Adjusting Presets at DVinfo.net

Philip Younger · June 4th, 2009, 11:37 AM

I have just started to knuckle down and play with the presets. There are possibly 4 that I think I might be able to use but with minor adjustments.

The problem is, I don't know what the various settings control - is there an explanation anywhere for the terms used? i.e. [BGM] B-G Matrix, or [RGN] R Gain or how about what what [CMX] Colour Matrix is/does etc etc

I'm sure I wouldn't be alone in having some insight as to what the controls mean/do - I've tried googling BTW

Allan Black · June 5th, 2009, 08:13 AM

Some smarter people than I have offered presets to us all and IMO I'd start with PANALOOK and VIVIDRGB and see if they suit you because presets are so personal and based on your monitor settings.

But here's a basic listing of the controls to get started.

Gamma Curve – The gamma curve, which controls the relationship between light intensity and output, can be set to Normal, Cine 1, and Cine 2. The latter two are meant to match the gamma curve of film.

Knee Point Adjustment – Knee controls the dynamic range of the upper-end of the exposure scale (highlights). It can be set to Low, Middle, High, and Auto.

Black Stretch/Press – This controls the dynamic range of the low end of the exposure scale (shadows). It can be set to Middle, Stretch (which expands the dynamic range), and Press (which decreases dynamic range to intensify shadow).

Master Pedestal – This is the start point of the gamma curve. It can be set to +/-9.

Setup Level – This is the start of the black point, which Canon defaults to 3 IRE (what they consider the industry standard).
It can be adjusted to +/-9. Your Master Pedestal setting may prevent you from setting a negative Setup level.

Sharpness – Sharpness can be set from +/-9.

Horizontal Detail Frequency – HDF can be set to Low, Middle, and High.

Horizontal / Vertical Detail Balance – Labeled as DHV in the menu, this also has a +/-9 range.

Coring – Coring, which can be set from +/-9, controls the amount of noise in detail.

Noise Reduction – This is actually split into two functions, NR1 and NR2. NR1 is a standard sort of noise reduction that can be set to Low, Middle, and High. When in High, trailing often shows up in moving objects. NR2, also with Low, Middle, and High settings, Canon describes as similar to applying the Skin Detail feature to the entire image. Trailing will not occur with NR2.

Color Matrix – This can also be set to Normal, Cine 1, and Cine 2.

Color Gain – What was once a +/-9 range on the XL H1 has greatly expanded to +/-50 on the XH A1 for a much finer degree of control. As far as we can tell, though, the actual range has not increased.

R Gain, G Gain, and B Gain – Each of the Red, Green, and Blue channels gets its own gain control, as well. Like the overall gain, each has increased the degree of control form the XL H1, and is now +/-50.

2-Channel Matrices – Each channel can be set against the other to create exact color balance to a degree of +/-50. The menu offers: red-green, red-blue, green-red, green-blue, blue-red, and blue-green.

Apologies to whoever wrote that, the author got lost in the shuffle.

HTH Cheers.

Annie Haycock · June 5th, 2009, 10:12 AM

Allan

Regardless of who wrote it, thanks for posting it.

It's all very well telling people to read the manual, but the manual only tells you how to adjust them, it assumes you know what these things are to start with.

Perhaps someone should send it to Canon with a request (or preferably an order) that they should include it in the next manual!

David Dalton · June 5th, 2009, 02:16 PM

There is a link in the stickies above to the Canon USA site for the XL, which has the information.
To save a link going through a link, the website is

Canon XL H1 HD Camcorder: In Depth :: Total Image Control

David

Philip Younger · June 5th, 2009, 05:56 PM

Thanks for the explanation, it is useful for fine tweaking

Allan Black · June 6th, 2009, 05:52 PM

Hi Annie and guys, I'm producing programs for the Historical Aircraft Restoration Society here. They go out on DVD and regarding the use of presets, here's where I'm at ... so far.

What looks great on my Dell 2408WFP NLE monitor, doesn't always look great on my Sharp Aquos LCD TV. Even if I adjust the pix in post to look great on my Aquos, it doesn't necessarily look good on the *average* sampling of TV screens the product is displayed on.

I archive a lot of HD footage for use later, so I can't afford to play with presets too much resulting in so much work later in post matching the scenes, it becomes a pain.

When I started with CPs, I spoke, slated each shot with the CP name, so I'd get familiar with the various 'looks' out of the A1.

I've found PANALOOK, (not PANALOOK 2) covers most of what I'm doing. When the scene is similar shades of eg: pastels, I use VIVIDRGB. Same when the light is low in the hangars. But the necessary requirements are always, good light and correct white balance.

I use an Expodisc for WB, IMO essential for mixed lighting, and have just started using the Warm Expodisc for talking heads to cam.

Within the constraints of what I'm doing CPs are a work in progress, but not too much. :)

Cheers.

Guillaume Cottin · September 18th, 2009, 06:17 AM

Quote:

What looks great on my Dell 2408WFP NLE monitor, doesn't always look great on my Sharp Aquos LCD TV. Even if I adjust the pix in post to look great on my Aquos, it doesn't necessarily look good on the *average* sampling of TV screens the product is displayed on.

Each TV, projector... is different. The capabilities of the A1 make us enter the wonderful world of colorimetry, a world where you should know that you won't have the same colors twice...

