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Old August 25th, 2004, 02:04 PM   #1
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drop frame vs non-drop frame

I recently directed a concert with seven Xl's and four Panny dvx's. In post, I have had trouble with the fact that Xl's are drop frame, and Panny 24p's are non-drop. Avid won't allow multicamera grouping with non-drop and drop footage.

Any way to change the cameras to record either?

I know that I can dubb the minority format to new tapes, but, barring that, any suggestions?
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Old August 25th, 2004, 11:49 PM   #2
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I'm surprised it isn't drop frame in 24p mode. Since DVD's in 24p
are drop frame. They actually have 23.976 fps for that format.

If I start Vegas 5 on my machine and choose the "NTSC DV 24p"
it is *ONLY* availalble with "720x480; 23.976 fps". After selecting
the preset the framerate selector shows "23.976 (IVTC Film)"
which is what I'm expecting.

I'm pretty sure your panny's are drop-frame and not non-drop
so you should change your AVID project to that. Ofcourse the
best thing you could've done was to record in 30 fps progressive
(or 29.97 to be exact) and have the Canon's in frame mode.
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Old August 31st, 2004, 10:03 AM   #3
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<<<-- Originally posted by Rob Lohman :

I'm pretty sure your panny's are drop-frame and not non-drop
so you should change your AVID project to that. Ofcourse the
best thing you could've done was to record in 30 fps progressive
(or 29.97 to be exact) and have the Canon's in frame mode. -->>>

Hi Rob,

In the 24P or 24PA mode the DVX100 will only record Non-Drop Frame time code. No choices on this.

Hope this helps,

Jan
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Old August 31st, 2004, 10:05 AM   #4
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Okay, so how does this work with Vegas if it defaults to drop frame?
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Old August 31st, 2004, 10:10 AM   #5
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<<<-- Originally posted by Rob Lohman : Okay, so how does this work with Vegas if it defaults to drop frame? -->>>

You might want to check with Vegas, because the camera will only record Non-Drop Frame in the 24P modes.

Best,

Jan
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Old August 31st, 2004, 10:43 AM   #6
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Thanks, Jan. Just as an aside, the XL2 works the same way.
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Old August 31st, 2004, 11:13 AM   #7
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<<<-- Originally posted by Chris Hurd : Thanks, Jan. Just as an aside, the XL2 works the same way. -->>>

I would have guessed that it would be because when the pulldown is done, how would you deal with the drop frame?

Thanks Chris,

Jan
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Old September 1st, 2004, 03:14 AM   #8
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Jan you probably know a lot more about pulldown and drop versus
non-drop then me. Probably also due to the fact we don't have
any of that overhere in Europe. However, the normal DV standard
for NTSC is drop frame, right? So I'd assume if you pulldown 24p
footage to 30p (or 29.97 fps) the resulting footage would be
drop frame. So why is this not the case? I'm trying to learn why
this is not the case, so any information and explenation would
be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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Old September 1st, 2004, 05:14 AM   #9
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<<<-- Originally posted by Rob Lohman : Jan you probably know a lot more about pulldown and drop versus
non-drop then me. Probably also due to the fact we don't have
any of that overhere in Europe. However, the normal DV standard
for NTSC is drop frame, right? So I'd assume if you pulldown 24p
footage to 30p (or 29.97 fps) the resulting footage would be
drop frame. So why is this not the case? I'm trying to learn why
this is not the case, so any information and explenation would
be greatly appreciated. Thanks. -->>>

Yes, in DV world the normal TC is Drop frame due to the 29.97 reality. However, when it comes to having a time code that the numbers and flags for the A frames are predictable in combination with 2 different pulldown methods, the easier combination for this little feat is non-drop.

Hope that helps,

Jan
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