Any tips for panning? at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders

Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders
Canon XH G1S / G1 (with SDI), Canon XH A1S / A1 (without SDI).


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old November 29th, 2009, 01:37 PM   #1
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Warwickshire
Posts: 207
Any tips for panning?

On a recent trip I wanted to capture the wide open space by panning across the horizon at some spectacular views - not as easy as it sounds!

While shooting I was instantly aware of the fact that in panning a still view I was having problems maintaining a constant speed - much easier if you are just following a moving object!

True enough, when I got home I found that my panning got faster as I moved towards the end of my 'pan' and on a few takes (I made several takes of each scene) I actually paused somewhere in the middle!

I know a lot of this is probably experience but are there any tips on learning to maintain the panning speed?
Philip Younger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2009, 02:47 PM   #2
Major Player
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Salem, Oregon
Posts: 409
Panning and tilting with a rubber band looped around the tripod handle and your fingers is a tried-and-true trick to maintain constant speed and to ensure smooth stops. Have you tried this?

Steve
Steven Reid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 29th, 2009, 05:24 PM   #3
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sydney.
Posts: 2,569
Yep the rubber band trick works well only for static scenes. Panning manually, a lot has to do with the quality and the right amount of drag on the fluid head. I've seen many that are wrong, not enough drag. IMO if you're not sure, go to a pro shop for help with that.

The right setup is important, the comfortable length of the pan handle, using the LCD or the EVF and the cam balanced correctly on the tripod and the right height off the ground. For certain shots enabling the centre + or the grid helps.

If you've got a tripod with height this makes for fast setups; use a bubble level on a dead flat surface. Once you've got the camera level and at your right height, use a semi-permanent marker to mark the length of each of the tripod legs stages. Once you're happy with it in practise, use a permanent marker pen.

Cheers.
__________________
30+ years with our own audio and visual production company and studios.
Allan Black is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 30th, 2009, 08:58 AM   #4
Trustee
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North Conway, NH
Posts: 1,745
The rubber band trick works quite well. Also, I tend to use my whole body, not just my hand/arm to do this. It helps, but you have to plan and practice a bit to get what you want.
Tripp Woelfel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 30th, 2009, 10:01 AM   #5
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Wales
Posts: 2,130
There is a reason why some tripod heads cost 5000, it does make a difference. Most of the cheap (ie under 1000) heads are friction rather than fluid and are inevitably a little "sticky".
Other than that it's just practice.
Steve
Steve Phillipps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 30th, 2009, 03:25 PM   #6
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Sydney
Posts: 552
Totally agree with you Steve, the tripod has heaps to do with it. I use a Miller DS10 and thought that it was a pretty good tripod (which it is) however earlier in the year I used a Ronford Baker Atlas 30, not with an A1 but RED and the difference was amazing. Buy hey that's why the Ronford costs around $18K!

Other than that rubber band does work well and just lots of practice and trying with differing drag settings.
Jonathan Shaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 30th, 2009, 04:53 PM   #7
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 351
Best tip - get a Sachtler FSB video head......
Richard D. George is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2009, 01:06 AM   #8
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sydney.
Posts: 2,569
I'm using the new Miller Compass 15 head on their Solo carbon fibre sticks, excellent rig and they're still producing their DS10.

You can't track moving objects using the rubber band, it's only for panning across static scenes. So unless you've got a very basic tripod, you might as well learn how to set the whole thing up correctly and pan properly. Cheers.
__________________
30+ years with our own audio and visual production company and studios.
Allan Black is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2009, 04:35 AM   #9
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Fairfield, Dunedin, New Zealand
Posts: 3,634
Images: 18
Hi Philip..............

Not to disparage anything said before, by some eminent contributors with excellent advice (pretty well all of which I agree with) there is just one small fly in the ointment with the long slow pan/ tilt that hasn't been mentioned - muscle control.

There's a damn good reason man designed machines, because they can do things man was never designed to do, and the machines do it so well.

Your voluntary muscles are not as under your control as you might think. It is almost impossible for the average human to maintain a constant pressure against a moving object (pan handle) thus providing an even pan speed, however good the pan head might be.

[I have one of the best rigs on the market and believe you me, even I can't get it right if the pan is longer than 45 degrees, by 90 degrees I'm all over the planet and any longer then that, forget it - having said that, I just reviewed a shot of a local parade where I had to do a 180 and stuff me if for SD purposes it looked absolutely magic! ].

If you're working with a less than perfect tripod/ head setup, forget it, there is not a chance in hell you'll even get within a bulls roar of "decent".

If you've spent the bickies and got the "perfect" support system, it will get imeasureably better, but perfect is a long way off.

So, either get the best and practice till you drop OR go mechanised and let a machine do it - heck, they do just about everything else nowadays.


CS
Chris Soucy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2009, 05:16 AM   #10
New Boot
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Sutton Coldfield UK
Posts: 17
I have the Manfrotto 503 head, this gives good wide slow pans. Heres how. Have the handle extended out as far as it can go. This minimizes variations in your arm movement. The next is to have a monitor clamped to one of the tripod legs so you can see the scene. On a wide angle pan you cannot see the camera viewfinder properly. Finally, plenty of practice.

Alan in the UK
Alan R. Moore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2009, 05:34 AM   #11
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 102
I have a cheap tripod Velbon DV7000 and I try and avoid panning if possible. When I do, I try and adopt the method I was taught for hand-held panning. Position the feet and body comfortably in the position you intend stopping the pan and then twist the body around to the start position. When you unwind you are going towards a natural position rather than away from it. Seems to work for me.
Ray Barber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2009, 08:41 AM   #12
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Wheeling, IL
Posts: 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard D. George View Post
Best tip - get a Sachtler FSB video head......
Couldn't agree more.
I have two of them and they are awesome tripods...

JJ
J.J. Kim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 1st, 2009, 12:19 PM   #13
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Warwickshire
Posts: 207
Well, thanks for all the advice. to clarify I have a Libec tripod with a Libec TH-950DV fluid head, it is very nicely balanced and the fluid head is very smooth, the problem is simply me and my somewhat ambitious pans - I guess I should have stated I was doing 180 & even 360 degree pans (Oh how the scenery demanded that!!)

My most successful 360 was made by straping a 3ft length of bamboo cane to the tripod handle to extend it, make sure the tripod was on good, solid level ground, then I just walked slowly round in a circle holding the cane against my chest with no grip. It seemed the most shakey when I was doing it, but in post it was definately smooth

I'm fine doing tilts, I can adjust the pressure of the grip on the head and basically let the rear end tilt so the camera 'falls' upwards or downwards in it's own time - it works! But I really under-estimated the technique required in panning a scene.

Thinking about this a little more I think I may have just thought of a use for the old Fidelity portable record player in the attick, I think the weight of the Canon will slow the turntable speed down to a nice level...or just wait until the batteries start to fade :-)
Philip Younger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 2nd, 2009, 06:05 AM   #14
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sydney.
Posts: 2,569
Phil, ummm selecting a turntable speed, I imagine 33 1/3 rpm will be the one to use .. 45 maaaaybe with 78 for airshows. Cheers.
__________________
30+ years with our own audio and visual production company and studios.
Allan Black is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 2nd, 2009, 06:25 AM   #15
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 102
At the risk of stating the obvious, make sure image stabilisation is off.
Ray Barber is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XH Series HDV Camcorders

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:15 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network