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-   Canon XL H Series HDV Camcorders (http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-xl-h-series-hdv-camcorders/)
-   -   XL-HI 24f BIGSCREEN footage at Resfest (http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-xl-h-series-hdv-camcorders/52108-xl-hi-24f-bigscreen-footage-resfest.html)

Eric Brown October 2nd, 2005 04:04 PM

XL-HI 24f BIGSCREEN footage at Resfest
 
I just got back from the Resfest seminar: Beyond DV - HD and the future of indie filmmaking.
They discussed the attributes of the Z1 and A1, the JVC, the Canon and the Panasonic.
Most interesting was the footage shown, however, as I have been dying to see something up on the big screen and not compressed into a little quicktime or wav file.
Personally, I thought Canon's 24f looks every bit as rich and smooth as 24p.
They shot some really nice footage in a country side setting with a gentleman on a bike and if this is the type of image you can get from 24f, my fears have been put to rest.
This is a personal opinion, though. Some of you may have been in the audience with me and had a more critical eye.
One guy even mentioned judder which I saw as well but the Canon rep said that the effect was not necessarily attributable to the camera, or at least in terms of contributing to the severity of the judder. (which wasn't all that severe).
This effect is inherent in 24p as well when the camera is panned too quickly.
There seemed to be a little clipping of highlight here and there, nothing significant that would turn me off.
All and all I was very impressed and have even actually begun to consider purchasing the camera sometime in the future.
They only showed the Panny in 1080i mode as its 24p is, unlike the Canon, apparently not functioning on the prototype model
Was anyone else there today to see this?

Betsy Moore October 4th, 2005 12:07 PM

Great info:) I'm still a little wary of the 24F effect but it's good to see a good review of it. Strange that the Panny is taking so long to be operational. Remember they first implied it was going to come out mid-year, then October, then Novemeber, then December--wonder if they're running into bigger problems than they thought they would.

Bruce Linden October 4th, 2005 12:38 PM

I used to be in Pro Video sales and Panasonic was one of our lines. A problem we had with Panasonic was that they didn't ship and/or manufacture until they had enough orders to make it worthwhile. A Panasonic executive explained to me that Panasonic USA is really just a warehouse and they do not want to look bad back in Japan by having too much stock. So they would under order and back order until they could get a full shipment.

So it may be technical problems or just waiting for orders.

Nate Weaver October 4th, 2005 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betsy Moore
Great info:) I'm still a little wary of the 24F effect but it's good to see a good review of it. Strange that the Panny is taking so long to be operational. Remember they first implied it was going to come out mid-year, then October, then Novemeber, then December--wonder if they're running into bigger problems than they thought they would.

I don't remember anybody ever saying mid-year about the Panasonic, and especially not Jan Crittenden. It's always been November with Panasonic.

I think you're mistaking the Panasonic for the JVC...the JVC got bumped 2 months...but it's shipping now.

Betsy Moore October 4th, 2005 01:19 PM

Especially Jan Crittenden, last March or so... saying it wouldn't quite be ready in time to shoot the last of the winter/spring snow but soon after that so hold off and don't buy the Sony FX1.

Barry Green October 4th, 2005 01:35 PM

Panasonic has never said anything earlier than "4Q 2005", have they?

Chris Hurd October 4th, 2005 02:10 PM

Er... that's probably best expressed as "Q4 2005," and yes that's always been the target date. I've never known Panasonic not to deliver when they said they would.

Chris Hurd October 4th, 2005 02:11 PM

Speaking of ResFest, here's the info about this travelling tour:

http://www.resfest.com/

Eric Brown October 4th, 2005 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betsy Moore
Great info:) I'm still a little wary of the 24F effect but it's good to see a good review of it. Strange that the Panny is taking so long to be operational. Remember they first implied it was going to come out mid-year, then October, then Novemeber, then December--wonder if they're running into bigger problems than they thought they would.



Yes, it would have been nice to see what the Panasomic could have done in its 24p mode. But, without having even seen it, I'll go out on a short limb and say it's going to be gorgeous.
Not terribly prophetic, I guess, considering who makes the camera.

Tom Roper October 4th, 2005 06:04 PM

Until it goes on sale, the HVX will remain the holy grail but will it ply its many trades with equal aplomb?

A concern I would have with it is if it shoots better video in 1080i60 than it does in 720p60, would I still want to?

It seems unforgivable for a prosumer HD cam to forsake HDV tape recording. To me that makes the HVX a purely *PRO* cam, but I need HDV. I think the XL H1 could more than offset the lack of 720p and P2 cards with an effective mpeg2 encoder for HDV, a best in class image stabilization system, and a telephoto zoom lens that gets you closer to the action.

I would prefer to have it at the pricepoint of the Z1U...sigh.

Eric Brown October 4th, 2005 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Roper
Until it goes on sale, the HVX will remain the holy grail but will it ply its many trades with equal aplomb?

A concern I would have with it is if it shoots better video in 1080i60 than it does in 720p60, would I still want to?

unforgivable for a prosumer HD cam to forsake HDV tape recording. To me that makes the HVX a purely *PRO* cam, but I need HDV. I think the XL H1 could more than offset the lack of 720p and P2 cards with an effective mpeg2 encoder for HDV, a best in class image stabilization system, and a telephoto zoom lens that gets you closer to the action.

I would prefer to have it at the pricepoint of the Z1U...sigh.

It seems for many of us that no one camera has everything we want (unless of course it costs 65,000.00 and up). But when you bring this type of technology in at this price point (the 10k and under club I guess it's called) compromises have to be made.
Once in a while I'll hear someone say we should be grateful, that these are exciting times to be in for an indie filmmaker and or videographer.
I'll stick with that wonderful truth and be grateful I can even afford a good, solid SD camera like my XL2 to realize my ideas with.

Lawrence Bansbach October 5th, 2005 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric Brown
It seems for many of us that no one camera has everything we want (unless of course it costs 65,000.00 and up).

Even the high-end cameras are less than ideal. Varicam has multiple frame rates, but a resolution of only 960 x 720 and color sampling of only 4:2:2. HDCAM SR, which costs nearly twice as much, has higher res and supports 4:4:4 color, but lacks variable frame rates. No camera will ever be perceived as having everything one could want, especially if it costs $65,000 and up.

Jean-Philippe Archibald October 5th, 2005 08:18 AM

There is no perfect camera... no one is sold with a good story...

Stephen van Vuuren October 5th, 2005 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean-Philippe Archibald
There is no perfect camera... no one is sold with a good story...

But think how much money Canon could make on the "XL H1 Lethal Weapon 9 script Bundle" :)

Eric Brown October 5th, 2005 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lawrence Bansbach
Even the high-end cameras are less than ideal. Varicam has multiple frame rates, but a resolution of only 960 x 720 and color sampling of only 4:2:2. HDCAM SR, which costs nearly twice as much, has higher res and supports 4:4:4 color, but lacks variable frame rates. No camera will ever be perceived as having everything one could want, especially if it costs $65,000 and up.


Lawrence, guess I should have spoken for myself on that one. I would be very satisfied with the Varicam, personally.
I'm just happy to be making stuff.


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