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Canon XL and GL Series DV Camcorders
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Old October 16th, 2004, 06:02 PM   #1
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XL2 Prosumer or Professional?

Just out of curiosity, how exactly is this camera being classed?

With the news that the BBC are interested in the XL2, and with its ability to produce true 16:9, do you think its still prosumer?
I believe that the DVX100a is classed as a professional camera, so why shouldn’t this?

Please forgive my ignorance if this has been previously discussed.
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Old October 16th, 2004, 06:40 PM   #2
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You say tomatoe I say toMAHtoe...

Don't sweat the labels, it's just a marketing ploy. PROSUMER is a label that means, more than mom and dad need to catch juniors birthday party, and less than you need to shoot Beta for broadcast. In terms of subject matter, I've seen plenty of "professional" work done on xl1, pd150's, dvx100, so don't be too concerned with the label. My guess is the prosumer label is going to be slapped on any camera thats.... say, sub 10 grand. (US dollars) but more than three grand.
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Old October 16th, 2004, 07:19 PM   #3
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That's a pretty good assessment. The XL2 comes from the Video Division of Canon's Consumer Imaging Group, and it's from the same department that offers you their $350 camcorder, the ZR80. It's an entirely different part of Canon than their Broadcast Video Lens division. How it's used though is what really counts. Suffice to say that the majority of XL2 owners will employ this camera in a professional capacity.
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Old October 17th, 2004, 04:21 PM   #4
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Thanks guys.

Here in the UK were swamped with stuff from the beeb that’s shot on PD150's

I wonder how the industry will adopt this new cammy.

Is its 4:3 any better than the 150's in resolution terms?
Not aesthetically, or we will be here for the rest of the year.
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Old October 18th, 2004, 03:26 PM   #5
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The XL2 uses only a portion of the chip for 4:3, so my guess (a guess only) is that the picture will probably be softer than the PD150's. In 16:9 it should be better.

As far as "prosumer" / professional...what we really need is a better word than "prosumer." My definition (and this is my opinion only) is that a professional camera has a "real" lens (ie., complete mechanical control of iris and focus, not those pesky infinitely spinning rings that are really electronic), a viewfinder that gives you underscan, XLR audio inputs with mic/line levels in and normal switches for bars, audio channel, etc., on the side instead of buried in menus . So, with my definition, you have to get up into a 1/2" chip camera to get a "professional" one.

However, that doesn't mean that professionals don't shoot professional stuff with all of the "prosumer" cameras. Movies are made every day using them, and corporate videos and TV news featues and documentaries are shot every day with them. You have to learn to work within their limitations. There are times when the smaller, lighter camera is the best tool for the job even though a fully professional camera may be easier to use and provide a higher quality image. How the camera may be classified for marketing is not really relevant (although Sony accurately classifies their new HDV FX1 as a consumer camera--no XLRs, and I understand you can't even separate audio into separate channels, which makes it mostly worthless for lots of sound recording).
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Old October 18th, 2004, 03:34 PM   #6
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I guess the real answer, lies in how you use it... If you are shooting news, movies, or just getting paid in general, it is a pro cam. If you just shoot the kids on vacation, prosumer.

Of course, I really liked Bill's answer!
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Old October 18th, 2004, 03:49 PM   #7
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Actually, if you were just shooting kids on vacation, you'd just be a plain vanilla "consumer". "Prosumer" would be more reserved for hobbyists or other enthusiasts.

I look at the words Consumer, Prosumer or Professional as more adjectives to describe who's using the cam, not the cam itself. After all, a Prosumer cam of today takes better quality footage than many Professional cameras of years back. Thus making cameras 'status' relative. But if you use the words to define the user of the camera instead, it makes it more of a stable definition.

Therefore, the XL2 is a lower grade professional camera that is priced to attract both prosumers and professionals alike. Lets face it, what the heck would a mom be doing with XLR inputs and 24p when shooting junior take his first poop on the toilet.
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Old October 18th, 2004, 04:05 PM   #8
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How elegantly put, Imran. lol
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Old October 18th, 2004, 04:13 PM   #9
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"Lets face it, what the heck would a mom be doing with XLR inputs and 24p when shooting junior take his first poop on the toilet."

A new reality show for Fox?
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Old October 19th, 2004, 01:46 AM   #10
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Well it better be pro cause I'm shooting $15000 plus worth of infomercial on it next month.

I'd say this is a camera aimed squarely at the Pro's.


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Old October 19th, 2004, 08:29 AM   #11
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It is what you make it -- or maybe better to say it is how you use it.
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Old October 19th, 2004, 11:48 PM   #12
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if murdoch saw that line he'd probably say, "hmmm, GOOD IDEA! when do we start?"

<<<-- Originally posted by Keith Forman : "Lets face it, what the heck would a mom be doing with XLR inputs and 24p when shooting junior take his first poop on the toilet."

A new reality show for Fox? -->>>
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Old October 20th, 2004, 01:58 AM   #13
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<<<-- Originally posted by Keith Forman : "Lets face it, what the heck would a mom be doing with XLR inputs and 24p when shooting junior take his first poop on the toilet."

A new reality show for Fox? -->>>

You all laugh at this but I do use it for around the house video of my 3 year old daughter. I also use it full time for my job and on the side for independent films. But once you get addicted to the higher quality images....it is hard to shoot even home video type stuff with a lesser cam. Add to that I am totally addicted to progressive 24 FPS video now (since DVX)....I can't even look at 60i and not think it looks "videoish". Heck...I even shoot in 16x9 and I don't have a 16x9 tv yet. But I keep thinking that down the road when I have a 16x9 TV I Can watch these old home movies and not have the black bars on the sides! Woo Hoo!

So it does get used in many ways..in fact...I should be the poster boy for the "consumer-prosumer-professional" tag line.

Corporate Video 9-5
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