Preset or not Preset,......that is the question. at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders

Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders
Canon XH G1S / G1 (with SDI), Canon XH A1S / A1 (without SDI).


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old April 23rd, 2009, 08:23 PM   #1
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Romney Marsh UK
Posts: 58
Preset or not Preset,......that is the question.

What a fabulous camera this is. Rather unadventurously, I have taken a liking to the PANALOOK setting, shooting mostly outdoors and wildlife.

At the risk of asking a stupid question, does anyone actually shoot with this camera WITHOUT any preset? In other words, footage obtained simply with the default factory settings. Are there any examples of such work posted?

There does seem to be some consensus that applying presets might, in certain circumstances, actually degrade or detract from the footage. (Conversely, there are those <myself included>, who believe that POST work has a greater detrimental effect than any presets or in camera corrections>.

I would be interested to learn of your valued opinions.
More power to your lens..........
Mike Hardy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2009, 10:00 PM   #2
Trustee
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North Conway, NH
Posts: 1,745
When I shoot nature, I'll use a preset. But for anything else I use the default mode. The primary reason why is that I have to match the footage with some combination of HV30, HV10, soon a couple of HF100s and SD footage from a couple of ZR900s. The factory setting seems to be the simplest way to go for that.

It's been said by a few here that it's easier in post, if you're staying native HDV, if you over saturate a bit because contracting the color is easier than expanding it. Expansion will cause banding in any kind of gradient. Trust me, it can get nasty.

The big multi-cam shoots are for shooting racing and the light there isn't the greatest. Your post has given me an idea to experiment with boosting saturation in the other cams and finding a match in the XH A1. It might help with the low light footage I have to deal with.

BTW... You might want to look into the PANALOK2 setting. It seems to be preferable to to PANALOOK by those who use it.
Tripp Woelfel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 23rd, 2009, 11:44 PM   #3
Wrangler
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Makati, Metro Manila
Posts: 2,706
Images: 32
My cameras have Panalook2 and TruColor loaded. I use Panalook2 most of the time. And I'm really starting to like TruColor as I understand how to use it properly.

For flexibility in different lighting situations, I have 3 versions of Panalook2 loaded. Each Panalook2 preset has a different black setting: MID, PRESS, and STRETCH, so that I can quickly adapt to different lighting situations.


And of course, that little piece of paper taped to the back of the camera, so you can remember which preset is which.
__________________
"Ultimately, the most extraordinary thing, in a frame, is a human being." - Martin Scorsese
Michael Wisniewski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 24th, 2009, 02:10 PM   #4
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 291
Can somebody please post some footage of the Panalook and Panalook 2, my XH will be arriving next week and I'm dying to see what this look looks like exactly. Thanks!
Danny Winn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 24th, 2009, 07:28 PM   #5
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sydney.
Posts: 2,569
Danny, I've seen some footage back in the archives if you run a search here. And see this thread, specifically post 197 here ...

http://www.dvinfo.net:80/conf/canon-...y-copy-14.html

I first looked at all the presets above and thought, I'll never have the time to check all those out, so I followed the advice here and found I liked PANALOOK2.

But I list all the settings for each preset I'm interested in, in a folder on my email laptop, so I can quickly compare them to any other presets listed on any sites, or enter them manually into my A1. I also list a link to where I got 'em from so I can get any updates. I'm slowly learning them, it takes time.

EDIT: here's some PANALOOK vids, some great, some not so.

http://www.vimeo.com/tag:panalook/page:1/sort:newest

Cheers.

Last edited by Allan Black; April 24th, 2009 at 10:50 PM.
Allan Black is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 25th, 2009, 01:55 AM   #6
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 9,068
The first wedding I did with my canon was with a preset and it was also the last time I used it. I've tested all available presets and most do weird things with your colors and often you loose too much latitude. Now I just prefer to shoot as flat as possible (no preset) and do CC in post. If you apply a preset and if it results in blown out whites or loss of details in dark area's there's virtually no correcting, shooting as flat as possible gives me the control I want afterwards and still retain all the detail when I need it.
Noa Put is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 25th, 2009, 04:51 AM   #7
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Crete Greece
Posts: 76
Yellowish skin

Ok, It seems that nobody has mentioned this problem so far. Is it something I am doing wrong or a camcorder fault?
When I shoot anything that includes human skin (the skin area) seems yellowish!
I ballance the whites again and the problem does not go away unless I WB on other than white color (e.g. a grey concrete wall).
I mean that when I experiment alot with WB I usually correct the problem.

