Please...oh please have a flip function... at DVinfo.net

Brian Broz · July 26th, 2006, 02:15 PM

I'm really excited about these new cameras...the XLH1 as far as I'm concerned is the overall winner in the sub $10,000.00 cameras (I've used them all except the JVC)...but the large form factor of the XL held me back.
These new cameras are look like the perfect solution. I really hope they do include a "flip" function for the occasions when using a Redrock adaptor.
Hopefully we'll find out soon if this function is available.
And I also hope these new cameras will work with the Canon console software (it sounds like they will)!
Thank you Canon,

Brian Broz

Chris Hurd · July 26th, 2006, 02:35 PM

Good question. I saw no mention of an EVF flip feature, but things are *very* preliminary right now.

Bill Pryor · July 27th, 2006, 11:59 AM

Just for the sake of argument, assume they will have a flip function.

What, then, is the real difference between this camera and the XL-H1? Other than interchangeable lenses? Most people I know rarely change lenses on Canon XL cameras, so why get the XL over one of these? Unless you thing bigger and heavier is better.

And, if these cameras actually pump out the same quality image as the XL...why would you get a Z1?

It seems to me Canon is taking an approach unique to the industry: Give the customers something they really want and don't worry about protecting your top-of-the-line camera by dumbing down the new one. Already, I like it and it's not even out yet. And I've always been a Sony sorta guy (although I've been actively looking at the P2 thing).

Philip Williams · July 27th, 2006, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Pryor

<snip>
It seems to me Canon is taking an approach unique to the industry: Give the customers something they really want and don't worry about protecting your top-of-the-line camera by dumbing down the new one.
<snip>

Though a different class of camera, we already saw hints of this philosophy with the Optura series. We've reached the point where you can get an Optura 50 for around 400 bucks and that gets you optical image stabilization, manual audio control, focus ring, proper 16x9 and a host of other manual controls. Not one other manufacturer has packed as many features into a comparably priced camcorder, and I dare say Canon has in fact stolen GL2 sales from itself with the various Optura models.

Canon really does seem to be trying to pack as many features into their new releases as they can - and price them VERY competitively. The XHA1 has pretty much each and every feature - and then some - that users have put on their "GL3" wishlist over the last 6 months. Best of all, a lot of people speculated that a package like this would go for 5 grand, and here they come and scoot it out the door for 4K, hundreds less than the street price of a Z1 and only about a thousand more than the FX1 - which this thing leaves in the dust.

I can't wait to see the Optura HDV :)

www.philipwilliams.com

Chris Hurd · July 27th, 2006, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Broz

I also hope these new cameras will work with the Canon console software

Yes, full compatibility with Console has been assured.

Pete Bauer · July 27th, 2006, 08:14 PM

In fact, Console is being updated to v1.1 to include the XH series and adding a few minor features and fixing a timecode issue:
http://www.usa.canon.com/templatedat...oleupdate.html

Still a chunk of change at $599, though.

James Sidney · August 27th, 2006, 11:06 AM

Any word on the "flip function"?

~James (fingers crossed)

Jim OQuinn · September 8th, 2006, 04:18 PM

I second and third the "flip" function.

Peter Jefferson · September 9th, 2006, 04:26 AM

flip would defeat the purpse of the H1.... i dont see Canon compromising potential sales... then again, canon has surprised me in the past..

Barry Green · September 9th, 2006, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

flip would defeat the purpse of the H1.... i dont see Canon compromising potential sales... then again, canon has surprised me in the past..

How would it possibly defeat the purpose of the H1?

Peter Jefferson · September 9th, 2006, 11:30 PM

Hey Barry, good to see u mate.. was nice chattin to u in sydney!!

ok.. where to start... lol
OK, the H1, is for want of a better word.. overpriced... for teh format in question and the majority of its uses, most users would opt for HDV tape.. not SDI... then there are the users who dont even need SDI... so its a waste of money/resources for them...

well consider that the H1 has mountable lens options.. need a different focal range? cool. wack it on.. its a no brainer..

Now the A1 (with no lens option like the H1), would end up being the unit most event videogrpahers would go for.. same 20x optical zoom as the H1 and identical chipset... it does what they need without the bells and whisltes..

But if a flip function was offered.. it would mean those that are considering the H1 WOULDNT need to consider it. As adapting and using teh M2/redrock whatever... would be made easier... eespecially if this flip function were to be offered.. and as most mounts are canon or nikon anyway... that too plays a factor in this... Sales... i mean im sure sony would prefer to sell an H1 as opposed to an A1.. and would rather sell an official EF adapter vs losing the sale to a 3rd party like m2 or redrock or whoever...

