XLR Gainup not working at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XL H Series HDV Camcorders

Canon XL H Series HDV Camcorders
Canon XL H1S (with SDI), Canon XL H1A (without SDI). Also XL H1.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old September 18th, 2007, 10:22 AM   #1
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 402
XLR Gainup not working

I had my first day of shooting on a documentary today. The first day with the camera as well and everything was working fine except the AUDIO SETUP meny.
My sound man wanted to gainup 12db and I went into the Audio menu, but the option R-XLR GAINUP was in grey letters and could not be accessed. I tried to call Canon, but they had to come back to me as they rep didnīt know much.
Anyone here have a clue?

I was in manual mode.

Joachim
Joachim Hoge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2007, 01:56 PM   #2
Trustee
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Oppland, Norway
Posts: 1,394
Joachim,
check the following:

-set the +48V phantom switch to ON if the mic support phantom power
-set the MIC/ATT switch to ATT
-IMPORTANT! check that the LINE/MIC switch is set to MIC !!
Then try to change the setting in the menu to 12db

I don't have the camcorder present, so I can not check this but try what I'm suggesting.
__________________
- Per Johan
Per Johan Naesje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2007, 02:02 PM   #3
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 949
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joachim Hoge View Post
I had my first day of shooting on a documentary today. The first day with the camera as well and everything was working fine except the AUDIO SETUP meny.
My sound man wanted to gainup 12db and I went into the Audio menu, but the option R-XLR GAINUP was in grey letters and could not be accessed. I tried to call Canon, but they had to come back to me as they rep didnīt know much.
Anyone here have a clue?
The XLR gain up only works on mic-in sources. The problem you're experiencing has been discussed before:

http://dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=91427

Essentially, the A1 is spec'd for +8dBu line in, when 0 or 4 is normal for professional gear.
Daniel Browning is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2007, 03:12 PM   #4
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 402
Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Johan Naesje View Post
Joachim,
check the following:

-set the +48V phantom switch to ON if the mic support phantom power
-set the MIC/ATT switch to ATT
-IMPORTANT! check that the LINE/MIC switch is set to MIC !!
Then try to change the setting in the menu to 12db

I don't have the camcorder present, so I can not check this but try what I'm suggesting.
Takk Johan.
It solved the problem and created a new one.
The mixer (Soundevices) we used only had line, not mic. This is quite common.
This is a big drawback with the camera as far as I can see. We will get a mixer with mic and line next time, but not all soundmen have that.
I donīt understand why it canīt be done in line mode.
One do all the research, all the reading, but some aspects/drawbacks you really never find out about until you are out in the field
Joachim Hoge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2007, 06:09 AM   #5
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Augusta Georgia
Posts: 5,413
Which Sound Devices mixer are you using?

You may be able to adjust the output level of the mixer.
__________________
Dan Keaton
Augusta Georgia
Dan Keaton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2007, 07:01 AM   #6
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Augusta Georgia
Posts: 5,413
The Mix Pre has line level outputs, but can be easily attenuated to mic level using special cables or attenuators.

The Sound Devices 302 mixer has active-balanced line/tape/mic level outputs on XLR connectors.

The Sound Devices 442 has transformer-balanced line/tape/mic level output on XLR connectors .
__________________
Dan Keaton
Augusta Georgia
Dan Keaton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2007, 02:55 PM   #7
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 402
Hi Dan.
Thanks for your replies.
Iīm not sure what model we used. I do know that they will bring a model with both line and mic next time. We managed to get good sound, just a little low levels. I think he turned off the limiter to get some extra level.
It wonīt be a problem next time, but itīs something I have to tell sound men about before we shoot. Itīs not a problem if we are renting gear, but quite a few of them have their own gear.

From your post it seemīs like a good idea for me to buy a set of cables that can attenuate the line level that I can have in my kit.
Do you know what kind of cables that would be?
Joachim Hoge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2007, 05:53 PM   #8
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Augusta Georgia
Posts: 5,413
I would buy two xlr attenuators, made by Shure.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...ttenuator.html
__________________
Dan Keaton
Augusta Georgia
Dan Keaton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2007, 02:53 AM   #9
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 402
Thanks for the link Dan, much appreciated. (Finally an accessory thatīs not expensive ;-))
Joachim Hoge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2007, 06:04 AM   #10
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Augusta Georgia
Posts: 5,413
Dear Joachim,

You're welcome.

I am about to order two of these myself.

Dan
__________________
Dan Keaton
Augusta Georgia
Dan Keaton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 24th, 2007, 03:34 AM   #11
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 402
Hi Dan
I talked to a sales rep here in Norway and he told me that these Shure attunators would not do what I need them to do. He said that to obtain gain I needed a mixer or amplifier of some sort.
Is this right you think?
Joachim Hoge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 24th, 2007, 08:10 AM   #12
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Augusta Georgia
Posts: 5,413
Dear Joachim,

Sorry, but I feel that he is wrong, in this specific case.

Yes, it is impossible to use attenuators to obtain gain.

But, in your case, you need to reduce line level to mic level in order to use the "Gain Up" feature of your camera. As such, attenuators are what you need.

Then, once your inputs are attenuated from line level to mic level, and you have the camera set to "Mic", then you can use the "Gain Up" feature.
__________________
Dan Keaton
Augusta Georgia

Last edited by Dan Keaton; September 24th, 2007 at 12:28 PM.
Dan Keaton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 24th, 2007, 12:20 PM   #13
Major Player
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 402
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Keaton View Post
Dear Joachim,

Sorry, but I feel that he is wrong, in this specific case.

Yes, it is impossible to use attenuators to obtain gain.

But, in your case, you need to reduce line level to mic level in order to use the "Gain Up" feature of your camera. As such, attenuators are what you need.

Then, once your inputs are at line level, and you have the camera set to "Mic", then you can use the "Gain Up" feature.
Thanks again Dan. I see how this works out now. Iīll call back tomorrow to place an order.
Joachim Hoge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 26th, 2007, 03:48 PM   #14
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Vittsjö, SKÅNE, SWEDEN
Posts: 266
Gainup

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Keaton View Post
Then, once your inputs are attenuated from line level to mic level, and you have the camera set to "Mic", then you can use the "Gain Up" feature.
Hi,
You better get or make attenuators with correct levels so you don't need to use the "Gain Up" if you don't want even more noise. The attenuators are there to decrease the level from the mixer's line level (which unfortunately is too weak for the line input at the Canon) to a weak level which your mic input can handle at the camcorder. Don't attenuate it so much so you have to amplify it even more. Good luck!
Johan Forssblad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 27th, 2007, 08:03 AM   #15
Inner Circle
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Augusta Georgia
Posts: 5,413
The attenuators that I recommended have three levels of attenuation.

So, if desired, one channel could be attenuated more than the other, simulating a "Gain Up".
__________________
Dan Keaton
Augusta Georgia
Dan Keaton is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Canon EOS / MXF / AVCHD / HDV / DV Camera Systems > Canon HDV and DV Camera Systems > Canon XL H Series HDV Camcorders

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:01 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network