Final Cut Pro - Now much closer to 24F support at DVinfo.net

Colin McFadden · June 22nd, 2006, 09:02 AM

The ProApps update that shipped last night added support for 1080p24 HDV within Quicktime. (You need Final Cut Pro 5.1.1 for the update)

You can now use MPEGStreamclip to turn your 24F m2t files in to 24F HDV files and then edit them in a native 24P timeline within FCP. The only thing that's missing now is capture support for the 24F format within FCP. Hopefully this ProApps update is a precursor of things to come.

I've got more indepth info plus a screengrab on my blog at:
http://www.discretecosine.com

Dave Perry · June 22nd, 2006, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colin McFadden

(You need Final Cut Pro 5.1.1 for the update)

Actually Colin, it works with FCP 5.0.4 as well. That's what I run and just installed the updates tonight.

Steve Rosen · June 23rd, 2006, 09:36 AM

Where did you find the ProApps update? It doesn't show up on Software Update and all I can find at Apple is 5.1.1 and Crossgrade for Studio.

Ron Pfister · June 23rd, 2006, 12:58 PM

Steve, VersionTracker is always a good place to check for such things. Here's the link to the VT Pro-Apps Update page:

http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/24273

HTH,

Ron

Ed Moore · June 28th, 2006, 02:01 AM

Thought some in this forum might find this news helpful!

http://www.hdforindies.com/2006/06/f...hdv-codec.html

Chris Hurd · June 28th, 2006, 06:33 AM

Mike was a little late in blogging that -- we've already reported it here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=70032

Ed Moore · June 28th, 2006, 12:42 PM

Whoopsie... :)

Chris Hurd · June 28th, 2006, 11:56 PM

No biggie, Ed -- but just to keep it all together, I've merged your thread with the original one from Colin.

Meanwhile, Mike reports that this is closer to Canon Frame mode support, but not quite there yet...

From HD For Indies: "NO Canon 24F or JVC 24p support at this time, they're working on it."

Mike Curtis · June 29th, 2006, 09:05 AM

So Collin - you're saying the MPEG2StreamClip can work with Canon 24F, and you just write'em out as the 1080p24 HDV format? But is that re-encoding them, or just re-wrapping them?

In other words, are the pixels exactly the same as they were on the tape, or is this MPEG-2 recompressed as MPEG-2 yet again? I'd hate to recompress my files...

Anybody do any testing on this? Anybody try an After Effects Difference filter on files converted to uncompressed 8 bit 4:2:2 Apple codec and 1080p24 HDV?

Colin McFadden · June 29th, 2006, 09:58 AM

I believe the files are still being reencoded, so as I say, it's not the ultimate solution - just a lot closer than before, especially for folks who don't have the option of coming in over HDSDI. Now that FCP can edit the 24p HDV, we just need a way to get footage in as QT HDV instead of M2T. So, either Focus needs to ship their FS4Pro update (April? May? June? ...) or FCP needs to get the ability to capture the footage.

Barlow Elton · June 29th, 2006, 11:01 AM

You just demux through Streamclip to a 24p .m2v file. FCP should work with it that way. At some point if you want to go back to tape you will have to change the footage to 24p over 60i (pulldown) in order to dump back out to HDV. This would likely cause a re-render and degrade the footage even more.

This is why I think of HDV as acquisition-only. It re-encodes much better as h.264 for HD DVD in my experiences.

This is also why I'm trying to make my G5 case totally self-contained and portable with an LCD monitor/keyboard/mouse mounted inside the case for reasonable portability. I want that SDI more than ever. :)

HDV should come with a "handle with care" stamp. It has to be treated VERY carefully in post.

Mike Curtis · June 29th, 2006, 11:19 AM

Colin -

it's just a waiting game for 24F support. The interesting thing is that Apple is just eeking this out as the get done in minor revs (witness 5.1.1). I think Apple is going to hit us with something BIG at NAB next year (outside chance at IBC?) since this year was pretty damn flat in terms of software progress (since they'd already shipped 5.1).

The rep said they're testing it, and they showed it at NAB, so I'm guessing we'd see 5.1.2 in the next few weeks or a month. Which is first? JVC or Canon? No idea, maybe both.

-mike of hdforindies.com

Colin McFadden · June 29th, 2006, 12:18 PM

Mostly just annoying since the Apple guys in the booth at NAB made it sound like it was shipping a lot sooner. I know they don't officially know anything, but I heard from more than a few to expect an update within a week of the show. Oh well, at least I'm used to the Apple approach to updates. I'm more disappointed in Focus, for being so silent about their update to support QT HDV - the most recent timeframe I heard was mid-June, but obviously that hasn't happened...