Older Sony budget cameras like the Z1, FX1... didn't have the amount of control that the Canon offers ; and I should say, the default Sony presets were good enough for all-purpose shooting contrary to the A1's. That's why many people have never thaught they could have a problem with color rendition, and are now disappointed with Canon's approach that considers post-production. The XHA1 forces users to pay attention to color neutrality, and to finally discover that... true neutrality does not exist.

I agree to say that the Canon default setting, while very ugly (it would need a LUT for preview on set !), retains more detail and dynamic range than many of the home made presets. However, it requires systematic colour grading.

Cheers.

June 4th, 2009, 11:37 AM	#1
Philip Younger Major Player Join Date: May 2008 Location: Warwickshire Posts: 207	Adjusting Presets I have just started to knuckle down and play with the presets. There are possibly 4 that I think I might be able to use but with minor adjustments. The problem is, I don't know what the various settings control - is there an explanation anywhere for the terms used? i.e. [BGM] B-G Matrix, or [RGN] R Gain or how about what what [CMX] Colour Matrix is/does etc etc I'm sure I wouldn't be alone in having some insight as to what the controls mean/do - I've tried googling BTW

June 5th, 2009, 10:12 AM	#3
Annie Haycock Major Player Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Pembrokeshire, Wales Posts: 734	Allan Regardless of who wrote it, thanks for posting it. It's all very well telling people to read the manual, but the manual only tells you how to adjust them, it assumes you know what these things are to start with. Perhaps someone should send it to Canon with a request (or preferably an order) that they should include it in the next manual! __________________ Canon XH A1; Canon XF100; Nikon D800

June 5th, 2009, 02:16 PM	#4
David Dalton Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Uckfield, UK Posts: 69	Image control There is a link in the stickies above to the Canon USA site for the XL, which has the information. To save a link going through a link, the website is Canon XL H1 HD Camcorder: In Depth :: Total Image Control David

June 5th, 2009, 08:13 AM	#2
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,887	Some smarter people than I have offered presets to us all and IMO I'd start with PANALOOK and VIVIDRGB and see if they suit you because presets are so personal and based on your monitor settings. But here's a basic listing of the controls to get started. Gamma Curve – The gamma curve, which controls the relationship between light intensity and output, can be set to Normal, Cine 1, and Cine 2. The latter two are meant to match the gamma curve of film. Knee Point Adjustment – Knee controls the dynamic range of the upper-end of the exposure scale (highlights). It can be set to Low, Middle, High, and Auto. Black Stretch/Press – This controls the dynamic range of the low end of the exposure scale (shadows). It can be set to Middle, Stretch (which expands the dynamic range), and Press (which decreases dynamic range to intensify shadow). Master Pedestal – This is the start point of the gamma curve. It can be set to +/-9. Setup Level – This is the start of the black point, which Canon defaults to 3 IRE (what they consider the industry standard). It can be adjusted to +/-9. Your Master Pedestal setting may prevent you from setting a negative Setup level. Sharpness – Sharpness can be set from +/-9. Horizontal Detail Frequency – HDF can be set to Low, Middle, and High. Horizontal / Vertical Detail Balance – Labeled as DHV in the menu, this also has a +/-9 range. Coring – Coring, which can be set from +/-9, controls the amount of noise in detail. Noise Reduction – This is actually split into two functions, NR1 and NR2. NR1 is a standard sort of noise reduction that can be set to Low, Middle, and High. When in High, trailing often shows up in moving objects. NR2, also with Low, Middle, and High settings, Canon describes as similar to applying the Skin Detail feature to the entire image. Trailing will not occur with NR2. Color Matrix – This can also be set to Normal, Cine 1, and Cine 2. Color Gain – What was once a +/-9 range on the XL H1 has greatly expanded to +/-50 on the XH A1 for a much finer degree of control. As far as we can tell, though, the actual range has not increased. R Gain, G Gain, and B Gain – Each of the Red, Green, and Blue channels gets its own gain control, as well. Like the overall gain, each has increased the degree of control form the XL H1, and is now +/-50. 2-Channel Matrices – Each channel can be set against the other to create exact color balance to a degree of +/-50. The menu offers: red-green, red-blue, green-red, green-blue, blue-red, and blue-green. Apologies to whoever wrote that, the author got lost in the shuffle. HTH Cheers.

June 5th, 2009, 05:56 PM	#5
Philip Younger Major Player Join Date: May 2008 Location: Warwickshire Posts: 207	Thanks for the explanation, it is useful for fine tweaking

June 6th, 2009, 05:52 PM	#6
Allan Black Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Sydney. Posts: 2,887	Hi Annie and guys, I'm producing programs for the Historical Aircraft Restoration Society here. They go out on DVD and regarding the use of presets, here's where I'm at ... so far. What looks great on my Dell 2408WFP NLE monitor, doesn't always look great on my Sharp Aquos LCD TV. Even if I adjust the pix in post to look great on my Aquos, it doesn't necessarily look good on the average sampling of TV screens the product is displayed on. I archive a lot of HD footage for use later, so I can't afford to play with presets too much resulting in so much work later in post matching the scenes, it becomes a pain. When I started with CPs, I spoke, slated each shot with the CP name, so I'd get familiar with the various 'looks' out of the A1. I've found PANALOOK, (not PANALOOK 2) covers most of what I'm doing. When the scene is similar shades of eg: pastels, I use VIVIDRGB. Same when the light is low in the hangars. But the necessary requirements are always, good light and correct white balance. I use an Expodisc for WB, IMO essential for mixed lighting, and have just started using the Warm Expodisc for talking heads to cam. Within the constraints of what I'm doing CPs are a work in progress, but not too much. :) Cheers.