New preset : PFVISION (sample included)
 

Hi all,

In my struggle to find a perfect preset that fits all situations in shooting weddings, I've been trying some great presets from Giovanni Speranza. Vision01 was my favorite of all of the revisions he's made due to it's great skin tones yet it was just too dark during the reception. I've struggled with the low light situation compared to my partners' FX1s. The stock preset looks to be a stop to a stop and a half brighter so I KNEW there had to be a way to tweak the image to still have the great look but not be so dark.

PaPa from another forum mixed Steven Dempsey's Panalook with Gio's Vision04 and came up with Panavision. A few days later Gio, in his never ending quest for improving presets, came up with 35MMFILM preset. 35MMFILM had lighter gamma which was something I needed for those dark reception halls. Although great, I felt it's color was a bit green. He revised it and mixed it with Panavision and came up with PanaFilm.

Now PanaFilm was a GREAT preset yet it was still too dark in terms of shadows (which is more of a personal preference). I then went back to my favorite of Vision01 and "mixed" the two together. Here is my settings :


GAM CINE1
CMX N
HDF L
Black S
Knee L
NR1 off
NR2 off
CGN 25
RGN 48
GGN 49
BGN 50
SHP 9
SET -9
COR 9

Everything else zero.

I call it PFVISION (PanaFilm Vision).

Chris Light was kind enough to give my preset a try and this is what he came up with :


Another serendipity of this testing and tweaking was that it matches my partner's FX1s almost perfectly on the daylight WB! Usually, during same day edits, it was easy to pick out the different cameras based on the colors. Now they are pretty much close :).

I'm VERY VERY VERY happy with the way this preset turned out and it ROCKS in terms of low light compared to Vision01 but still keeping all the good things about that preset. I used this preset during a wedding this past weekend and it did great.

I get so much great information from this site so hopefully this preset will be beneficial to others.

Many thanks again to Giovanni Speranza, PaPa, and Steven Dempsey for the awesome building blocks of this preset.

-Randy

Very Nice, Randy
 

Randy,
Very Nice! I will copy the settings as soon as I finish posting.

I am interested how the camera was set up(gain, shutter speed, etc).

You mentioned that you made the preset for low light conditions but I didn't see a whole lot of low light footage.

What are your normal camera settings when you are shooting in low light? My xha1 and I only have a 2 week relationship and still learning. :)

Thank you for sharing your preset!
Michael

In the reception, I used +6 DB and it looked great (not a whole lot of grain and still had good colors and brightness). I usually shoot 60i and keep my shutter speed at 1/60. I'll sometimes use 1/30 during dances when they turn the lights down.

I try to shoot at -3DB if possible but couldn't get away with anything less than +6db in the reception hall.

My gain settings are -3 Low, +3 Med, +6 High.

Chris (the guy who made the video) just shot whatever he could around the house. Try it out in lowlight to see how it turns out. It won't make the camera image better than what the camera can produce though ;). I'm not sure which settings he used in his video.

If you shoot with 24F @ 1/24 or 1/48 shutter speed or even 60i/30F @ 1/30 shutter speed, it will give you even more light.

I tweaked this setting with low lit reception halls in mind. Try it out and let me know what you think. It's not for everybody but with the needs I had, it suits them perfectly :).

-Randy

Randy, I've noticed a number of people using "-3" for their primary gain setting. Why? Does it give you a clearer image when you're shooting with plenty of light?

I don't know the technical reason, but yes. Image should be producing less grain at the lower gain setting (just please don't ask me to explain it, heh). I can only relate it to ISO settings in the lower the setting, the less the grain. Although the older DSLR cameras have the "fake" 50 ISO setting that really didn't help too much. I'm sure one of the more technical guys on here can explain the science behind it.

One of the main reasons I do it is that it also gives me more play room when riding the aperture.

I don't believe it gives you a clearer image, but it does allow you to open up your aperture more, giving you a smaller depth of field, which I personally think creates a more pleasing image.

I think a "cleaner" image is a better term to describe the reason to use -3, not so much a "clearer" image. I'm jumping the gun a bit here, but the lower the gain setting = cleaner the image and less noise.

So in the case of having less noise, yes it does give you a clearer/cleaner image.

I suspected people were going with "-3" gain to reduce the grain in the image. However, I set up both of my A1's a while back and set one to "0" and the other to "-3" and I couldn't see a difference in the LCD. Are you guys actually seeing less grain in your images or is a case of "if you enlarge the image 300% you can see the difference"?

Regarding the wider aperture and lower depth of field, that is interesting .. and I don't understand how adjusting the gain would affect your aperture setting. I thought aperture was strictly a function of the lens, and not related to internal software in the camera.

I can only assume it's less gain. I have never actually put it to a test.