Thanks.
__________________
Visit my work at www.atheaton.gr
George Pada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 26th, 2009, 11:29 PM   #8
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Fallbrook, CA
Posts: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allan Black View Post
Danny, I've seen some footage back in the archives if you run a search here. And see this thread, specifically post 197 here ...

http://www.dvinfo.net:80/conf/canon-...y-copy-14.html

I first looked at all the presets above and thought, I'll never have the time to check all those out, so I followed the advice here and found I liked PANALOOK2.

But I list all the settings for each preset I'm interested in, in a folder on my email laptop, so I can quickly compare them to any other presets listed on any sites, or enter them manually into my A1. I also list a link to where I got 'em from so I can get any updates. I'm slowly learning them, it takes time.

EDIT: here's some PANALOOK vids, some great, some not so.

Videos tagged 'panalook' on Vimeo

Cheers.
damn. 3 of my videos are on that first page. i hope they're not in the "not so great" category. haha....mind you, one of them is hugely color corrected, so i can't blame the preset :-)
Chris Light is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 27th, 2009, 05:49 PM   #9
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sydney.
Posts: 2,569
Hi Chris, I meant 'not great examples of Panalook' a few of those were colour corrected so not actual examples.

In hindsight I shouldn't have posted that Vimeo link, just confusing, sorry Danny :(

Cheers.
Allan Black is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 27th, 2009, 10:22 PM   #10
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 291
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allan Black View Post
Hi Chris, I meant 'not great examples of Panalook' a few of those were colour corrected so not actual examples.

In hindsight I shouldn't have posted that Vimeo link, just confusing, sorry Danny :(

Cheers.
Ha, Yeah I wasn't real sure which of all those clips were just the Panalook preset and which were done in post (Except for the one marked Panalook). But having looked at most of them I am pretty confident that I can get all those looks in post with color correction and post filters.

I'm always a little afraid of filming a lot of footage with a preset cause you can't get it out once it's there. I've only used the XL 2 until next week when my XH A1s arrives mind you.

Thanks.
Danny Winn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 28th, 2009, 02:39 AM   #11
Major Player
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Prague Czech Republic
Posts: 263
re

I can't use my XH-A1 without custom preset .-) , e.g. in lowlight I must use this custom preset when I need +12dB :
gam1, kne L, BLK M, PED -2, SET -3, SHP 0, HDF M (!), DHV 0(!), COR 2, NR1 0, NR2 L, CMX1, CGN 12 CPH -1, rest 0.

It has noticeably less noise than GAM normal with +12dB and it is noticeably brighter than GAM normal +6dB.

In daylight custom presets adjust black and white level, basic color saturation and look, but I don't use this custom preset for extreme looks, it is better make in post.
Pavel Sedlak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 28th, 2009, 10:15 AM   #12
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: South Bend, IN
Posts: 179
Most of the time, I agree with Noa: I don't want to run the risk of a preset blowing out whites or killing detail in dark areas. To my eye, the best footage is without a preset. It's all subjective, though. I like the slightly subdued colors. Many of my clients seem to as well.

The only time I use a preset 100% of the time, is in low-light situations. I've been using the PFVision preset in low-light and have been impressed by it so far. If I have to go to 6db, PFVision is loaded.

If I know my client wants that super-saturated look, I'll load up either the TruColor or Panalook presets.

To my eye, the best footage is without a preset. It's all subjective, though. I like the slightly subdued colors.
__________________
Woz
Ken Wozniak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 28th, 2009, 03:03 PM   #13
Major Player
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Prague Czech Republic
Posts: 263
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Wozniak View Post
I don't want to run the risk of a preset blowing out whites or killing detail in dark areas.
Work with custom preset make footage better, not worse .-) . It is vice versa, if you don't use right level of black, white and color saturation, you can lose some picture information (colors, luma levels). It can be difficult correct this in post.

But I agree, extreme setting is no way.
Pavel Sedlak is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:18 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network