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Canon XL and GL Series DV Camcorders
Canon XL2 / XL1S / XL1 and GL2 / XM2 / GL1 / XM1.


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Old September 18th, 2004, 02:48 PM   #1
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30p/24p on the tape

Can anywone tell me if the 24p or 30p mode of XL2 has the same principle of the DVX100 24p/30p?:

"Progrssive CCd wich capture true progressive frame but wich record it interlaced ON THE TAPE"

Or xl2 record progressive frame ON THE TAPE?

Thanks


Best regards


Gabriele
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Old September 18th, 2004, 02:58 PM   #2
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All DV *must* be recorded as interlaced on the tape, or it wouldn't be DV.

The XL2 records on tape exactly as the DVX does.
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Old September 18th, 2004, 05:14 PM   #3
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Thanks Barry,

1) Instead the JVC HD10 (HDV Camera) in 720p mode record true progressive frame on the Tape,
right?

2) And for example:
if the FX1 (Sony HDV Camcorder)had the 24/30p function on 1440x1080i mode with the same principle of the DVX100 and XL2 :"capture 24p and record in interlaced mode"

that mode it could be called 1080i .............or 1080p?


3) Sony Cinealta capture in 24p but record in interlaced 1080i .....right?

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Gabriele
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Old September 18th, 2004, 09:10 PM   #4
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Quote:
Instead the JVC HD10 (HDV Camera) in 720p mode record true progressive frame on the Tape, right?
Yes. The HD10 can record true progressive on tape because it's not a DV camera. When in DV mode it records interlaced, but when in high-def mode it's free to record progressive to tape.
Quote:
if the FX1 (Sony HDV Camcorder)had the 24/30p function on 1440x1080i mode with the same principle of the DVX100 and XL2 :"capture 24p and record in interlaced mode"

that mode it could be called 1080i .............or 1080p?
From all reports, the Sony doesn't have any sort of progressive-scan mode on its CCD. The CineFrame 24 and CineFrame 30 are apparently digital interpretations of interlaced footage. There is no provision in HDV for 1080p, so no, there won't be any storing of progressive frames on HDV in the 1080 mode. Only 720p is supported in the HDV specification.
Quote:
Sony Cinealta capture in 24p but record in interlaced 1080i .....right?
From my understanding, yes. They call it 24PsF, and the "sF" stands for "segmented frame", meaning that it's actually a progressive frame but is recorded on tape as "segments" (or, in other words, fields).
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Old September 19th, 2004, 05:09 AM   #5
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Thanks Barry

For the FX1 question:
i know that the FX1 can't capture progressive video becouse don't have progressive scan ccd ,
and i know that the specific of HDV are:
720p
and 1080i

But you think it will be possible that the next camcorder(Canon ecc....)can capture 24p frame at 1080i resolution?
Like Cinealta 24pSf?
It will be 1080i and not 1080p right?and 1080i is on the specific of HDV

Or we can only(for the moment)have 24//25/30p only for DV and for HDV but at 720 lines?


Thank you very much


Best regards


Gabriele
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Old September 19th, 2004, 03:10 PM   #6
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I think there is a little bit of a misunderstanding going on with the f900 (cinealta) It does record 1080 PsF but it is only so that it cna process the information, if you were to make it interlaced it would be 1080 PsF at 48i. Because the fields are split. SO when you say 1080i It's not really 1080i (like what you could watch on a HDTV at Best Buy) It is 1080P split into two fields (I believe literally and upper and lower field) or segmented frame, top and bottom not even and odd.

The other important distinction to make is that unlike a varicam or a DV cam when you swap the frame rates of an f900 you are actually altering the information that is put on tape. (I.E. at 24p you'll have more tape then at 59.94)

So when you say 24p at 1080i you are kind of contradicting yourself, if it was 1080i it would not be 24p I do not think the sony nor the next camera (whatever that ends up being) will release a 1080 24p option. I think for the consumer market something like that is still 3-5 years away.

I hope that made since.
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Old September 20th, 2004, 07:51 AM   #7
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The answer to Gabrieles question, if 24p can be recorded to 1080i HDV: yes it is technically possible. Just like on the DVX and XL2 you can represent progressive material as interlaced. So it would be possible to manufacture a camera that would have progressive CCDs, and write those progressive frames to a 1080i signal. For the progressive look, it doesn't matter how the data is laid on tape. The only thing that matters, is when the frame is being recorded, do the fields have a time difference or not. If there's a time difference in fields (half frames), the material looks interlaced on an interlaced monitor. If there is no time difference, you have captured a full frame, and it will look progressive on any monitor.

But as Nick said, it isn't likely that they will be making this kind of camera in years.
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Old September 20th, 2004, 09:47 AM   #8
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Me too i think is possible have 1080i 24p HDV
And i Really Really Really Really Hope that this kind of Camcorder it will be disponible very very soon (on prosumer level 5K dollars),

maybe Canon ....................


Regards


Gabriele
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