As for the aperture method Mikey talked about, I can see how it would work if you were trying to keep things from blowing out wide open but don't really see how often that would come up considering you could use shutter speed + NDs to get you to stop down as well. It'd have to be a very bright scene to still blow out after maxing out both ND and shutter speed options.

Okay, well, in my unscientific test I couldn't see a difference in grain between the two, although I could tell that one was slightly darker. Because of that, I decided to just stay at "0" since I shoot mostly weddings and I usually need all the help I can get at a dark reception.

I only use -3 db outside, and always start at +3db inside since that little bump helps. One can assume that with it being darker, then hopefully that comes with less grain and a clearer picture.

This preset at +6 DB looks very clean on the LCD. I was using a preset before that was an estimated stop to stop and a half darker at +6db. With a change of just this preset, +6db looks fine to me AND it made all my footage usable without having to do any CC.

I should have taken some quick test footage at the reception hall I shot at this past saturday, but needless to say this is my end all be all preset :).

If you do try it out at a reception, please let me know how it holds up! I know exactly how you feel about trying to get all the light possible. I was ready to put the A1 up for sale and get an HMC-150 till this preset came along. That's the reason why I'm so happy with it, it was the deal breaker on whether or not I was going to keep the camera (was getting tired of my friend with an FX1 constant ribbing about the low light capability of this cam..haha).

BTW, what preset are you using now to shoot? Do you shoot in 24F?

-Randy

I actually don't use a preset when I film because I'd rather have a flat image to work with in post as it's generally a safer route in my humble opinion. I have several on the cameras, but just haven't used them. I might put this one on and try it out at the end of a reception .. you know, run a test and see how it does with and without the preset. Who knows, it might change my opinion of presets, lol.

Also, I do film in 24f.

Thanks for your reply, Randy
 

Thanks Randy. Being new and playing with the camera, your statements confirm what I am finding my self. I will certainly give your preset a try. Thanks again for sharing your time and preset.

Best regards,
Michael

Hey Michael!

No problem. This forum has helped me out quite a bit so I'm glad to give back. Please try it out and let me know what you think :).

-Randy

How can this Preset help in low-light with the Setup level at-9?
And doesn't pumping up the colors almost with the same amount give a reddish result.

It doesn't look reddish to me. I also wouldn't expect ANY preset to push the camera past its limitations without trade offs like ghosting, washed out colors, etc. This preset works for me with +6 db in a lowly lit reception hall when my old preset of vision01 didn't at +12db. I know it's because vision01 had a gamma of cine2 but at the same time, it had the best skin tones and looked close to what I saw with my eyes....it was just too darn dark.

You can try it out and then tell me what you think. It may not work for your tastes. It's not for everyone but it suits what I need it to do just fine.

Low light test footage pfvision preset
 

Randy,

Here's some low light footage that I took with the PFVISION preset. I like it. Sorry for being so short. Still learning!!!

Thanks again for sharing your preset, Randy.

Camera settings are on the link.

XHA1 PFVISION PRESET LOW LIGHT TEST on Vimeo

Found an answer via Patrick Moreau. -3 allows you more room to push the image in post before grain makes itself apparent from grading.

God...that color grading class was incredible...lol.

Thought I'd just toss that in there.

Randy,

Thanks for sharing: new to the xlh1 from my xl2 and I have not shot another wedding, but when I do i will use this preset!! always struggling keeping good color/images in low light. this is awesome!!

Hi Randy,
Just shot some stuff with your preset the other night. I was using a friends camera & when i got to see the footage i shot with your preset i was absolutley blown away. The colours where brilliant & the low light ability was far better. If i can i will get some samples up here. Well done with this preset, & thank you, i will definately be using it a lot more.
Regards,
Bryce

Shot a very dimly lit play last night and decided, after some testing, to use this preset. Am really happy w/the results, will post some footage when I get a chance, but this was a great preset for the situation. Thanks for coming up with this.

Here are a couple of shots from last night's show. It was the Miracle Worker, aka the Helen Keller story:

http://www.mostlymagic.tv/miracle_worker.mov

Shot 60i at 30th and +6 db, generally very low light. No correction on this footage but I'll be able to brighten it up a lot, am very satisfied with the lack of noise.

Thanks to -- is it Randy? -- for coming up with this preset.

Dale, no problem :). Go tackle those low lit reception halls!

Bryce, you are most very welcome. Looking forward to seeing some footage.

Jeff, good to hear it's working out for ya, no problem. Just contributing back and paying it forward ;). The footage looks great btw.

Cheers

The Best Preset to date!
 

I must say I stumbled on this forum by accident and saw the PFVision Preset and thought,"sounds interesting." I am a wedding videographer and reception rooms are always real tricky. I hate using my onboard light all the time because it just does not look very natural. Although there are key moments I cannot live without an onboard light.

