codec and pull down removal via cinema tools of course no strobe, just smooth 24p AMAZING I THINK! I'm going V1U, but gosh, this is AWSOME for b-roll guys! I thought there were interlace artifacts in the window awnings, but it was just shadows from fire escapes, hahaha. First try I was really disappointed, played around a bit with my settings, and OMGOSH, I LOVE THIS NOW! I can't wait to see what comes out next from Sony and Canon!!

March 23rd, 2007, 06:49 AM	#18
Dan Peterson Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Lake County, IL Posts: 59	FYI, The clip plays better using Nero Showtime (I just bought Ultra 7 Enhanced), although still somewhat jerky.

March 23rd, 2007, 07:11 AM	#19
Fergus Anderson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London, UK Posts: 321	This 24p raw file plays flawlessly in Media Player Classic using DScaler 5 IVTC mod (72hz display at 24fps is best)

March 23rd, 2007, 11:24 AM	#21
Kris Galuska Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NY, NY Posts: 59	So if it is a normal pull down, we should be able to use vegas or cinaform, correct? -Kris

March 23rd, 2007, 04:58 PM	#24
Chris Sorensen Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 61	There's a free version of Flip4Mac that adds a wmv plugin for playback. Doesn't encode but you can play.

March 23rd, 2007, 05:09 PM	#25
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	Here are some (hopefully) pc friendly clips: divx and wmv http://media.dvinfo.net/canonhv20/hv20108024p.divx (28 MB) http://media.dvinfo.net/canonhv20/hv20108024p.wmv (25 MB) Something's wonky with the wmv. I installed the flip4mac demo again and it will encode, but the clip gradually gets a greenish tint. I have no idea why but it should play ok for most.

March 24th, 2007, 01:49 AM	#26
Lee Wilson Major Player Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: London UK Posts: 376	Ah. . . the joys of living in a pulldown free PAL world ! :)

March 24th, 2007, 02:50 AM	#27
Fergus Anderson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London, UK Posts: 321	Lee do you know how the 25p raw files will play? In VLC will they show interlacing artifacts as they are in a 1080i stream? What will be the effect of the various deinterlacing options such as blend fields in VLC for playback? How will Vegas be able to handle the files? Cheers