Steve Connor · June 29th, 2006, 12:27 PM

How hard can it be surely it's just another codec!? Plus the fact that they'll probably only add 24p and completely ignore the world outside of the USA

June 22nd, 2006, 09:02 AM	#1
Colin McFadden Sponsor: divergent media Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: St. Paul, MN Posts: 201	Final Cut Pro - Now much closer to 24F support The ProApps update that shipped last night added support for 1080p24 HDV within Quicktime. (You need Final Cut Pro 5.1.1 for the update) You can now use MPEGStreamclip to turn your 24F m2t files in to 24F HDV files and then edit them in a native 24P timeline within FCP. The only thing that's missing now is capture support for the 24F format within FCP. Hopefully this ProApps update is a precursor of things to come. I've got more indepth info plus a screengrab on my blog at: http://www.discretecosine.com __________________ Divergent Media Support www.divergentmedia.com

June 23rd, 2006, 12:58 PM	#4
Ron Pfister Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Basel area, Switzerland Posts: 285	Steve, VersionTracker is always a good place to check for such things. Here's the link to the VT Pro-Apps Update page: http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/24273 HTH, Ron __________________ Ronald P. Pfister halimedia - digital solutions and services www.halimedia.com

June 28th, 2006, 02:01 AM	#5
Ed Moore Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Birmingham, UK Posts: 35	Latest FCP update includes 1080p24 support Thought some in this forum might find this news helpful! http://www.hdforindies.com/2006/06/f...hdv-codec.html __________________ - Ed Moore DP

June 28th, 2006, 06:33 AM	#6
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	Mike was a little late in blogging that -- we've already reported it here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=70032 __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

June 28th, 2006, 12:42 PM	#7
Ed Moore Regular Crew Join Date: May 2006 Location: Birmingham, UK Posts: 35	Whoopsie... :) __________________ - Ed Moore DP

June 23rd, 2006, 09:36 AM	#3
Steve Rosen Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Monterey, California Posts: 895	Where did you find the ProApps update? It doesn't show up on Software Update and all I can find at Apple is 5.1.1 and Crossgrade for Studio.

June 28th, 2006, 11:56 PM	#8
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	No biggie, Ed -- but just to keep it all together, I've merged your thread with the original one from Colin. Meanwhile, Mike reports that this is closer to Canon Frame mode support, but not quite there yet... From HD For Indies: "NO Canon 24F or JVC 24p support at this time, they're working on it." __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

June 29th, 2006, 09:05 AM	#9
Mike Curtis HD for Indies Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: United States Posts: 87	clarification on workflow So Collin - you're saying the MPEG2StreamClip can work with Canon 24F, and you just write'em out as the 1080p24 HDV format? But is that re-encoding them, or just re-wrapping them? In other words, are the pixels exactly the same as they were on the tape, or is this MPEG-2 recompressed as MPEG-2 yet again? I'd hate to recompress my files... Anybody do any testing on this? Anybody try an After Effects Difference filter on files converted to uncompressed 8 bit 4:2:2 Apple codec and 1080p24 HDV? __________________ Mike Curtis HD For Indies - Hi Def Filmmaking & Post for Independent Filmmakers http://www.hdforindies.com mike@hdforindies.com

June 29th, 2006, 09:58 AM	#10
Colin McFadden Sponsor: divergent media Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: St. Paul, MN Posts: 201	I believe the files are still being reencoded, so as I say, it's not the ultimate solution - just a lot closer than before, especially for folks who don't have the option of coming in over HDSDI. Now that FCP can edit the 24p HDV, we just need a way to get footage in as QT HDV instead of M2T. So, either Focus needs to ship their FS4Pro update (April? May? June? ...) or FCP needs to get the ability to capture the footage. __________________ Divergent Media Support www.divergentmedia.com

June 29th, 2006, 11:01 AM	#11
Barlow Elton Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UT Posts: 945	You just demux through Streamclip to a 24p .m2v file. FCP should work with it that way. At some point if you want to go back to tape you will have to change the footage to 24p over 60i (pulldown) in order to dump back out to HDV. This would likely cause a re-render and degrade the footage even more. This is why I think of HDV as acquisition-only. It re-encodes much better as h.264 for HD DVD in my experiences. This is also why I'm trying to make my G5 case totally self-contained and portable with an LCD monitor/keyboard/mouse mounted inside the case for reasonable portability. I want that SDI more than ever. :) HDV should come with a "handle with care" stamp. It has to be treated VERY carefully in post.

June 29th, 2006, 11:19 AM	#12
Mike Curtis HD for Indies Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: United States Posts: 87	more on workflow Colin - it's just a waiting game for 24F support. The interesting thing is that Apple is just eeking this out as the get done in minor revs (witness 5.1.1). I think Apple is going to hit us with something BIG at NAB next year (outside chance at IBC?) since this year was pretty damn flat in terms of software progress (since they'd already shipped 5.1). The rep said they're testing it, and they showed it at NAB, so I'm guessing we'd see 5.1.2 in the next few weeks or a month. Which is first? JVC or Canon? No idea, maybe both. -mike of hdforindies.com __________________ Mike Curtis HD For Indies - Hi Def Filmmaking & Post for Independent Filmmakers http://www.hdforindies.com mike@hdforindies.com

June 29th, 2006, 12:18 PM	#13
Colin McFadden Sponsor: divergent media Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: St. Paul, MN Posts: 201	Mostly just annoying since the Apple guys in the booth at NAB made it sound like it was shipping a lot sooner. I know they don't officially know anything, but I heard from more than a few to expect an update within a week of the show. Oh well, at least I'm used to the Apple approach to updates. I'm more disappointed in Focus, for being so silent about their update to support QT HDV - the most recent timeframe I heard was mid-June, but obviously that hasn't happened... __________________ Divergent Media Support www.divergentmedia.com

June 29th, 2006, 12:27 PM	#14
Steve Connor Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UK Posts: 383	How hard can it be surely it's just another codec!? Plus the fact that they'll probably only add 24p and completely ignore the world outside of the USA