Canon Reveals Their Next Pro Video Cam - Page 2 at DVinfo.net

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Canon XF Series HD Camcorders
Canon XF305, XF205 and XF105 (with SDI), Canon XF300, XF200 and XF100 (without SDI).


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Old January 13th, 2010, 01:32 PM   #16
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Man that is disappointing after a long wait. Oh well, I guess I can go ahead with the lens that I want at least!
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Old January 13th, 2010, 05:43 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Dom Stevenson View Post
BTW, Am i right in thinking a camera that shoots to SDHC cards will not have overcranking ability?
Not sure what the new Canon will do though it looks like it could be a nice camera, however I have the JVC HM700 and it overcranks nicely shooting to SDHC cards so I would expect the Canon to be able to as well.

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Old January 13th, 2010, 05:57 PM   #18
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BTW, Am i right in thinking a camera that shoots to SDHC cards will not have overcranking ability?
From what I hear, the bottleneck has more to do with the adaptor and the speed of the USB-ExpressCard interface of the EX rather than SDHC cards as such. And apparently, it's far better with the EX1R anyway, the assumption being that Sony have changed the interface.

Also remember that AVC-HD bitrates are lower than XDCAM-EX, so overcranking shouldn't be so demending anyway.

I'm also a little underwhelmed by what I'm hearing - more of an NXCAM competitor than one for the EX1, let alone an EX beater.
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Old January 13th, 2010, 06:01 PM   #19
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I have the JVC HM700 and it overcranks nicely shooting to SDHC cards so I would expect the Canon to be able to as well.
That's true Jim, however that camera is not AVCHD. This one is. I don't think higher frame rates are part of the AVCHD spec.

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more of an NXCAM competitor than one for the EX1, let alone an EX beater.
It is an NXCAM and AVCCAM competitor. That's exactly right.
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Old January 13th, 2010, 07:06 PM   #20
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Great article Chris,

After reading that I reckon we'll have to wait until 2012 before canon release a full frame CMOS dedicated video unit.

Unfortunately the world is due to end that year, so it may put a dampener on the release.
At least you can look forward to having excellent tools, just in time, for capturing doomsday in it's full glory with wondrously cinematic artistry.
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Old January 13th, 2010, 07:39 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Chris Hurd View Post
Read all about it in my article: Canon Reveals Their Next Pro Video Cam

The title of Michael's thread was "Canon CES 2010 news - very interesting" and I've since renamed it.

(Apologies to Michael, there was a bit of a delay involved while I finished up the article. I had started
writing it back in the middle of December, and then the holidays got in the way, and then CES happened,
from which I just returned this weekend).

This will be the official discussion thread.
Oh well, a dream slowly dies.

Thanks for the report Chris. Very informative and very accurate.

Guess I gotta save up a TON more money because those RED cameras sure are going to be expensive (kitted out).
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Old January 13th, 2010, 08:49 PM   #22
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That's true Jim, however that camera is not AVCHD. This one is. I don't think higher frame rates are part of the AVCHD spec.
That doesn't mean that an AVCHD camcorder can't be made to step a bit outside the spec. Canon's 24F, from their HDV cams, steps outside the HDV spec. Specs, like rules, were made to be broken, or at least expanded on a little. I'm not holding my breath for it, but I do hope that one of the major camcorder manufacturers will decide to expand on AVCHD, by extending the bitrate to at least 50Mbps (which is actually quite doable now, with somewhat low cost flash memory - like "Class-10" SDHC, which is something else that steps a bit outside a formal spec, but becoming quite available in the real-world, and pretty affordably at that).

I seriously doubt Canon would do that, but I could sure see Sony perhaps considering it (if they aren't already). It would actually make a lot of sense, for replacing the aging MPEG-2 formats they use at the higher end, as the next generations of CPUs start coming out (with enough number crunching power to make handling H264 encoded video quite reasonable and affordable), as well as software engineering that finally starts taking significant advantage of the massively parallel processing abilities of modern mainstream GPUs (hopefully in the relatively near future).

Once we do get a couple CPU generations down the road, and GPU potential starts actually getting unlocked for editing purposes, the older, less math intensive codecs, as well as intraframe only compression, start to lose the significant advantage they currently offer (speed). We really aren't all that far away from mainstream computing solutions that handle interframe H264 encoded footage smooth as silk.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 09:35 AM   #23
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BTW, Am i right in thinking a camera that shoots to SDHC cards will not have overcranking ability?
Not at all. The HMC40 and HMC150 shoot to SDHC cards and they can do 720/60p on even a class 4 card. Potentially a Class 6 card should therefore be able to handle up to 90fps, if the manufacturers were inclined to go over 60fps (which, of course, they've shown no inclination to do).

But 720/24p @ 60fps should be no problem for an AVCHD camera.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 10:21 AM   #24
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It's time for Nikon to step it up and release a video camera with a full frame sensor. That would be a game-changer. They have nothing financially to lose by going into the video market.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 10:36 AM   #25
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That would depend on how big this market really is and if people are prepared to pay more than they do for say a EX3. If it's a no compromise video camera, you won't have the stills market subsidizing it with those larger sales volumes.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 10:47 AM   #26
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It's time for Nikon to step it up and release a video camera with a full frame sensor. That would be a game-changer. They have nothing financially to lose by going into the video market.
Venturing into an entirely new market can (financially) cost a fortune, if the venture turns out to be a huge flop. Entering the video camera market would represent a significant (and very risky) departure for Nikon.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 11:53 AM   #27
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Well as Red shows - there is a large demand for full frame sensor videocameras for low prices. How many red ones have sold despite the various difficulties of the camera. Yes you're right - it is a financial risk in that they would have to create a video department. But it almost feels like photo and video cameras are merging - and if they did it they would have the resources to get the right people on it and to expand their line beyond photography.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 12:43 PM   #28
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The number of RED Ones seems to be around the 6000 to 7000 mark, seemingly you can't tell actual number from just the serial numbers because there are numbers allocated for the cancelled cameras. These are S35 rather than full frame 35 cameras.

Stills cameras already do have video build in, which is fine for the consumer/prosumer market. I've just been looking at some and it's getting tough to find one that doesn't have video of some sort. However, it does become more difficult once the processing demands causes overheating problems, so compromises do creep in to keep the size and power requirements down.

The Red is very much aimed at the professional market, but the 2/3" cameras continue to dominate that market, not counting the 1/3" cameras. There are a lot of advantages to the smaller sensor size, which why RED is also producing a 2/3" camera.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 01:20 PM   #29
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I've got to think that RED might perhaps be in a pretty good position to come out with a camera that would serve the folks that are so enthralled by video DSLRs. They could essentially use much of the technology they've developed to produce a much simpler camera that is limited to recording 1080p AVCHD on just one type of flash memory card (a cheap one, like SDHC of CF), rather than offering larger formats, more ambitious codecs and multiple recording medium options, as well. A lot of folks, more or less, simply want the shallow DOF from a large imager, with the ability to change lenses, more reasonable camera layout and controls (for shooting video as opposed to stills), XLR audio input, and are quite happy with recording 1080p images using H264.
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Old January 14th, 2010, 01:38 PM   #30
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The irony is that the 5D2 generally doesn't overheat, but the RED ONE is known to have cooling problems. I know that some shooters have brought dry ice to warm climates to cool their ONES.

Unfortunately, the 7D seems to overheat for some users. Scarlet has some large vents on top, and will hopefully not overheat in normal circumstances.
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