In the end, youre adding more glass before the light even hits the CCD..
So these flip options not only compromise sales of H1 (in canons case) but also compromise image quality... and with HDV, the issue of noise within the compressed stream is a huge factor and will most likely push the HDV codec as far as it could possibly go (ie, noise before compression... then compression WITH embedded noise = more noise... as MPG2 handles noise quite badly from what ive seen so far... ...

Hope i made sense.. lol

Am i making sense?

Glenn Thomas · October 15th, 2006, 05:20 PM

Any word yet on whether or not there is a flip function included?

July 26th, 2006, 02:15 PM	#1
Brian Broz Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 61	Please...oh please have a flip function... I'm really excited about these new cameras...the XLH1 as far as I'm concerned is the overall winner in the sub $10,000.00 cameras (I've used them all except the JVC)...but the large form factor of the XL held me back. These new cameras are look like the perfect solution. I really hope they do include a "flip" function for the occasions when using a Redrock adaptor. Hopefully we'll find out soon if this function is available. And I also hope these new cameras will work with the Canon console software (it sounds like they will)! Thank you Canon, Brian Broz

July 26th, 2006, 02:35 PM	#2
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	Good question. I saw no mention of an EVF flip feature, but things are very preliminary right now. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

July 27th, 2006, 08:14 PM	#6
Pete Bauer Wrangler Join Date: May 2003 Location: Eagle River, AK Posts: 4,100	In fact, Console is being updated to v1.1 to include the XH series and adding a few minor features and fixing a timecode issue: http://www.usa.canon.com/templatedat...oleupdate.html Still a chunk of change at $599, though. __________________ Pete Bauer The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. Albert Einstein Trying to solve a DV mystery? You may find the answer behind the SEARCH function ... or be able to join a discussion already in progress!

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July 27th, 2006, 11:59 AM	#3
Bill Pryor Contributor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 4,449	Just for the sake of argument, assume they will have a flip function. What, then, is the real difference between this camera and the XL-H1? Other than interchangeable lenses? Most people I know rarely change lenses on Canon XL cameras, so why get the XL over one of these? Unless you thing bigger and heavier is better. And, if these cameras actually pump out the same quality image as the XL...why would you get a Z1? It seems to me Canon is taking an approach unique to the industry: Give the customers something they really want and don't worry about protecting your top-of-the-line camera by dumbing down the new one. Already, I like it and it's not even out yet. And I've always been a Sony sorta guy (although I've been actively looking at the P2 thing).

August 27th, 2006, 11:06 AM	#7
James Sidney Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 44	Any word on the "flip function"? ~James (fingers crossed)

September 8th, 2006, 04:18 PM	#8
Jim OQuinn Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Austin, Tejas Posts: 26	I second and third the "flip" function.

September 9th, 2006, 04:26 AM	#9
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	flip would defeat the purpse of the H1.... i dont see Canon compromising potential sales... then again, canon has surprised me in the past..

September 9th, 2006, 11:30 PM	#11
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Hey Barry, good to see u mate.. was nice chattin to u in sydney!! ok.. where to start... lol OK, the H1, is for want of a better word.. overpriced... for teh format in question and the majority of its uses, most users would opt for HDV tape.. not SDI... then there are the users who dont even need SDI... so its a waste of money/resources for them... well consider that the H1 has mountable lens options.. need a different focal range? cool. wack it on.. its a no brainer.. Now the A1 (with no lens option like the H1), would end up being the unit most event videogrpahers would go for.. same 20x optical zoom as the H1 and identical chipset... it does what they need without the bells and whisltes.. But if a flip function was offered.. it would mean those that are considering the H1 WOULDNT need to consider it. As adapting and using teh M2/redrock whatever... would be made easier... eespecially if this flip function were to be offered.. and as most mounts are canon or nikon anyway... that too plays a factor in this... Sales... i mean im sure sony would prefer to sell an H1 as opposed to an A1.. and would rather sell an official EF adapter vs losing the sale to a 3rd party like m2 or redrock or whoever... In the end, youre adding more glass before the light even hits the CCD.. So these flip options not only compromise sales of H1 (in canons case) but also compromise image quality... and with HDV, the issue of noise within the compressed stream is a huge factor and will most likely push the HDV codec as far as it could possibly go (ie, noise before compression... then compression WITH embedded noise = more noise... as MPG2 handles noise quite badly from what ive seen so far... ... Hope i made sense.. lol Am i making sense?

October 15th, 2006, 05:20 PM	#12
Glenn Thomas Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 320	Any word yet on whether or not there is a flip function included?