I tested the preset on my XHA1 as soon as I read this post and was simple blown away Randy by the results just viewing thru my LCD viewfinder. I walked into my walk-in closet with the door ajar and the only light was from the open door. It was dark to say the least.
I was set at 60i / F1.6 and 1/30 shutter and what my eye saw is what my lcd saw. Just amazed me man. I am even able to use -3db and choose whether to use 1/60 or 1/30 depending on the light and also I don't always have to have the aperture at 1.6 for the most light possible. Hardly no grain noise. This gives me greater control and freedom over my shots.

I will post results when I get a chance to shoot some. My next wedding is in a couple of weeks but I was very impressed by Jeff Nelsons sample: http://www.mostlymagic.tv/miracle_worker.mov

Thanks for sharing. I feel like my Canon XHA1 can now compete with that lowlight rascal Sony VX2100. Made me fall in love with this camera all over again.
Keep up the good work guys.

Hey Charles,

Glad you liked the preset :). Unfortunately, I sold my A1 to get an HMC150. I'll really miss using this preset as it gave me great colors in low lighting.

I made a couple changes in my final revision of PFvision as I was finding that the image seemed a bit soft at times.

I changed coring to 0 and sharpness to 0. Looked a little better to me. VERY VERY hard to discern unless you're looking for it though.

Thanks for the encouraging words, I'm glad to hear others are really enjoying using my preset since I love giving back to the community here. Maybe when the next iteration of the XH-A1 comes out, I'll be able to sell off the HMC150 and use this preset again ;).

-Randy

With all brutal honesty, how are you finding that cam compared to the XHA1?

I'll definitely let you know when I have it in my hands. Waiting till after NAB to purchase.

This is fantastic. I just tried it out at home. Thanks!!!!

I don't actually quite understand this preset malarky but will read up on it tomorrow. I may return with many questions.

Fascinating thread, thanks Randy. I shoot airplanes mainly outdoors in good light and find Stevens great PANALOOK2 preset works for me. But occasionally I get short notice to shoot inside an aircraft or a darkened hangar without adequate lighting.

So I'm looking for a good lowlight preset to cover this and I'm wondering how your new preset would intercut or blend in with PANALOOK2?

Yep I know, try it :) but have you or anyone tried this, say outside the reception hall, then inside.

Cheers.

It works in all occasions for me. I'd just be careful about exposures since the high color gain makes it almost impossible to salvage a blown out shot. Then again..it may just be the HDV codec ;).

Here is some daylight stuff with the PFVision preset.
The first 5 minutes of the video is about some 80's DTM race cars and the last 5 minutes is from a modern endurance race. All last saturday at the famous Nurburgring Nordschleife in Germany. I really wanted the colours to pop, so i used the PFVision preset all day long.
I did some colour correction with Vegas 3-wheel corrector to give the first 5 minutes a 80's look and used my favourite plug-in, NewBlueFX video-essentials to give the whole video some extra punch.
Watch it here DTM-revival+VLN, Nurburgring Nordschleife on Vimeo
or here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5f_jP...el_page&fmt=22

Nice Stuff Hubert,

Is this preset available?

Regards,

Tom Chaney

Thanks Tom,
The preset isn't available as download, but you can easily dial it in using the numbers in the first post. I did it that way.

Good luck.

PFVision
 

After Using this preset a couple of times at weddings, I will say that the camera has an awful time with focusing. The image is just too soft most of the time and seems out of focus. Even when I shine a 10w light on the subject does not help. Since it is near impossible to do a manual focus with XHA1 lcd screen it is just too difficult to keep up with fast paced weddings. Don't get me wrong, in a controlled environment the preset rocks but for run 'n gun at weddings not good. I agree with randy in an earlier post. I changed the coring to 0 and sharpness to 3. I also modified it a bit to help with focusing issue. Will test on my next wedding and post results.

Charles,
I've found the same problem with focus... It makes a huge difference in the low light capability, but focus is an issue. I found that if you keep the instant auto off, then it works better...
Bill

Just wondering if someone can clarify on the focus - are you saying that using this preset effects the cameras auto focus in low light situations? Or does the xha1 have a low light focusing issue in general? I was lead to believe that the xha1 was one of the best and 'quickest' auto focus pro camera's on the market...?

Paul, looking at the previous posts long ago always made me wonder just HOW any preset could affect focusing. It doesn't make sense at all, so I wouldn't worry about it. I assume the ones who mentioned it may have just "thought" there was an issue. Think about it... where does focusing come from? The lens! Presets basically are a "post process" in camera. So in other words that altered process of the image is AFTER what light is coming through the lens to make an image.

Video Shot In PFVision
 

Here's a video I shot testing the PFVision preset with -3 gain at an event called Word Of Mouth - Underground Art & Sound in Los Angeles.

First Time LA creates events like Word Of Mouth - Downtown Underground Art & Sound that bring together painters, photographers, sculptors, bands, DJs and multimedia artists in their downtown Los Angeles warehouse.